# Brand new, need some advice (the more I read, the less sure I am).



## CJB85 (15/3/19)

Good morning everyone!

I am brand new here (I will get to the intro thread in a little bit) and seems like here is a lot safer to get the right advice than at the shops. I have posted the same questions to a number of shops and each has given me different subjective opinions.

I am a (too) long-time smoker and have been trying to get off them with a Twisp Cue, but find that the limited flavours and regular stock issues get me reaching for the Marlboros again.

I have been flirting with the idea of vaping for a while an have decided to pull the trigger.

A few shops, a bunch of online reviews and Youtube videos later, have narrowed it down to the following possibilities (for now):

*Mods:* Voopoo Drag 2, Ijoy UNIV (Shogun), Aegis (single or Legend), I looked at some on-board battery options like the Drag Mini and Aegis Mini, but have been advised against anything with a built-in battery.
*Atomizer/Tank: *I am not up for spending loads of unnecessary money on pre-built stuff, so am quite drawn to the idea of an RTA. A local store has said that as long as I buy the coils and cotton there, they will do the build and re-wick for me. I think that if I can watch them do it (and try under supervision), I would be able to pick it up pretty quickly. I have been looking at the OFRF Gear and the Zeus X (leaning towards the gear for the shortened nature of it and how simple it seems to build and wick).

I am looking for some guidance, as the more reviews I look at and read, the more possible options pop up. I am not a tinkerer by nature, so I would prefer something on the simpler side (Wattage, coils, wicking would be about it), without having to fiddle with temperature and ramp curves etc etc. Which of the mods above should I most strongly consider, or should I be looking at something completely off the list? The same question applies for the Atomizers.

I appreciate the assistance and look forward to bouncing the smokes for good.

Reactions: Like 1 | Winner 2


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## M.Adhir (15/3/19)

my advice if you're a current smoker- dont buy a dl atomizer.
get something thats mouth to lung, with a higher nic mtl juice. Something with a restrictive draw will more replicate the feeling of smoking.
Higher nic MTL juice in an mtl atomizer will also mean less juice consumption (so its cheaper as a result)

lower wattage mtl will give you longer battery life as well- you would be amazed how it eases the transition (not having to charge all the time).
Either an internal battery setup (OBS Cube), aegis mini, drag mini.
or a single battery 21700 capable mod, like the vaporesso armour pro, mirage 75c
Atomizer wise- OBS Mtl, Ammit MTL, manta MTL, dvarw mtl but with the top fill kit (this is pricey though).
Preference as a starter would be something with top airflow- as it wont leak and will allow you to learn wicking at your own pace.

If i had the above advice when i started, my journey would have been alot cheaper and the transition alot easier.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 7


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## Jean claude Vaaldamme (15/3/19)

My opinion.
A mod is a mod, they all do the same thing, specially if you new and not interrested in the fancy settings etc. So with that in mind you should rather look at what job you do etc. Its nice to have mods that have dual or even tripple batteries, but they are big and heavy. So if you not at home or at a desk the whole day, you should rather look at something smaller that you carry easy with you. Something like the Amour pro.

I personally believe before you start buying stuff you should decide and test what flavours you like. If you like fruits, juicy, menthol type flavours then you going to buy different mods and attys than desserts type flavours where you going to use big watts and blow huge clouds.

So with the juicy, fruity vape you going to go lower watts, so a single battery mod will be fine for the day and a single coil atty will be the best.

The Wasp nano rta just came out, everyone seems impressed with it. Its cheap and seems to be easy build

I personally will suggest getting a cheap rda with your first purchase, yes you dont want to drip the whole day, but they build real easy and you can practice your building skill on it.

And dont forget, before you buy anything, look at the classifieds on forum, there is many bargains, so if you buy and dont like, you can sell again, without losing to much

Reactions: Like 1


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## Dela Rey Steyn (15/3/19)

M.Adhir said:


> my advice if you're a current smoker- dont buy a dl atomizer.
> get something thats mouth to lung, with a higher nic mtl juice. Something with a restrictive draw will more replicate the feeling of smoking.
> Higher nic MTL juice in an mtl atomizer will also mean less juice consumption (so its cheaper as a result)
> 
> ...




Agree wholeheartedly, my first attempt at quitting was with a shop suggested Direct Lung (DL) setup, and the low Nicotine juices did nothing to help the cravings, I did smoke less, but i did not stop smoking. A good mouth to lung setup wont set you back 1000's of Rands and will be much better suited to your need to quit the Stinkies.

I really enjoyed my Twisp cue, but as you say, the problems with supply is a real downer, that said there are plenty of good pod devices in the market. A small pod device makes the transition easier as well because you don't have to get use to walking around with that big "hand grenade" in your hand.

Most pod systems are similarly priced and wont break the bank either, not much more than a carton of DECENT smokes.

Reactions: Like 1


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## CJB85 (15/3/19)

M.Adhir said:


> my advice if you're a current smoker- dont buy a dl atomizer.
> get something thats mouth to lung, with a higher nic mtl juice. Something with a restrictive draw will more replicate the feeling of smoking.
> Higher nic MTL juice in an mtl atomizer will also mean less juice consumption (so its cheaper as a result)
> 
> ...


Thanks for the quick response!
To be honest, I am not too phased about the MTL, DL issue, as smoking is way wore habitual (restless hands than anything else) and I was fond of the odd hubbly when I was younger.
How long do the batteries on internal battery devices last and what do you do once they give out? I am trying to weigh up what a new mod will cost versus a few battery replacements on external battery mods. I like the idea of a lower wattage vape, as I am never going to trick (hope I used that right), or try and impress anyone with huge clouds. Can I use a MTL atomizer on any mod (for instance the Aegis or Drag Mini's like you suggested)?

EDIT: Speaking which, if I go for something like an Aegis, or Drag Mini with an MTL atomizer, can I later fit it with a DL atomizer as well? Suddenly intrigued by the idea of a transitional setup...

Reactions: Agree 1


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## CJB85 (15/3/19)

Dela Rey Steyn said:


> Agree wholeheartedly, my first attempt at quitting was with a shop suggested Direct Lung (DL) setup, and the low Nicotine juices did nothing to help the cravings, I did smoke less, but i did not stop smoking. A good mouth to lung setup wont set you back 1000's of Rands and will be much better suited to your need to quit the Stinkies.
> 
> I really enjoyed my Twisp cue, but as you say, the problems with supply is a real downer, that said there are plenty of good pod devices in the market. A small pod device makes the transition easier as well because you don't have to get use to walking around with that big "hand grenade" in your hand.
> 
> Most pod systems are similarly priced and wont break the bank either, not much more than a carton of DECENT smokes.


Pod systems are okay, but won't a more "DIY" setup work out cheaper in the long run?

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 1


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## Dela Rey Steyn (15/3/19)

CJB85 said:


> Pod systems are okay, but won't a more "DIY" setup work out cheaper in the long run?


yes it will definitely "work out cheaper in the long run" My advice was more in line with quitting smoking as the first objective.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## CJB85 (15/3/19)

Dela Rey Steyn said:


> yes it will definitely "work out cheaper in the long run" My advice was more in line with quitting smoking as the first objective.


Gotcha, that does make sense.


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## M.Adhir (15/3/19)

CJB85 said:


> Thanks for the quick response!
> To be honest, I am not too phased about the MTL, DL issue, as smoking is way wore habitual (restless hands than anything else) and I was fond of the odd hubbly when I was younger.
> How long do the batteries on internal battery devices last and what do you do once they give out? I am trying to weigh up what a new mod will cost versus a few battery replacements on external battery mods. I like the idea of a lower wattage vape, as I am never going to trick (hope I used that right), or try and impress anyone with huge clouds. Can I use a MTL atomizer on any mod (for instance the Aegis or Drag Mini's like you suggested)?
> 
> EDIT: Speaking which, if I go for something like an Aegis, or Drag Mini with an MTL atomizer, can I later fit it with a DL atomizer as well? Suddenly intrigued by the idea of a transitional setup...



If your eventual plan is to go DL, there still remains the question of single or dual coil DL - meaning what wattage do you think you'd like to vape at. 
An single or inbuilt battery device is fine for single coil DL tanks. If you go dual coil then single battery isn't the best long term idea. 

Nothing wrong with getting a dual battery mod and an mtl atomizer for now- you will just run the device at lower wattage and have longer battery life in this configuration.


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## CJB85 (15/3/19)

M.Adhir said:


> If your eventual plan is to go DL, there still remains the question of single or dual coil DL - meaning what wattage do you think you'd like to vape at.
> An single or inbuilt battery device is fine for single coil DL tanks. If you go dual coil then single battery isn't the best long term idea.
> 
> Nothing wrong with getting a dual battery mod and an mtl atomizer for now- you will just run the device at lower wattage and have longer battery life in this configuration.


At this point, my very uninformed opinion is that I will probably never need the oomph of a dual coil setup, but the double battery at the same lower wattage to make it last longer seems like a really good idea. As far as I understand, the single coil RTA would also be somewhat easier to build myself?
So, if I understand this correctly, I can get a normal two battery mod (like the Shogun UNIV, for instance) and set it up with a MTL atomizer for now and switch to a DL version later (or perhaps even switch between the two depending on my mood)?

Reactions: Agree 2


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## M.Adhir (15/3/19)

CJB85 said:


> At this point, my very uninformed opinion is that I will probably never need the oomph of a dual coil setup, but the double battery at the same lower wattage to make it last longer seems like a really good idea. As far as I understand, the single coil RTA would also be somewhat easier to build myself?
> So, if I understand this correctly, I can get a normal two battery mod (like the Shogun UNIV, for instance) and set it up with a MTL atomizer for now and switch to a DL version later (or perhaps even switch between the two depending on my mood)?



Correct. Get a dual battery mod and an mtl atomizer for now. Change the atomizer as and when needed, just adjust wattage.

If budget isn't an issue, get a paranormal 250c. 
If you're looking for something a bit cheaper, shogun will work. 
Drag has crappy paintwork. 

Remember- you'll probably need an external charger at some point as well. In the interim, if your mod has 2amp charging, you should survive without a charger.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 2


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## CJB85 (15/3/19)

M.Adhir said:


> Correct. Get a dual battery mod and an mtl atomizer for now. Change the atomizer as and when needed, just adjust wattage.
> 
> If budget isn't an issue, get a paranormal 250c.
> If you're looking for something a bit cheaper, shogun will work.
> ...


Thank you!
The guys at the shop never once mentioned that I can cover both on the same mod by simply switching atomizers...
Which leads to the next questions (sorry), what are good MTL Atomizers to consider and would I need a specific type of juice to go with them?


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## RichJB (15/3/19)

CJB85 said:


> How long do the batteries on internal battery devices last and what do you do once they give out? I am trying to weigh up what a new mod will cost versus a few battery replacements on external battery mods.



Sorry to break the news but the chances of any mod lasting long enough to wear out any battery, internal or external, are quite small. One thing you will need to get used to is replacing mods periodically. Like many consumer items these days, they are designed to last just a little bit longer than the warranty does.


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## CJB85 (15/3/19)

RichJB said:


> Sorry to break the news but the chances of any mod lasting long enough to wear out any battery, internal or external, are quite small. One thing you will need to get used to is replacing mods periodically. Like many consumer items these days, they are designed to last just a little bit longer than the warranty does.


Hang on, so I should expect a mod to break down in a little over 6 months?


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## M.Adhir (15/3/19)

CJB85 said:


> Hang on, so I should expect a mod to break down in a little over 6 months?



Depends what you buy then I guess. 
My DNA's are in daily use for almost 2 years, no issues at all. That's why stand behind the chipset.


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## M.Adhir (15/3/19)

CJB85 said:


> Thank you!
> The guys at the shop never once mentioned that I can cover both on the same mod by simply switching atomizers...
> Which leads to the next questions (sorry), what are good MTL Atomizers to consider and would I need a specific type of juice to go with them?



sadly, most shops won't tell you, they would rather you buy two mods. 

Obs MTL, ammit mtl, dvarw mtl with topfill, manta mtl are all good imho.

Reactions: Like 1


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## CaliGuy (15/3/19)

I have to agree with all the advise given so far. A good MTL setup is the way to go, you can always later getting into Direct Lung once you have successfully kicked the stinkiest habit.

You could go the safe route and buy MTL Kit that uses carrridge style coils but honestly in the long run it will cost you more. And why buy a starter kit if you plan to go the rebuildable route, it’s not that hard to make coils and insert cotton wicks.

If it was my money and I was keen to learn and I wanted something that looked cool plus great flavour I would get the following setup, wish the first vape store I went to sold me this setup, would have saved me thousands of rands.

*AtomizerVape Mod & Aromizer*
Vapefly Galaxies MTL RDTA
https://vaperscorner.co.za/product/galaxies-mtl-squonk-rdta/

IStick Pico 75w Mod
https://vapeguy.co.za/mods/regulated-mods/eleaf-pico-75W-mod

2x Samsung 30Q Batter
https://www.thevapeden.co.za/collections/accessories/products/samsung-inr18650-30q-li-ion-battery

2 Bay Battery Charger
https://www.thevapeden.co.za/collec...core-um2-intelligent-usb-charger#&gid=1&pid=1

*Coil Building Supplies*:
Coilology MTL Staple Wire
https://www.thevapeden.co.za/collections/coils/products/coilology-mtl-staple-wire

Vapefly Firebolt Cotton Mixed Edition
https://www.thevapeden.co.za/products/vapefly-firebolt-cotton-mixed-edition#&gid=1&pid=1

Geekvape Build Kit
https://www.thevapeden.co.za/collections/accessories/products/geek-vape-simple-tool-kit

*eJuice Options*
Pied Piper Redwood Tobacco 12mg
Project X Nutty Custard 12mg
Steamworks Question Mark 12mg
Steamworks Exclamation Mark 12mg

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## Ruwaid (15/3/19)

The mod choices by yourself above and other vapers above are quite on point and will last you a long time SHOULD YOU choose to take relatively good care of it. Yes a mod will need replacing periodically but just over 6 months time...not a chance if the mod is taken care of.

I first started at the end of 2017 with a Eleaf Istick power nano 40w integrated battery mod and a mtl tank....that mod is still my only mod that is with me everyday although I have bought and sold off other mods. My nano is a keeper with a tiny integrated battery still kicking from day one!

If you are not phased by the DL and MTL etc then I can add to the many suggestions by advising on an Augvape Intake RTA...DL mainly but it has a restrictive draw to it...tighter than most DL RTA's...kinda best of both worlds!

Good luck!

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## Faiyaz Cheulkar (15/3/19)

CJB85 said:


> Hang on, so I should expect a mod to break down in a little over 6 months?



No thats not true at all. I think what @RichJB is trying to say is be mentally prepared for the worst. This is what I am using ATM.
On the left is tesla Wye single battery mod with a siren V2 MTL RTA. Both were bought second on the forum for R350 and Siren V2 for 150. I use it for nic salts. Battery in this setup is 2.5 year old and still working fine. If you want to go for nic salts which I will highly recommend for a new vaper trying to quit smoking and want a rebuildable setup, this RTA is the best choice. really easy to build lots of flavour. A tank full will last you for a reallyy long time. I use it on temp control with a stainless steel wire.

On the right is OBS bat mod bought second hand on the forum 1.5 years ago and still working fine. Batteries are around a year old.


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## RichJB (15/3/19)

CJB85 said:


> Hang on, so I should expect a mod to break down in a little over 6 months?



There is no guideline, it will depend on the mod, chipset, conditions you use it in, amount of use, etc. In the DIYorDie Discord group which features many long-term vapers, I did a quick poll and most were happy to get twelve months use out of a mod before having to replace. Ironically, the general consensus seems to be that the more expensive the mod, the greater the likelihood that it will fail. Again, that's not a golden rule, just an indication that higher price does not necessarily mean greater longevity.

I'm not saying that you should count on the mod dying soon, just don't budget or depend on it not happening. The general advice given to new vapers is to get at least two setups so that you have a backup in case one fails. That alone tells you how frequently this happens.

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## Puff the Magic Dragon (15/3/19)

CJB85 said:


> Hang on, so I should expect a mod to break down in a little over 6 months?



I get what @RichJB is saying about mods but he is giving you a worst-case scenario. 

I have several mods which have lasted over four years and are still working perfectly. Likewise, I have a couple which lasted less than a year.

Everyone will have their own opinions on which mods (brands) will last the longest. This is obviously based on personal experience and you read many threads and posts where mods have lasted only a few months. Most mods die because of juice leaking on the electronics. Most manufacturers won't honour their guarantee when this happens. Nowadays tanks RTAs seem to leak far less often than in the past.

If you are the type of person who likes to fiddle around with gadgets then a mod and MTL RTA would be OK. If not pods have proven to be great for quitting smoking.

Reactions: Agree 2 | Winner 1


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## CaliGuy (15/3/19)

@CJB85 if you want to learn more about vaping, the devices and how to coil and wick a atomizer you are more than welcome to come over to my place on a weekend and I’ll teach you everything you need to know over a few beers.

I have a variety of vape gear including MTL and DL RTAs & RDAs, even have the Gear RTA if you want to try them all out before deciding on what to buy

**Forgot to mention I’m based in Centurion**

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## Jean claude Vaaldamme (15/3/19)

Yes what @RichJB said is very important. Buy two setups with batteries for both. If you want to quit and your one mod is broken or busy building one, then you going to smoke again. So get a budget first and then you see what you can buy, including chargers, juice etc

Reactions: Agree 2


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## Puff the Magic Dragon (15/3/19)

I like @Faiyaz Cheulkar 's suggestion. If budget is an issue the forum classifieds are a great place for bargains. You could buy your backup mod there.

P.S. @Faiyaz Cheulkar The Dvarw RTA must have cost you a fortune...

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Puff the Magic Dragon (15/3/19)

Great offer for help from @CaliGuy . 

I wish that someone had been around to help me when I got started. If you are serious about giving up smoking then the time spent with an experienced vaper will really help.

Reactions: Thanks 1


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## Adephi (15/3/19)

CJB85 said:


> Hang on, so I should expect a mod to break down in a little over 6 months?



If you really get into vaping you will have a backup mod by that time. And a backup for the backup. And one for driving. And one for the desk. And one for the braai.........

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## CJB85 (15/3/19)

What do you guys think of something like the Innokin Cool Fire Pebble?
To me it seems cheap enough to get as an MTL mod and if it does not work as a DL mod later, get something bigger and keep this as a backup mod?

So, now it seems the mod choices are between:
Aegis Mini
eLeaf Pico
Innokin Cool Fire...

Yes, no?

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## Adephi (15/3/19)

CJB85 said:


> What do you guys think of something like the Innokin Cool Fire Pebble?
> To me it seems cheap enough to get as an MTL mod and if it does not work as a DL mod later, get something bigger and keep this as a backup mod?
> 
> So, now it seems the mod choices are between:
> ...



Pico is a great choice. The posts you find on the forum is testimony of how theyjust go on and on without missing a beat.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 3


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## CJB85 (15/3/19)

Adephi said:


> Pico is a great choice. The posts you find on the forum is testimony of how theyjust go on and on without missing a beat.


Thank you, will this have enough power on the single battery to accommodate a DL setup later?

Reactions: Agree 1


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## CaliGuy (15/3/19)

CJB85 said:


> Thank you, will this have enough power on the single battery to accommodate a DL setup later?


The Pico is going to limit you to 22mm RTA/RDA.

Must DL tanks are 24mm, these won’t fit on the Pico but Eleaf do make a Pico 25 100w which is still smallish mod but it supports upto 25mm tanks plus It take the higher capacity 20700 battery.

Think of the small Pico as a Pocket Buddy, small, light and easy to carry.

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## NOOB (15/3/19)

Welcome @CJB85. I'll be honest with you, I wish I knew about the Ecigssa forum before I bought my first Mod and RTA!

This here is the best place to get the best, unbiased advise in SA. Most shops will never give you the straight up, brutally honest opinions that you will find here. I am not saying they don't exist, I'm just saying that you'll have to search high & low before you find the ones that do! 

I started with the "original" Drag 157W and the Wotofo Bravo RTA, which is probably why I am "falling off the wagon" from time to time and going back onto the stinkies. 

I have since acquired a Vandy Vape Pulse 80W and the Vandy Vape Pulse X, both running Wotofo Recurve RDA's (single coil) and I have to say, this setup is superb in terms of flavour and battery life. The Pulse 80W accommodates a single 18650 or 20700 battery and the Pulse X accommodates a single 18650, 20700 AND 21700 battery.

I am, however, looking at a small device, such as the Aegis Mini as my next device, and from the comments/advice above, I think I might need to find out which MTL Atomizer would best, so, for all intents and puposes, I think you and I are in the same boat! 

I do not regret getting any of the diveces that I currently have, but it would have made the transition from stinkies to vaping a lot easier. 

Coiling and wicking either an RTA or RDA comes with practice and I have spent hours reading suggestions and asking for advice on the forum. All the members are super friendly and always willing to provide stellar advice and even lending a helping hand. 

Shout out to @CaliGuy for offering to help you. GIVE THAT MAN A BELLS! 
I would suggest that you take him up on his offer, it will certainly provide you with all the insight you need into which mods and atomizers suite your preferences the best.

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## CaliGuy (15/3/19)

CJB85 said:


> Thank you, will this have enough power on the single battery to accommodate a DL setup later?


The Pico is going to limit you to 22mm RTA/RDA. Not many DL RTAs around that are 22mm.

Must DL tanks are 24mm, these won’t fit on the Pico but Eleaf do make a Pico 25 100w mod that also takes a 20700 battery. Still a compact mod but it allows you to use 22,24 & 25mm tanks.

Think of the small Pico 75w I suggested as a Pocket Buddy, small, light and easy to carry. A MTL setup should be small and compact, something the size of a pocket of 20 Ciggies is ideal as it helps by feeling familiar while you are switching over from smoking to vaping.

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## MRHarris1 (15/3/19)

CaliGuy said:


> The Pico is going to limit you to 22mm RTA/RDA. Not many DL RTAs around that are 22mm.
> 
> Must DL tanks are 24mm, these won’t fit on the Pico but Eleaf do make a Pico 25 100w mod that also takes a 20700 battery. Still a compact mod but it allows you to use 22,24 & 25mm tanks.
> 
> ...


Agree with @CaliGuy Pico is nice pocket buddy.






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## Jean claude Vaaldamme (15/3/19)

Just a question. Does all the picos have a screen? For new vaper building a screen showing ohms and watts should help if he don not have ohm meter

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## Silver (15/3/19)

Welcome to the forum @CJB85

Firstly, congrats on taking the steps to start vaping and on coming here to ask for advice. I think this thread has some golden advice from the members who have responded, many of which are very experienced vapers. So take note of what has been said.

I can't add much to what has been said on the hardware but will add a bit of extra info from my perspective:

Firstly, vaping is a *journey*. What you think now and what you will think in a month or three month's time is likely to be different. So do the research and get yourself some gear to get you going - but don't worry too much about the long term - you will find your special vaping spot over time.

As for vaping styles - *MTL and DL *are very different. Ideally, try them both out and see what you prefer. DL with more power, airflow, bigger clouds and lower nic strength - and MTL the opposite. You may find you like them both (I do) and you may want setups for both.

Second thing - I strongly concur with what @Jean claude Vaaldamme said - You need *TWO SETUPS*! When one goes on the blink or batteries are flat - or the coil needs replacing and you dont have time because you need to go somewhere - you need a second setup. Always have a backup. That is critical to stopping the stinkies successfully.

Next up is the *juice*. I think one tends to focus a lot on the mods and hardware - but an average mod with an exceptional juice that you LOVE - will be much better than the best mod with juices that you are not mad about. The juice journey can be difficult. You just need to try as many as you can. Try discover what types of juices you enjoy and try as many as you can (in shops or at friends etc). You need to try find one or two juices that you love - that will make a big difference in your vaping.

Lastly, while its great to get advice here - I do think going to a *shop *to try before you buy is well worth the time. With the mods, feel them in the hand and notice whether it feels good to you. It needs to feel good. Specs can be brilliant but if it feels a bit heavy or oddly shaped - that will most likely stay with you. Next is the juices. Try as many as you can and see what you like. You are in Pretoria - go visit Vapers Corner in Equestria - they have a big selection of juices and I believe most if not all are on demo for you to try out.

All the best and let us know how it goes.

PS - that offer from @CaliGuy is superb - wish I had an experienced vaper like him offering me that when I started.

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## Silver (15/3/19)

Jean claude Vaaldamme said:


> Just a question. Does all the picos have a screen? For new vaper building a screen showing ohms and watts should help if he don not have ohm meter



Pico has a screen @Jean claude Vaaldamme - 
My little Pico has one and I am pretty sure the others do

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## MRHarris1 (15/3/19)

Silver said:


> Pico has a screen @Jean claude Vaaldamme -
> My little Pico has one and I am pretty sure the others do


Only Pico I know that doesn't have a screen is the Pico squeeze 50w








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## CaliGuy (16/3/19)

Some solid advise from @Silver covering what potentially happens on ones vape journey, it is so true that firstly is a journey that one goes on until you find your happy vaping place. And secondly that the juice you end up calling your All Day Vape is so important, everything becomes simpler once you have your favour hardware setup or multiple setups which is common and then finding those few juice flavours thatvget your mouth watering for you vape first thing in the morning.

And yes do go and check out Vapers Corner in Equestria, you can sample all the juices they supply which is a huge bonus and they carry a lot of top notch local and international juices. They have a large and varied selection of hardware too with super helpful staff. MTL vaping is sadly not often featured at vape shops so it does make it a bit difficult to test drive, but most of the store staff should have there own personal pod systems at hand for you to have a few toots to give it a try.

Come to think of it getting a good quility Pod like the Vaporesso Renovo Zero Pod (Awesome flavour, cheap coils) would be a affordable MTL hardware but leaving you open to get a 2nd DL Mod and Tank and that way you could have the best of both worlds with the Pod being MTL with Hi Nic helping you stay off the stinkies.

At the end of the day staying off the stinkies is the real challenge, this forum here is full of awesome people, amazing vape gear being show cased and solid support and advise to help you on your vaping journey.

@CJB85 there is no right or wrong when it comes to vaping, it’s what you enjoy and what feels and tastes right for you that matter. Most of all just enjoy the journey, it’s so worth it.

Reactions: Like 2


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## CJB85 (16/3/19)

Okay, dropped by Vape King this morning (had to kill time while a puncture on my car was being fixed).
The lady did not try and sell me the most expensive mod, which was a good start. 
She mentioned that re-wicking is a lot harder than people think and can ruin the vaping experience if you are new, so she recommended:
A) a sub-ohm setup
B) keep the twisp as an mtl and do the vape directly to DL.

If I were to look at pre-spun wire coils, how hard is it to install and re-wick and more importantly, how badly can I screw it up?

I am not too sure about the mods she mentioned (shogun popped up, Rincoe Manto X and then Vaporesso Lux). She did however say that they do not stock eLeaf purely because they could not sell as many of them, not because they are bad.

I feel a little like being drawn into a tornado, the more I find out, the crazier it gets.

Here is where my mind was last night:
1 - Pico S 100w (for the larger battery capability)
2 - Ammit MTL RTA (liked a reviewers advice that with the AF all the way open, it is a good restricted lung hit, so can be my intro to DL as well).
Am I over ambitious by looking at RTA from the start?

Reactions: Like 3 | Winner 1


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## ddk1979 (16/3/19)

CJB85 said:


> Okay, dropped by Vape King this morning (had to kill time while a puncture on my car was being fixed).
> The lady did not try and sell me the most expensive mod, which was a good start.
> She mentioned that re-wicking is a lot harder than people think and can ruin the vaping experience if you are new, so she recommended:
> A) a sub-ohm setup
> ...





@CJB85 , I think grass has more DIY genes than I do and if I can manage to build my own coils and wick, then I'm sure you will be able to handle it.
It took me about 3 tries to get things going on the right path, and all it cost me was about 40cm of wire and a little cotton.
Moral of the story is that if I can do it, anyone can.

I agree totally with the comments regarding the Pico. It's a great little mod and excellent for when you are on the go and as a back-up.

There is a complete Pico kit on sale here at a reasonable price - https://www.ecigssa.co.za/istick-pico.t57796/
It also gives you the opportunity to play around with DL since it includes the tank, a few coils as well as a battery

.

Reactions: Like 3 | Agree 1


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## Jean claude Vaaldamme (16/3/19)

Dont know where @CaliGuy stays, Im in Centurion so should not be far from you, if you want you can come to me also, will teach you in 30min how to make your own coils, fit them and wick them. Its not rocket science and nothing to be scared off.
Dont go buy stuff that you not going to use. I also have normal mod, squonk mod, rda, rdta and normal tank mtl and dl that you can test and see what you like

Reactions: Like 1 | Winner 3


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## CJB85 (16/3/19)

Jean claude Vaaldamme said:


> Dont know where @CaliGuy stays, Im in Centurion so should not be far from you, if you want you can come to me also, will teach you in 30min how to make your own coils, fit them and wick them. Its not rocket science and nothing to be scared off.
> Dont go buy stuff that you not going to use. I also have normal mod, squonk mod, rda, rdta and normal tank mtl and dl that you can test and see what you like


Maybe I can buy you and @CaliGuy a beer at Capital craft and you can help me get the hang of it?

Reactions: Like 4


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## CaliGuy (16/3/19)

@CJB85 Capital Craft sounds like a great plan. Like @Jean claude Vaaldamme Im also based in Centurion.

I’ve sent you a PM with my contacts details. Drop me a WhatsApp or call when you plan to come to this area. I work for myself and from home so I’m always available. We would just need to coordinate with Jean Claude to rope him in.

We will bring some vape gear for you to play around with and by the 2nd Beer you would have coiled and wicked your first RTA or RDA.

Reactions: Winner 3


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## Silver (16/3/19)

Hi @CJB85 

When it comes to rewicking a coil it is quite easy. There are some tanks that are a bit finicky and require a few tries to get it right, ie thickness of cotton and placement of the wick tails - but there are many forgiving tanks that are so simple to rewick.

Rebuildables certainly offer a far more tailored vape over time and its a lot cheaper than buying coils

That said, it is nice to have a non rebuildable too for when you dont have time to rewick and just want to pop in a new coil and go in a hurry.

Reactions: Agree 3


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## Adephi (16/3/19)

CJB85 said:


> She mentioned that re-wicking is a lot harder than people think and can ruin the vaping experience if you are new



Coiling and wicking is really not that hard. But the thing is to practice to get the wicking perfect. I also came very close to throwing in the towel in the beginning. But once you have it every rta and rda will be a breeze.

Reactions: Agree 3


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## CJB85 (16/3/19)

Silver said:


> Hi @CJB85
> 
> When it comes to rewicking a coil it is quite easy. There are some tanks that are a bit finicky and require a few tries to get it right, ie thickness of cotton and placement of the wick tails - but there are many forgiving tanks that are so simple to rewick.
> 
> ...


That is actually the one piece of decent advice that the girl at Vape King gave. She said that even if I go the rebuild route, it is a good idea to keep a sub-ohm with some coils in the cubby-hole, as no-one wants to rewick halfway into a braai after a couple of beers.

Reactions: Agree 5


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## Room Fogger (17/3/19)

CJB85 said:


> Okay, dropped by Vape King this morning (had to kill time while a puncture on my car was being fixed).
> The lady did not try and sell me the most expensive mod, which was a good start.
> She mentioned that re-wicking is a lot harder than people think and can ruin the vaping experience if you are new, so she recommended:
> A) a sub-ohm setup
> ...


@CJB85 , you can start with a rebuildable, but it will be something that does need a fair amount of trying to get it right, but it is really not that difficult. Just make sure that the you have a commercial tank that usually comes with as a combo should you not get it right initially so that you can vape.

I spent an hour each night for a week at my vape shop while they taught me how to do it properly, and I haven’t looked back. Have to also say that they recoiled and wicked it for me for about a month with me watching. Once you get it right it’s plain sailing from there.

MTL vs DL is a personal preference, I started on DL and I’m now on MTL, if you get a RTA try to find out how much you can close the airflow to try and accommodate at least a restricted DL which does not mimic MTL exactly but gives you more options. I like your choice of the Pico 100 and the Ammit MTL gives great flavour, and will cover both sides. A bit more difficult to wick than others but great flavour. Hope you get you perfect setup and many happy clouds to you.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Room Fogger (17/3/19)

CaliGuy said:


> The Pico is going to limit you to 22mm RTA/RDA. Not many DL RTAs around that are 22mm.
> 
> Must DL tanks are 24mm, these won’t fit on the Pico but Eleaf do make a Pico 25 100w mod that also takes a 20700 battery. Still a compact mod but it allows you to use 22,24 & 25mm tanks.
> 
> ...


@CaliGuy @CJB85 , I know this with knock someone’s ocd out of the ballpark, with a simple 22 ml heat sink adapter any tank will fit on a Pico. This is however not a problem with the Pico S as it easily accommodates the big ones. Happy vaping.

My one Pico 75w with a 22 mm and the other with a heat sink and a Avo24 rdta.

Reactions: Like 1 | Winner 1


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## RainstormZA (17/3/19)

CaliGuy said:


> The Pico is going to limit you to 22mm RTA/RDA.
> 
> Must DL tanks are 24mm, these won’t fit on the Pico but Eleaf do make a Pico 25 100w which is still smallish mod but it supports upto 25mm tanks plus It take the higher capacity 20700 battery.
> 
> Think of the small Pico as a Pocket Buddy, small, light and easy to carry.


The Pico 21700 takes up to 25mm atties. Linky



> High Compatibility
> The iStick Pico 21700 can handle various tanks up to 25mm diameter without any overhang.

Reactions: Agree 2


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## RainstormZA (17/3/19)

Jean claude Vaaldamme said:


> Just a question. Does all the picos have a screen? For new vaper building a screen showing ohms and watts should help if he don not have ohm meter


Yes they do, I have two Picos myself, everything is included. 

They are great for noobs and experienced vapers alike, I personally like them for their durability and safety mechanisms.

Reactions: Like 2


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## CaliGuy (17/3/19)

@CJB85 here is another DL Combo that you could consider. All the RTAs listed below are easy to build and wick and have very good flavour.

*Vaporesso Armor Pro Mod w/ 21700 Battery *

*QP Designs Juggerknot Mini RTA*
Or
*OFRF Gear RTA*
Or
*Wasp Nano RTA *(New Product)

Check a Vape Hyper, they can hook you up with the Mod and Gear RTA at a good price.

Juggerknot Mini is available from a few Vape stores, so shop around and you will find one (check classifieds a few have gone up for sale)

Reactions: Like 1


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## Neal (17/3/19)

Just my 2c but you can't go wrong with a Pico 21700. Am running mine with Zeus single coil (25mm atty). Also has a little more oomph than original pico @100w.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 2


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## Jean claude Vaaldamme (17/3/19)

Im still of the opnion that anybody thats starting with building, should start with a rda and squonk mod. Rda's are easy to build and wick and you are almost guaranteed to have good flavour.

Rta's are more difficult to build and then the wicking starts, if not wicked right you have leaks or no flavour. Just check the forum. Everytime a new hype rta comes out we see the threads. The exitement, this is so great, the flavour is the best ever. Then after a week or two, we see the my tank is leaking, I get dry hits, I get no flavour comments. Then after a month we see these rta's floading the classifieds. Go look, it happens everytime.

Reactions: Optimistic 1 | Disagree 1


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## CJB85 (18/3/19)

CaliGuy said:


> @CJB85 here is another DL Combo that you could consider. All the RTAs listed below are easy to build and wick and have very good flavour.
> 
> *Vaporesso Armor Pro Mod w/ 21700 Battery *
> 
> ...


Okay @CaliGuy , before I read this comment of yours, I had watched and read another ton of rieviews and had all but settled on the following idea:
1) Pico S 100W kit, using the supplied tank and battery to get me started. I liked the idea that the mod lasts and that it takes the larger battery and tanks.
2) Getting an Ammit MTL RTA to start practicing builds on, to eventually use as an MTL and restricted DL setup.
3) Was going to use my twisp as my backup and eventually acquire a second mod with something like a Gear RTA, after which the MTL would become my “stealth setup”, big clouds are not popular at the office.

Then you come along with the Armour Pro and capsized my well organized little boat ...
The Armour is a little more expensive than the Pico, but is smaller and seems to have a better chip op board... Is it worth getting the Armour instead of the Pico??

Reactions: Like 2


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## CaliGuy (18/3/19)

@CJB85 I think you are on the right and very logical track with the setup you are looking at to have a Sub Ohm Combo, add the MTL Rebuildable RTA and use your Twisp as the backup.

You can’t go wrong with the Pico Combo as they are dependable Mods. I’ve never tried their larger Sub Ohm RTAs to comment on coil longevity or flavor.

In the same price range as the Pico S 21700 Kit or Pick 21700 Kit both of which come supplied with the 21700 battery you get the Vaporesso Armor Pro Mod with the Cascade Baby RTA. Yes it’s also a very good 21700 battery option, Vaporesso have the Ceramic and Mesh Coils options which are very good from the reviews I’ve seen.

Vaporesso’s mod is smaller, has a few more features but who uses all the features anyway. Yes it is a very good mood, you will see several forum Memeber have them and from the pics I shared you can see what it looks like with other 24mm RTAs (Max 26mm) onboard.

Let me not detract you totally, you have some great choices from all of these Direct Lung setup and as I mention your strategy of DL Sub Ohm, with rebuildable MTL RTA and Twisp Cue as backup sounds like a good plan.

As long as all of this is within your budget and you get something that works for you and it allows you to add future tanks and still look good then I say go for it. I feel everyone here that has been helping you just wants to make sure that you end up number 1 stopping the ciggies and number 2 don’t go down a spending spree road chasing the next best thing when you can get by and be satisfied with having a versatile setup from day one.

I for one spent a lot of money before doing almost a full 360 degrees to finally settle on what works for me, wish I had some more guidenace from the start but I didn’t really ask so it’s my fault. Honestly just following posts on this forum and seeing post from other members finally got me to my happy place through trail and error.

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## CJB85 (18/3/19)

Has anyone had any experience with the Geekvape Aegis 100W? I like the idea that it can take a bit of punishment, but now looks like it uses an "odd" battery size?
Is this one I can take a look at as well, or should it be avoided?


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## Jean claude Vaaldamme (18/3/19)

Why dont you buy @Grand Guru Ijoy Avenger in the classifieds. Brand new. Its R400 plus 100 shipping from Bloemfontein(bcause dis n lekker kak plek). 
It has voice control, so you can talk to your mod if you lonely.

Reactions: Winner 1 | Funny 5 | Optimistic 1


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## Asterix (18/3/19)

CJB85 said:


> Has anyone had any experience with the Geekvape Aegis 100W? I like the idea that it can take a bit of punishment, but now looks like it uses an "odd" battery size?
> Is this one I can take a look at as well, or should it be avoided?



Nice mods. Not very pretty but strong. I have one which doesn’t get used too much lately but my goto device for rough outdoors. My wife is also running one daily (she works in the service department of a motor stealership, and mod often gets bumped around). 

Batteries aren’t that odd and are readily available. Was getting about a day and a half when I was running with only the Aegis.

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## CJB85 (18/3/19)

How about this one for a starter mod?

https://www.ecigssa.co.za/eleaf-istick-pico-25.t57596/

Reactions: Like 1


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## Jean claude Vaaldamme (18/3/19)

CJB85 said:


> How about this one for a starter mod?
> 
> https://www.ecigssa.co.za/eleaf-istick-pico-25.t57596/


Just a tip. Things like that at the price sells quick. There was a similar one this week that sold in a few minutes. If you see something like that in classifieds, dont even comment on thread, pm the member immediately and buy it. The market is just a bit slow at the moment, otherwise that would have sold in 10min

Reactions: Agree 2 | Optimistic 1


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## CJB85 (18/3/19)

Jean claude Vaaldamme said:


> Just a tip. Things like that at the price sells quick. There was a similar one this week that sold in a few minutes. If you see something like that in classifieds, dont even comment on thread, pm the member immediately and buy it. The market is just a bit slow at the moment, otherwise that would have sold in 10min


Thanks, sent a PM to the seller.


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## CaliGuy (18/3/19)

CJB85 said:


> How about this one for a starter mod?
> 
> https://www.ecigssa.co.za/eleaf-istick-pico-25.t57596/


That’s a decent price, perfect actually, I hope you get it.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 2


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## CJB85 (18/3/19)

CaliGuy said:


> That’s a decent price, perfect actually, I hope you get it.


Got it, collecting tomorrow.

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## Puff the Magic Dragon (19/3/19)

Cape Town Vape Meets

All new vapers are welcome to attend the Cape Town Vape Meets. We are all willing to help new vapers. It is an ideal opportunity to try out tons of mods, RDAs, RTAs, RDTAs, all types of juice etc. There are coil making experts who will help you building and wicking.

To be honest, absolutely anything vape related can be seen, used, explained and discussed.

Where else are you able to get expert vape advice in a friendly (apart from @Bulldog who is a bit strange) and relaxed atmosphere?

Take a look at this thread and come and join us on 30 March.

https://www.ecigssa.co.za/cape-town-month-end-meets.t48845/page-37

If you want a look at a specific mod or Atty, drop a note in the above thread and one of us is likely to have one and will bring it to the meet for you to try.

P.S. Experienced vaperists are also welcome.

Reactions: Like 2 | Winner 1 | Funny 2


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## CJB85 (19/3/19)

Big thank you to @TradeMark, very accommodating and even threw in a full pack of replacement coils to get me started. Pleasure to work with.

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## CaliGuy (19/3/19)

Awesome gladly you manage to snag that Pico Kit, price was perfect and I can also vouche for @TradeMark as I got my Eleaf Ikonn Total Mod from him.

Reckon you are on your way then @CJB85, now to find yourself some juice flavours that will keep you vaping. With your new setup I would stick to Fruity flavours to start with, there are lots of lip smacking good local juices available that will work well in that Pico Sub Ohm RTA.

Check out the Steam Masters Question Mark, Exclamation Mark, Hashtag and Semi Collin range of fresh fruity flavours, you can’t go wrong with any of those.

Reactions: Like 3 | Agree 1


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## TradeMark (19/3/19)

CJB85 said:


> Big thank you to @TradeMark, very accommodating and even threw in a full pack of replacement coils to get me started. Pleasure to work with.


Pleasure brother! Hope you enjoy the MOD

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## CJB85 (19/3/19)

@CaliGuy I was itching to get going, so popped into a Vape King around the corner from where I met Mark for the mod. 
I was helped by a guy called Matt, who was very helpful and patient. 
I got set up with some batteries, a cheap charger and some juice. 
I got one each of Prime's Armageddon and Pomcool (a pomegranate on ice juice), the Pomcool rocks so far, but I am sure I will play around a lot in the future.

Reactions: Like 1 | Winner 1


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## Silver (19/3/19)

CJB85 said:


> @CaliGuy I was itching to get going, so popped into a Vape King around the corner from where I met Mark for the mod.
> I was helped by a guy called Matt, who was very helpful and patient.
> I got set up with some batteries, a cheap charger and some juice.
> I got one each of Prime's Armageddon and Pomcool (a pomegranate on ice juice), the Pomcool rocks so far, but I am sure I will play around a lot in the future.



Good to hear @CJB85 

PomCool is great by the way

I reviewed it here:
https://www.ecigssa.co.za/vape-king-juice-reviews.t1497/page-5#post-717146

Reactions: Like 1


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## CJB85 (19/3/19)

Thank you very much to @CaliGuy, @Jean claude Vaaldamme, @Silver and everyone else who helped me take my first steps.
I have one more question before we can shelf this thread for a while: I have only taken 4 pulls on the new vape (the out of box battery did not have much life in it, they are currently charging) and have it set up with the Kit tank and 40Watts, airflow wide open. If I want to start playing with the airflow (I think I may prefer a slightly tighter draw), do I need to be aware of anything, like having to adjust the wattage as well?

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## Silver (19/3/19)

CJB85 said:


> Thank you very much to @CaliGuy, @Jean claude Vaaldamme, @Silver and everyone else who helped me take my first steps.
> I have one more question before we can shelf this thread for a while: I have only taken 4 pulls on the new vape (the out of box battery did not have much life in it, they are currently charging) and have it set up with the Kit tank and 40Watts, airflow wide open. If I want to start playing with the airflow (I think I may prefer a slightly tighter draw), do I need to be aware of anything, like having to adjust the wattage as well?



Generally speaking if you reduce the airflow you should reduce the power a bit.
Otherwise the coil/wick could overheat.

I would say start at a low wattage (say 20W) and work your way up and see where it feels best


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## CJB85 (19/3/19)

Silver said:


> Generally speaking if you reduce the airflow you should reduce the power a bit.
> Otherwise the coil/wick could overheat.
> 
> I would say start at a low wattage (say 20W) and work your way up and see where it feels best


Would it be okay to drop it to 30W as a start (the coils are rated 30-80), or can I drop it below the coil rated wattage?

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## Puff the Magic Dragon (19/3/19)

It is safe to drop the watts lower than 30W but you are likely to experience a very cold vape with very little vapour production. @Silver 's advice to start low is the way to go. As you increase the wattage it will get warmer with more vapour. Find the spot that you like. If you decide on a low wattage (high ohm) build then you may have to increase your nic content, particularly if you are still trying to quit smoking.

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## Jean claude Vaaldamme (19/3/19)

Like they said nothing dangerous can happen if you play around with watts. If your watts is to high you can just burn your coil and get dry hits and bad taste. To low watts, just no flavour.
There is some formula where you can work out at what watts you should vape more or less according to your coil's ohms. Maybe someone can direct you to it

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## Puff the Magic Dragon (19/3/19)

https://www.rapidtables.com/calc/electric/watt-volt-amp-calculator.html

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## Silver (19/3/19)

CJB85 said:


> Would it be okay to drop it to 30W as a start (the coils are rated 30-80), or can I drop it below the coil rated wattage?



No harm in going too low on the wattage @CJB85 
It wont damage the coil or the device
Just might not produce enough flavour or vape intensity as @Puff the Magic Dragon said

Its good to actually try lower powers because you may like it - and its good to experiment. 

I wouldnt go much higher than the max rated power for a coil though in case you burn it out. Then its a wasted coil.

Reactions: Like 1


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## CJB85 (19/3/19)

Silver said:


> No harm in going too low on the wattage @CJB85
> It wont damage the coil or the device
> Just might not produce enough flavour or vape intensity as @Puff the Magic Dragon said
> 
> ...


Thanks guys, appreciate it. I went down to 25W and played around a bit. I kind of like now at 35 with the air about 3/4 open... I do however think I may jump to an MTL setup sooner rather than later...

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## CJB85 (20/3/19)

Bye-bye stinkies!!

Reactions: Like 2 | Winner 7


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## CaliGuy (20/3/19)

CJB85 said:


> View attachment 161141
> Bye-bye stinkies!!



Flipping nice looking setup you got there bud. Sommer MTL one time and you didn’t spend a fortune to get going.

What juice are you vaping?

Reactions: Like 1


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## CJB85 (20/3/19)

CaliGuy said:


> Flipping nice looking setup you got there bud. Sommer MTL one time and you didn’t spend a fortune to get going.
> 
> What juice are you vaping?


I was actually looking for the Ammit MTL, but struggling like hell to find one (everyone seems to carry the RDA), so got the Berserker from Vandy Vape... I got some TKO Menthol Tabacco in there now... going sweetly at 15W. I tried some Hazelnut Tobacco at the shop, but I think it is just too subtle for now.
The coil on this atty is TINY... I am not sure yet if that will make it easier or harder to re-wick, but we will get to that a little later.
Thanks again to everyone here... I realized again today that shops are very eager to give you a firm push down the rabbit hole's expensive side if they feel you might not be experienced. I would probably have spent a ton of money more than I have if not for this forum.
My total setup cost so far:

iStick Pico 25 kit (used, with 5 replacement coils) - R400
Two 18650 batteries - R320
Prodna 2 bay charger - R100
Prime Armageddon Juice (60ml) - R120
Prime PomCool Juice (60ml) - R120
Vandy Vape Berserker MTL RTA - R590
TKO Menthol Tobacco Juice (75ml) - R220
TOTAL SPENT - R1870

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## CJB85 (20/3/19)

CaliGuy said:


> Flipping nice looking setup you got there bud. Sommer MTL one time and you didn’t spend a fortune to get going.
> 
> What juice are you vaping?


I do however now realize that Vapery in Centurion charged me more for the old Berserker than Vape King is charging for the new V1.5 version...
That kind of sucks.

Reactions: Agree 3


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## Grand Guru (20/3/19)

CJB85 said:


> I do however now realize that Vapery in Centurion charged me more for the old Berserker than Vape King is charging for the new V1.5 version...
> That kind of sucks.


Vapers Corner is selling it for R350 but you are well set up and good to quit the stinkies with Berserker so don’t look backwards and enjoy the journey!

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## CaliGuy (20/3/19)

CJB85 said:


> I do however now realize that Vapery in Centurion charged me more for the old Berserker than Vape King is charging for the new V1.5 version...
> That kind of sucks.



That’s why I only shop online these days, you can look around for the best price and take it from there. Also helps to keep checking your favourite online store for sales. I have my favourite online stores and I only support them and rarely go into a store these days.

Reactions: Agree 1


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