# Spaced vs Compressed Coils



## Andre (8/8/14)

*Came accross an interesting discussion on ECF on this question. The part in black below was MacTechVpr's answer to this question by one Rudy. The part in blue was another member's response. And the last part (below the line) was MacTechVpr's reply to this response. You be the judge! Link to that page at the very bottom.*

Thanks your question rudy. Hey look the basic premise of my efforts here to teach tension Tension, yes! Tension winding is the key to achieving consistant wick compression (deflection) on every part of every wind in the coil. Thanks Mac for that innovation!is to get new vapors thinking in terms of basic electronics. What works most efficiently. Shorts less. Yes, shorts less. What I call hot spots.Delivers better vapor production. Simply attainable techniques. I never dreamed that tension coils could work that well myself. I'd been actually devoting my efforts to tensioned screw wraps and was extremely skeptical of the contact coil…for about two weeks! If I hadn't perfected the rest of the electrical principles to make it work in a tight tank rudy, I would've failed. But having accomplished that I've been trying to pay it back and get as many newcomers through as quickly as possible.

*Short answer: A non-contact coil will produce less with less winds for a given length lacking the direct heat transfer potential and having a greater lead inefficiency (more wire heating air) as a percetange of the overall element.*That's the math. I can't argue with it. Or reports otherwise. I would only ask those experiencing otherwise to help the rest of us appreciate how/why they got that. More efficient energy delivery to the wick surface should produce more vapor and flavor.Given your res on both coils is equal there would be no difference in lead efficiency. The non-contact coil will just be longer with less winds for a given res. The longer coil can actually be beneficial on a dripper where the terminals are further apart and often exceed the length of a contact coil.

Maybe not the best explanation but the wick delivers the juice to the coil. The percentage reaching the coil directly as by dripping or squonking is only a small part of that. There's actually a flow of fluid which far exceeds the incidental contact to the outer turns. Vaporization happens from the inside, not the outside. And the most active part of the coil is that which is touching the wet wick itself. That is where vaporization (the exchange of energy) is largely taking place. And this is why the amount of contact surface, it's uniformity of contact and consistent temperature are important. Exactly. With contact coils the wick can only contact the inside of the coil. With non-contact coils the wick can pooch out between the winds thereby offering more wick to wire surface area contact. The increased amount of juice in contact with the coil adds to the heatsink effect robbing the coil of heat.One of the reasons why non-contact coils require slightly more power for proper vaporization.This does not imo indicate a loss in efficiency but rather indicates simply that more juice is in contact with the coil.

Now, a lot of folks report that separated coil turns perform better. They can't electrically, not hand wound, as far less consistent and often shorting through lack of contact or undue proximity to others. They have to somewhat conform to a proper electrical wind in terms of symmetry or they're nowhere near as efficient and physically cannot deliver the efficiency to say produce an increase in vapor that would result in better flavor. Here here Mac, hand winds(winding on the wick) is not going to gitter dun. Tension winding on a screw mandrel (tensioned non-contact coil) offers all the benefits of tmc's save one....heatup time. A tncc will never heat as fast as a tmc partially due to increased juice-coil contact area and partially due to the lack of heat sharing between winds.But…a big but…some very dense juices can get easily clogged in a microcoil. That is true. That does not mean a microcoil or t.m.c. cannot deal with it. The laws of physics still apply regardless. Either it's efficient, or not. So it's a matter of finding the solution or compromise for that juice. In some cases rudy I don't think it's possible. Like extremely dense NET's. Not only will some not work in an m.c. or t.m.c, they'll hardly work in anything we might consider a vaporizer.
This is where tncc's shine.Dirty juices. The spaces between the winds allow the vapor to readily escape the coil instead of being shoved out the ends of a tmc. It just doesn't seem practical to send hot vapor back through the very wick that's responsible for delivering juice there to begin with if you're seeking maximum flavor or wick longevity. The wicking is a filter after all. Juices with larger pigments will get trapped in the wick travelling in both directions with tmc's; on the way in (liquid form) and on the way out (vapor form). Not so with tncc's. Only on the way in for the most part. That means more flavor molecules will reach the palate and the wicking lasts longer as stoney pigments are less likely to accumulate in the wick. These solidified pigments can and do seriously effect efficiency as well. After a while you are trying to heat a brick. Taking longer and longer draws to get the temp up.Think about what effect that has on battery life.
Often the answers are quite simple. People will actually buy a well made coil now and then, or build one, and find it doesn't produce. Most of us don't realize what's happened is that the coil needs two things we're not used to…more air and power! You just stepped hard on the gas pedal. There's a night and day difference between a standard wind and a proper electrical coil. If it's not observed, there's an element missing from the formula. This triangle is very similar in its dependencies to the combustion triangle (heat, fuel, air). Not enough air or power and you will flood the wick experiencing inadequate vaporization and ultimately junking your coil. That happens I'm afraid more often than not. I did it myself in early testing mistakenly concluding contact coils didn't work.

In your specific example, reducing wind count (same gauge) will cut your resistance not necessarily. Depends on how many winds were removed. With a tncc there is more wire needed for each turn to accommodate the spaces. and with voltage a constant you'd see more vapor (and perhaps flavor) simply from the resulting increase in power. And that by itself may have exceeded the net loss in efficiency. But that would not be necessarily more effective. The objective changed. It's about temperature. That's what we want to reproduce, consistently.An excellent point Mac. It is all about consistance temperature.

We'll it's pretty evident these days from the cloud blower results with microcoils we see everywhere that there's a whole lot of energy transfer going on. Again my concern is leveraging that technology to achieve a balance of flavor and vapor. That's the [lack of] compromise of efficiency I think most of us want.

In general a t.m.c. will let you put more turns in the same space, produce more heat transfer with the same wattage (or amps) and so more vapor…by virtue of the additional contact area (deflection of the wick) and uniformity of temperature delivery to the wick surface. You end up with a lesser percentile for the lead length (which btw is the measure of coil efficiency, electrically).see above The effect generally is that of a cooler vape at a given wattage. That is the dead giveaway you're getting efficiency. If the net effect of your non-contact wind is to produce more heat in your vape, you may get more cloud but have you actually vaporized more? If you haven't, where is the flavor coming from? And admittedly, I love clouds but not at the expense of flavor.

Coil separation my produce better flavor results for some with some juices. I've experienced it myself because I continue to test a variety of winding and wicking methods after analyzing many dozens of wick/wind approaches. My goal rudy is to get folks building a fundamentally correct baseline electrically. Then the sky's the limit. Then it's possible to analyze why a given juice might favor micro spaces between turns as you suggest or not (they're there in all coils, venting vapor).

But we got's to get 'em there first rud. That's where my head is at. I think the t.m.c.'s a good place to start because it's easy and easy to understand. But I build 'em all ways trying to find answers to your very question.Started my friends and family there too. Tmc's and protanks. Now that they have vaped tncc's for a few weeks now I am having a hard time getting any of them to revert back to tmc's to verify against the test metrics. Go figure.

I'm sure I haven't answered all your questions rudy. But I'd be happy to try based on what I've found so far. Few have run as much ceramic wick as I have in my studies. And it's my pleasure to share what I know.

Tap me on the shoulder anytime.

Take care and good luck.
_____________________________________________________________________________

Not gonna mince words with you gentlemen, LOL. The word deflection implies pooching. It's whatever part of the wick comes in contact with the coil (not at some point removed, we can only speculate at that calculation and its method). The deflection is what it is. It's based on the turns of wire and diameter. No magic here to spacing. The efficiency IS that contact surface. More lead length and wire length not in contact with coils is ineffeciency. Not my opinion but fact in electronics. Energy expended in the work is what we're calculating. Wire heating air is not producing work. In this case vaporization.

Wire length spent separating coils is not as efficient as the equivalent and additional wire length that could be deployed in a contact coil. So, the potential contact surface for a given length of element is increased. The lead length of a clearo is a constant. Increase the overall wind length by putting more turns into an element of a given lead length and you increase its work potential.

That ends the missive on efficiency.

Now, fellas who said vapor doesn't escape between the turns of an m.c. or t.m.c. (and it's under higher pressure so higher velocity). Can I see the proofs that it's a non-porous cylinder. My visual examinations would differ with the supposition.

I'm not gonna say you guys aren't gettin' the results you say. But the math don't suggest it. And I am truly very interested to understand the mechanics. You see if we understand what is happening it can be reproduced. I can't reproduce the effect you guys report. So you'll have to pardon my skepticism.

I will grant you the tight spacings (micro fissures and irregularities in a very tight t.m.c.) can close up very fast. Hours, as the coil surface accumulates caramelized deposits. That would seem to confirm your hypotheses if it could be demonstrated under magnification. However, vaporization is a violent process and even with t.m.c.'s turns have a tendency to have their adhesion disrupted and separation to ensue. So guys, I don't see the scientific explanation. That's my problem with your theory cig. The basis for the inefficiency cited is flawed by omission.

What I do see is that Nextel's hollow core delivers juice alongside the internal weave's inter-fiber channels. Heat pushes juice progressively along to channels more adjacent to the surface. Near the wick's surface channel flow is to the surface of the wick (and coils) and towards each end of the wick. This effect of vaporization emitting from the fiber channels is more readily apparent in a vertical coil situation. Nextel itself can be incredibly conductive of heat being capable of internalizing heat of >2200 deg. F. (that's not happening here BTW, more likely in the 200-300 deg. F range and probably towards the low side (but haven't done the IR studies of a Nextel surface).

Just sayin' fellas. I love those NET's about as much as any tobacco lover could. If it's possible to do, let's see how to get there. So far the maintenance plan I suggested some time ago cig, preventing agglomeration of pigments at the coil surface by frequent washing (using Nextel), is working for me with very dense juices to as much as quadruple the time I experience with alternatives. And why I'm a big fan.

Nevertheless, being the ever constant skeptic even of my own conclusions I'm undertaking another examination of spaced and multi-wire windings (for tobacco).

Best of luck to us fellas!

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...yxwick-non-cotton-people-82.html#post13853744

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## Andre (9/8/14)

*And specially for the Reonauts another response to the initial reasoning:*

I don't dispute the science, I love physics. However I think part of equation is missing and we have multiple use cases being discuss without the impact of those being considered.

I'm a bottom feeder(say that in public). So my wick does not sit in a juice reservoir and gain the benefit of the wicking action like a wick that has a reservoir. When I feed juice my coil and wicks get's fully saturated with juice for a few seconds but then all excess drains away, with a tight micro coil juice is only on the ends of the wick for a few seconds and I have to rely on the capillary action to "wick" the juice through out the coil. My theory is the open spacing of coils for those few seconds of juice supply allows the wick to absorb more total juice than the tight micro coil does and this translates into more flavor for me.

Reactions: Like 4 | Agree 1


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## Nooby (9/8/14)

Very interesting actually, going to try twisted 28g ugly coil tomorrow..

And here some people think vaping is boring!

I belive vaping to be some what of an art. You tweak it ever so slightly to get your perfect work of art (vapor,flavor and throat hit)

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## Tom (9/8/14)

i have recoiled the Enigma today, with 0.50mm wire, 5 wraps on a M3 tap. Got decent spacing. Came out at 0.7 ohms and vapes like a beast. Flavour great as well....and its single coil! Definitely keeping that in my repertoire

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## Silver (9/8/14)

Thanks for sharing the detailed comments @Andre 
Most interesting!

My gut feeling on that one spaced coil that CVS posted was that the wick edges upward between the coils increasing the surface area contact. 

I need to experiment with spaced coils, thanks

What has your experience been between compressed and spaced coils?


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## RATZ (9/8/14)

Any want to try this:


For science of course.

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## capetocuba (9/8/14)

@Cape vaping supplies made me a 5 wrap twisted ugly (gapped) coil using 30g kanthal. Have just twisted my first coil 

Now to build!

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## Paulie (9/8/14)

interesting read thanks @Andre ! I think it would be cool to hear from everyone who has tried both and what there thoughts are.


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## Andre (9/8/14)

Silver said:


> Thanks for sharing the detailed comments @Andre
> Most interesting!
> 
> My gut feeling on that one spaced coil that CVS posted was that the wick edges upward between the coils increasing the surface area contact.
> ...


 
The difference is not much, but think I am leaning towards spaced coils for bottom feeders at this time. For single coil. Have not yet tried spaced coils on dual coils.

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## Paulie (9/8/14)

@Andre having read this I just did my first attempt at a ugly coil and did 5 wraps spaced out 0.57 and am going to see how it goes today. ill give some feedback later as I just plonked vm4 (my juice I like to test) in. I must say after 8 last night everything tasted like cardboard lol so hope that's gone.

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## johan (9/8/14)

Yip agree 100% for my personal taste in a bottom feeder, an ugly coil outperforms a neat micro coil.

Reactions: Like 3 | Agree 2


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## TylerD (9/8/14)

Can't remember when last I made a neat coil for the Reo.

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## Andre (9/8/14)

Nooby said:


> Very interesting actually, going to try twisted 28g ugly coil tomorrow..
> 
> And here some people think vaping is boring!
> 
> I belive vaping to be some what of an art. You tweak it ever so slightly to get your perfect work of art (vapor,flavor and throat hit)


Let us know how you found it.
So true about the art. And the challenge always lies in replicating that perfect one!

Reactions: Agree 2


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## devdev (9/8/14)

paulph201 said:


> @Andre having read this I just did my first attempt at a ugly coil and did 5 wraps spaced out 0.57 and am going to see how it goes today. ill give some feedback later as I just plonked vm4 (my juice I like to test) in. I must say after 8 last night everything tasted like cardboard lol so hope that's gone.


 
Lol that's because I know what you were up to last night....

So I got some of those vaping donuts from FDV, and I have one in the Reo, with Rayon. Flavour is on par with a Ribbon ugly wrapped around Ewokfur... vapor production is not that high, but throat hit is good - which is funny because I am not really a TH vaper but I am enjoying it.

Good post @Andre, I think I am one of the few Reonauts who still uses RTAs on a daily basis, so there is plenty of food for thought here. So far going ugly coils on the Russians doesn't work as well as microcoil on cotton. On Reo / bottom feeder I think ugly wins

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## capetocuba (9/8/14)

First attempts ...

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## devdev (9/8/14)

capetocuba said:


> First attempts ...


Nice work @capetocuba 
If you toast those coils and pinch them they will come out just right....as microcoils

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## Arctus (9/8/14)

Never used a bottom feeder myself, so I have no experience there, but on a dripper I prefer spaced coils.
My preference is towards flavor though.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Yiannaki (9/8/14)

capetocuba said:


> First attempts ...


If you don't want these guys, send them to me  lol.

I'm itching to get some twisted coils going. I need a drill and that allen key though!

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## huffnpuff (9/8/14)

HUGE Thanx !

Very Noob to all of this. Got my coiling for my kayfun sorted quite quick, but I've been struggling get something decent going for dripping that doesn't burn my bek/lungs to get good vape/taste results. The incremental heat from microcoils just gets too much for me. Also not a fan of snap, crackle and pop in my coils as this usually means spatter or a hot droplet or 2 on the tongue when using the drip.

After reading this , tried something different with the above philosophy in mind, and.... AWESOME! The most gentlest dense vape for me so far. Been chain vaping on it for an hour now  using zero VG juices and I'm so impressed. Vapes like a beast with no heat. Straight-to-lung is so effortless with this.

Here it is: Sort-of a stuffed chimney: 5 turns of 26 gauge over a 5mm copper screw (spare screw for my pool net Lol) , used a knife tip for tweaking the spacing. Get 1.1Ω on the DNA clone. My positive post is higher than the negs, so just mounted the coil vertically and screwed in a dense worm of cotton till it hit the bottom of the deck, cut the top off and padded a bit on the bottom to assist with feeding. Covers a lot of area, and generates alot of fine vape without too much heat. A gentle giant:

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## Jebula999 (22/1/16)

Sup Vapes,

So i got my RX200 today, and been messing with temp control and SS316L wire.


I have two setups.

1. Single spaced coil, 26g, around 10 wraps. Comes to 0.52ohm. Running 30W @160 degrees
2. Dual coil, 26g, compressed, 12 wraps each. Comes to 0.33ohm. Running 40W @230 degrees.


The question is why does the single spaced coil, at 160 degrees feel so hot and give so much vapor while the one running the dual compressed coils at 230 degrees feels like i'm breathing in normal air.

Both setups reach the "Temp Protection" point, so they both reaching their max. Yet they are so different.

Would someone be able to explain the impact of spaced vs compressed and dual vs single while using Temp Control.

**EDIT**
Now i'm confused.. I put back on my single setup. And it is only getting warm at around 220 degrees when 160 used to be warm... Am i missing something here?

Reactions: Agree 1


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## KimVapeDashian (22/1/16)

Jebula999 said:


> Sup Vapes,
> 
> So i got my RX200 today, and been messing with temp control and SS316L wire.
> 
> ...



If i was to space a guess I'd be of the opinion that:

A coil with a higher resistance, will heat up faster than a coil of lower resistance. Now, Temperature control, is just a term for effectively "resistance measurement & adjustment".

SS, has a predetermined ratio TCR - which means that for a change in resistance there is a change in temperature - relevant to the ambient/resting temperature and resistance.

If you vape a setup, after building it - 90% chance is that your coils ambient temp is already higher than what the mod would "think" it is (firing coils, positioning etc)... therefore, your "base" resistance and temperature are elevated - if you switch tanks, and let that one cool down, you will find that you will set your temp higher, as your resistance and "room" temperature have settled.

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## Jebula999 (22/1/16)

KimVapeDashian said:


> If you vape a setup, after building it - 90% chance is that your coils ambient temp is already higher than what the mod would "think" it is (firing coils, positioning etc)... therefore, your "base" resistance and temperature are elevated - if you switch tanks, and let that one cool down, you will find that you will set your temp higher, as your resistance and "room" temperature have settled.



The thing is a made sure the coil was cooled down before i locked in resistance. Before and after i swopped out tanks.


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## KimVapeDashian (22/1/16)

Jebula999 said:


> The thing is a made sure the coil was cooled down before i locked in resistance. Before and after i swopped out tanks.


There goes my theory...

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## Darryn Du Plessis (1/2/16)

Spaced coils adjust to temperature differences quicker than the compressed ones that will hold the set temperature for long due to the compression of space between them. 

Space it for life. I don't ever need to lock my resistance, as I never see it skyrocketing due to temperature increased. Vapes so smooth. Stainless steel for the win  don't compress it, or not completely at least. It's springy for a reason: to adjust to the varying temperatures you set it to.

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## Nightwalker (21/2/16)

Heres what I think I've found but not sure.
In my Griffin I've been using compressed 26/32 dual 3mmID Claptons. Wonderful. 


But.
For sheets and giggles, I just did a spaced 26g dual 3mmID standard build in the Griffin.


Now

Here's the question.
Besides basically no ramp up time, it feels to me that the spaced coils juice up faster on spaced coils. Am I crazy?

I'll do spaced Claptons if it's true.

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## zadiac (21/2/16)

You are right. They do juice up faster. I put my cotton bacon very very tight in my spaced coils and they still wick very fast and I can feel a dry hit coming a mile away. I only do space coils.

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## Nightwalker (21/2/16)

zadiac said:


> You are right. They do juice up faster. I put my cotton bacon very very tight in my spaced coils and they still wick very fast and I can feel a dry hit coming a mile away. I only do space coils.


OK, so I'm not seeing things. Shot bud


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## zadiac (21/2/16)

They also don't burn your wick in half like compressed coils sometimes do. That's the main reason why I don't use compressed coils. I can go a very long time with my spaced coils without re-wicking because the wicks last longer.

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## BibbyBubbly (21/2/16)

I agree. I was rewicking every 3rd or so day, now I can go at least a week and I have not experienced any dry hits.

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## NewOobY (21/2/16)

ey love this forum, everyday I read something that is ultra helpful - thanks for the question @Nightwalker and thanks for the awesome answers @zadiac. I wonder how the spaced clapton is going to be. Let me know please, cause I still have a helluva lot of clapton wire.

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## Alex (21/2/16)

I prefer the flavour from compressed coils... Each to his own I guess.

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## Andre (21/2/16)

Contact coils only for me too. For me spaced coils tend to spit.

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## zadiac (21/2/16)

Alex said:


> I prefer the flavour from compressed coils... Each to his own I guess.





Andre said:


> Contact coils only for me too. For me spaced coils tend to spit.



All right you two, be otherwise

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## skola (21/2/16)

Spaced coils for the win!!

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## johan (21/2/16)

I use spaced (aka ugly) coils 99% of the time.

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## ShaneW (21/2/16)

I find after I have rewicked tight coils I get a slightly burnt taste for about an hour or so. I assume it's because the contact area is not able to get enough juice initially.

I only use Scottish roll and really pack it in there. What I love about Scottish roll is I never get a full dry hit, because there is so much wick, there is always some juice hidden in the middle, only just a loss of flavour or scratchyness to remind me to drip again.

If I had more space I'd run spaced...

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## Nightwalker (21/2/16)

Alex said:


> I prefer the flavour from compressed coils... Each to his own I guess.


I can't argue. I have noticed that there is less flavour with spaced coils. But even with 3mmID, the wicking is slower when vaping

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## Alex (21/2/16)

ShaneW said:


> I find after I have rewicked tight coils I get a slightly burnt taste for about an hour or so. I assume it's because the contact area is not able to get enough juice initially.
> 
> I only use Scottish roll and really pack it in there. What I love about Scottish roll is I never get a full dry hit, because there is so much wick, there is always some juice hidden in the middle, only just a loss of flavour or scratchyness to remind me to drip again.
> 
> If I had more space I'd run spaced...



After dry burning/rinsing, I run some cotton through the coil to clean out any black stuff before rewicking.

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## ShaneW (21/2/16)

Alex said:


> After dry burning/rinsing, I run some cotton through the coil to clean out any black stuff before rewicking.



Makes sense will definitely try that, always focus on the outside but never the inside. 
I do get the burnt taste even with new coils though but learnt a new trick from a friend today... Pushed some juice through the coil and wet the contact area of the cotton before jamming it in and made a huge difference!

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## Nightwalker (21/2/16)

ShaneW said:


> Makes sense will definitely try that, always focus on the outside but never the inside.
> I do get the burnt taste even with new coils though but learnt a new trick from a friend today... Pushed some juice through the coil and wet the contact area of the cotton before jamming it in and made a huge difference!


 but I showed that to everyone on my Griffin wicking tutorial, no one ever reads my stuff. Lol

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## ShaneW (21/2/16)

Nightwalker said:


> but I showed that to everyone on my Griffin wicking tutorial, no one ever reads my stuff. Lol



I missed that sorry... Link pls


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## Nightwalker (21/2/16)

ShaneW said:


> I missed that sorry... Link pls


Ironically enough I'm looking for it now


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## Nightwalker (21/2/16)

ShaneW said:


> I missed that sorry... Link pls


http://www.ecigssa.co.za/griffin-rta-help.t19309/#post-322196

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## Nightwalker (21/2/16)

U should see the pics


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## Lord Vetinari (21/2/16)

Random question as I am about to start my first RTA mission. I have been reading a LOT in the last few days so I might be wrong, but somebody suggested vacuum priming wicks and as far as I recall this was to speed up wicking and make it completely even. No air gaps so the law of adhesion has full effect. Would this not be the solution then to get a best of both scenario? Compressed coils with vacuum primed cotton? Because that is the impression I had until I read through this thread now I am just confused again lol...


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## Lord Vetinari (21/2/16)

Whoops scratch that just realized the link i opened covers this looool

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## Rob Fisher (21/2/16)

Lord Vetinari said:


> Random question as I am about to start my first RTA mission. I have been reading a LOT in the last few days so I might be wrong, but somebody suggested vacuum priming wicks and as far as I recall this was to speed up wicking and make it completely even. No air gaps so the law of adhesion has full effect. Would this not be the solution then to get a best of both scenario? Compressed coils with vacuum primed cotton? Because that is the impression I had until I read through this thread now I am just confused again lol...



The Vacuum priming was to do with the ceramic coils I'm sure... they are a ***** to prime!


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## Nightwalker (21/2/16)

Lord Vetinari said:


> Random question as I am about to start my first RTA mission. I have been reading a LOT in the last few days so I might be wrong, but somebody suggested vacuum priming wicks and as far as I recall this was to speed up wicking and make it completely even. No air gaps so the law of adhesion has full effect. Would this not be the solution then to get a best of both scenario? Compressed coils with vacuum primed cotton? Because that is the impression I had until I read through this thread now I am just confused again lol...


I always do that. What we debating is the constant juice to wick speed ratio.. Pls pls always "vacum" your wicks. Nothing ruins your mood than a freshly burnt wick

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## Nightwalker (21/2/16)

Rob Fisher said:


> The Vacuum priming was to do with the ceramic coils I'm sure... they are a ***** to prime!


Rob, the dolphin coil actually almost juices itself. I never have had a problem, I can't speak to other ceramic coils though


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## CloudmanJHB (22/2/16)

I started with only compressed and have now moved over to spaced due to the longer life of the wick, but i suppose it depends on the mood i'm in.

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## Greyz (22/2/16)

@Nightwalker what coils do you prefer in your TFv4? I tried spaced on my dual deck but kept getting dry burns on long hits 
Right now I have been only using compressed coils and alot of wick to avoid this. Maybe I should use less wick in a spaced coil?
If anyone can give me some pointers I'd happily give spaced coils a go again.


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## Nightwalker (22/2/16)

Greyz said:


> @Nightwalker what coils do you prefer in your TFv4? I tried spaced on my dual deck but kept getting dry burns on long hits
> Right now I have been only using compressed coils and alot of wick to avoid this. Maybe I should use less wick in a spaced coil?
> If anyone can give me some pointers I'd happily give spaced coils a go again.


I use a Griffin and at the moment I'm using 26g spaced 3mnID dual coils as a test. I used less wick thickness in the coil than I would for Claptons as I'm vaping at 40W with this setup. Its OK, but when I recoil, I'm going back to Clapton, there is a flavour difference. IMO


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## Nightwalker (22/2/16)

Greyz said:


> @Nightwalker what coils do you prefer in your TFv4? I tried spaced on my dual deck but kept getting dry burns on long hits
> Right now I have been only using compressed coils and alot of wick to avoid this. Maybe I should use less wick in a spaced coil?
> If anyone can give me some pointers I'd happily give spaced coils a go again.


A friend who vapes tvf4 uses parral coils, and loves it


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## Greyz (22/2/16)

Nightwalker said:


> I use a Griffin and at the moment I'm using 26g spaced 3mnID dual coils as a test. I used less wick thickness in the coil than I would for Claptons as I'm vaping at 40W with this setup. Its OK, but when I recoil, I'm going back to Clapton, there is a flavour difference. IMO


I found the flavour to be a little muted on spaced coils. I thought I was the only one till I read here. I had a 5 wrap spaced clapton in the TFv4 and didn't like it at all.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Greyz (22/2/16)

Nightwalker said:


> A friend who vapes tvf4 uses parral coils, and loves it


Parallel Kanthal or SS? 
there's an idea.... parallel Kanthal and SS


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## Nightwalker (22/2/16)

Greyz said:


> Parallel Kanthal or SS?
> there's an idea.... parallel Kanthal and SS


Don't do that. Lol. He has done both. Atm he is using SS.


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## Greyz (22/2/16)

Nightwalker said:


> Don't do that. Lol. He has done both. Atm he is using SS.



I have a lot of 26g SS laying around at home so I'm sorted there. Should I just do a straight parallel coil or do you think I should I just go for twisted SS coils?


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## Greyz (22/2/16)

Nightwalker said:


> Don't do that. Lol. He has done both. Atm he is using SS.



I have a lot of 26g SS laying around at home so I'm sorted there. Should I just do a straight parallel coil or do you think I should I just go for twisted SS coils?


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## BeardedVaper93 (22/2/16)

Greyz said:


> I have a lot of 26g SS laying around at home so I'm sorted there. Should I just do a straight parallel coil or do you think I should I just go for twisted SS coils?



i have a dual twisted 26g ss setup in my velocity... oh so tasty!!!

Reactions: Like 1


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## Nightwalker (22/2/16)

Greyz said:


> I have a lot of 26g SS laying around at home so I'm sorted there. Should I just do a straight parallel coil or do you think I should I just go for twisted SS coils?


Twisted is good too. I use normal parral coils but twisted is lekker


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## RoRy13 (22/2/16)

Nightwalker said:


> Heres what I think I've found but not sure.
> In my Griffin I've been using compressed 26/32 dual 3mmID Claptons. Wonderful.
> 
> 
> ...



I had the same experience as you on the griffin. The flavour also seems better with normal spaced coils

Reactions: Informative 1


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## Nightwalker (22/2/16)

RoRy13 said:


> I had the same experience as you on the griffin. The flavour also seems better with normal spaced coils


I'm going back to Claptons, but I'll space them. I love the coverage they give.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Greyz (22/2/16)

Nightwalker said:


> Don't do that. Lol. He has done both. Atm he is using SS.



I have a lot of 26g SS laying around at home so I'm sorted there. Should I just do a straight parallel coil or do you think I should I just go for twisted SS coils?


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## Nightwalker (22/2/16)

So people were asking about spaced Claptons. I had to recoil and wick my Griffin as I broke my glass tank. 
So I built.. 26/32 dual 5 wrap spaced Claptons with a 3.5 ID. Vaping at 60W.
I don't like warm vaping, first of all. More flavour. I have a habit of blowing into tank before I inhale, (don't know why) so the ramp up time is nothing. Also with 3.5ID coils, its a juicy hit. No spit back. And I think it will be hard to get a dry hit.
Verdict, I don't know anymore, spaced and compressed have there equal ups and downs.


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## RIEFY (22/2/16)

In tanks I have only been doing spaced for a very long time prefer spaced over compressed in a tank. On a dripper compressed.
Different strokes for different folks


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Reactions: Like 2


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## jguile415 (22/2/16)

Nightwalker said:


> A friend who vapes tvf4 uses parral coils, and loves it


Single twisted 26g spaced SS rocks in the tfv4!

Reactions: Thanks 1


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## BeardedVaper93 (23/2/16)

what about a coil setup like this?

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## zadiac (23/2/16)

Guys, do a simple zipper coil.
Twist 2 x 28g clockwise
Twist 2 x 28g anti-clockwise
Put two diff strands together and wind coil in parallel so the twisted strands look like a zipper.
You won't believe the flavor of this. I've done it a few times and regularly go back to it because of the flavor.
This is the only compressed coil I ever make, but I guess you can do the parallel in spaced as well, like this:





Just my 2c

Reactions: Like 1 | Thanks 1


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## Nightwalker (23/2/16)

zadiac said:


> Guys, do a simple zipper coil.
> Twist 2 x 28g clockwise
> Twist 2 x 28g anti-clockwise
> Put two diff strands together and wind coil in parallel so the twisted strands look like a zipper.
> ...


A zipper coil? Holy cow. OK, I'm going to try that on payday


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## zadiac (23/2/16)

A few images of zipper coils:






















You don't have to flatten the surfaces like in some of these build, that is only done to make if look fancy and it may improve surface contact a little, but it's not necessary. The flavor off a normal zipper coils is awesome enough!

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## Clouder (23/2/16)

I used to do compressed coils, but now I only do spaced as well. I'm on the Fibrefreaks Cotton Nr2 which is like a sheet of cotton but it doesn't have the fluffy bit in between the two outer layers...... A bit p!ssed that I didn't take the Nr1 as it's quite difficult to wick with Nr2. Also, in the Mutation tank, it uses a lot of wick which results in a dry hit VERY quickly! I find that using a spaced coil resolves this problem instantly.


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## Nightwalker (23/2/16)

Clouder said:


> I used to do compressed coils, but now I only do spaced as well. I'm on the Fibrefreaks Cotton Nr2 which is like a sheet of cotton but it doesn't have the fluffy bit in between the two outer layers...... A bit p!ssed that I didn't take the Nr1 as it's quite difficult to wick with Nr2. Also, in the Mutation tank, it uses a lot of wick which results in a dry hit VERY quickly! I find that using a spaced coil resolves this problem instantly.


Why the hell would they make flat cotton for wicking????
But yeah, spaced coils juice faster


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## Clouder (23/2/16)

@Nightwalker I don't know man! Quite difficult to work with, however, the flavour is great!

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## Nightwalker (23/2/16)

My first twisted wire 26g I've ever made. No drill used.


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## zadiac (23/2/16)

For zipper coils they need to be twisted much tighter than that

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## zadiac (23/2/16)

Nightwalker said:


> I was sitting on my bed. To lazy to walk to garage to get drill. Used a pen and pliers. Sigh. I'll use this in my ECR head for the Ijust2 tank. And try again. Lol



Did this quickly just now. Twisted 28g kanthal zipper parallel with 25g kanthal. 7 wraps zipper with 5 wraps 25g. Comes to .17*Ω*
You can leave out the other wire and just do the zipper. Ohms should be above .2 but you can do more wraps for higher ohms.







Did this very quickly (about 5 minutes from start to finish) and it's not very neat, but the flavor is awesome. Very full taste.

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## Nightwalker (23/2/16)

zadiac said:


> Did this quickly just now. Twisted 28g kanthal zipper parallel with 25g kanthal. 7 wraps zipper with 5 wraps 25g. Comes to .17*Ω*
> You can leave out the other wire and just do the zipper. Ohms should be above .2 but you can do more wraps for higher ohms.
> 
> 
> ...


That is awesome. Master Jedi you are. Padawan I am


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## Greyz (23/2/16)

@Zadiac thanks for the quick tutorial - now if only work would end so I can go home and try this shyte out 

EDIT: My apologies Zadiac

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## Soutie (26/9/16)

So i have been playing around with making my own coils for a while now and have had some great success with both compressed and spaced coils but was wondering if there is there any real science to which to use when and why, any rules of thumb or tips and tricks.

I started playing around with compressed coils but noticed that as I was adding more wraps to the coil I was increasing my chance of dry hits if chain vaping, especially at higher wattages. Ive been building with Stainless steel mostly as I like playing with the TC but these dry hits would happen regardless of running on TC or not. I think its due to the fact the center of the coil doesn't have time to cool down quickly enough and if the compressed coil is too long you run the risk of the center of the wick getting dry.

Changing to a spaced coil it has solved this problem and no more dry hits, I can now chain vape with out a problem. The TC also seems to work a helluva lot better with the spaced coil which got me thinking as to when would you prefer to use a compressed coil over a spaced coil?

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## Silver (26/9/16)

I have not experienced much with long coils with plenty wraps - just 6 or 7 wraps.
And I mainly use thinner Kanthal (around 28g)
Have experimented mostly in the Reo - so my coils have been small ID coils - around 1.6mm ID.

With that in mind, I have found that I prefer compressed coils over spaced. 
It seems the contact coils get hotter and give me a crisper vape. 
The spaced coils often spit and I find the vape is not as crisp.

I am not a temp control vaper but from what I understood, with Nickel coils, one needs to go spaced for temp control because it works better that way. Not sure about SS though.

Reactions: Can relate 1


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## Soutie (26/9/16)

NI200 you pretty much have to use spaced as you cant really bed the coils in. With the SS I've been dropping the gauge from 26 to 24 to be able to add more wraps, my logic being that more wraps = more surface area = better vape but it seems there might be an upper limit on the amount of wraps you can do.

Funny enough I seem to get a slightly better flavor when the coils are spaced too, and less spitting. It could just be that I don't get that burned taste on occasion

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## SAVaper (26/9/16)

When using Kanthal i make them compressed. Easy and quick.
When using SS I make them spaced because I was told that SS compressed in TC might cause a short on the coil. Not sure how accurate my info is but that is what I do.
Want to test the Ni soon


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## Yiannaki (26/9/16)

Soutie said:


> So i have been playing around with making my own coils for a while now and have had some great success with both compressed and spaced coils but was wondering if there is there any real science to which to use when and why, any rules of thumb or tips and tricks.
> 
> I started playing around with compressed coils but noticed that as I was adding more wraps to the coil I was increasing my chance of dry hits if chain vaping, especially at higher wattages. Ive been building with Stainless steel mostly as I like playing with the TC but these dry hits would happen regardless of running on TC or not. I think its due to the fact the center of the coil doesn't have time to cool down quickly enough and if the compressed coil is too long you run the risk of the center of the wick getting dry.
> 
> Changing to a spaced coil it has solved this problem and no more dry hits, I can now chain vape with out a problem. The TC also seems to work a helluva lot better with the spaced coil which got me thinking as to when would you prefer to use a compressed coil over a spaced coil?



I tend to go the spaced coil route mostly in tanks. I find it seems to assist with wicking. I agree with you 100% TC with spaced SS works far better than compressed. I must be of the few who still uses Ni200 

Drippers on the other hand don't run the issue of not wicking efficiently, and i find the compress coils produce a hotter, denser vape on the dripper. Oddly enough, the spaced coils for me on a dripper always end up spitting back at some point. 

With regard to accuracy of TC with SS, I recall reading that the lower the resistance of the SS coil, the less drastic the change in resistance will be when the coil is heated, which effectively would mean a less accurate TC.

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## Andre (26/9/16)

Yiannaki said:


> I tend to go the spaced coil route mostly in tanks. I find it seems to assist with wicking. I agree with you 100% TC with spaced SS works far better than compressed. I must be of the few who still uses Ni200
> 
> Drippers on the other hand don't run the issue of not wicking efficiently, and i find the compress coils produce a hotter, denser vape on the dripper. Oddly enough, the spaced coils for me on a dripper always end up spitting back at some point.
> 
> With regard to accuracy of TC with SS, I recall reading that the lower the resistance of the SS coil, the less drastic the change in resistance will be when the coil is heated, which effectively would mean a less accurate TC.


Spot on imo. Compressed coils, from a power point of view, are certainly more effective, but when it comes to tanks, for the sake of effective wicking, one has to forego that extra bit of effectiveness.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Thanks 1


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## Soutie (26/9/16)

SAVaper said:


> Want to test the Ni soon



Ni is really tough to work with, the resistance is so low and you need to run it spaced that it is a challenge even in a 25mm deck. Played with making a ni200 build yesterday and ended up with 13 wraps spaced, dual coil 26ga ni200 and that came in at 0.06Ω. Luckily the 350J chipset can go as low as 0.05 so i was able to run it and it is a really nice vape. Going 30 or 28 would start becoming quite fiddly to work with.



Yiannaki said:


> I tend to go the spaced coil route mostly in tanks. I find it seems to assist with wicking. I agree with you 100% TC with spaced SS works far better than compressed. I must be of the few who still uses Ni200
> 
> Drippers on the other hand don't run the issue of not wicking efficiently, and i find the compress coils produce a hotter, denser vape on the dripper. Oddly enough, the spaced coils for me on a dripper always end up spitting back at some point.
> 
> With regard to accuracy of TC with SS, I recall reading that the lower the resistance of the SS coil, the less drastic the change in resistance will be when the coil is heated, which effectively would mean a less accurate TC.



Drippers running compressed makes a lot of sense.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Rafique (26/9/16)

On a standard build 26g kanthal or stainless steel I used spaced coils and with Clapton I use compressed. These work for me


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## Igno (26/9/16)

I have recently moved from ss316 fused clapton to single 26g ss316 and I do 5-6 wraps, spaced and it's at 0.56 ohms. Great flavour and no spitback at all, also much lighter on batteries and juice compared to clapton IMO.


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## stevie g (26/9/16)

I will space a single strand coil but parallel strand coils I compress.

Most mods can't TC parallel compressed coil well but the Hohm Slice does it without breaking a sweat.

I have had the same experience with dry hits on a compressed single strand coil but for some reason going into parallel mitigates the dry hit effect.

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## zadiac (26/9/16)

I only do spaced coils. Flavor is better for me that way.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 1


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## blujeenz (26/9/16)

IMO the closeness of the compressed coils leads to sympathetic heating and messes with the TCR factor in TC.
I therefore do spaced on TC regardless of wire and compressed kanthal in watt mode.
Its a fine line between okay flavour with a compressed SS coil and burnt rubbish.
Added benefit of not having to dry burn exotic metals like SS Ni and Ti to make a decently performing coil, I'll go so far as to say a spaced coil wicks and vapourizes more juice than a compressed coil.

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## Warlock (26/9/16)

I was always concerned that the tightly wound/wrapped coils would somehow ’trap’ the vapour inside the coil (not the claptons, but the perfectly round wire). I don’t have a fancy coil making thingy so I didn’t know how to make a spaced coil. Anyway I built a setup for my Velocity V2, SS 316 l 26ga 9 wraps on a 2.5mm mandrill and spaced them best I could (dual coils 0.3 Ohms)

Well it works very well for me and I’m Happy with the vape I get. Thanks for the good people here and this thread for finally getting me to do a spaced coil.

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## Soutie (26/9/16)

It's seems like the cosensus is exactly what I've experienced, spaced seems to be better for both TC and tanks, compressed for RDA.

@Warlock, I find one of the easiest ways is to make a parelell coil then simply unscrew one from the other once it's made, your spacing is immaculate and you have 2 perfect coils

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## Yiannaki (26/9/16)

Soutie said:


> Ni is really tough to work with, the resistance is so low and you need to run it spaced that it is a challenge even in a 25mm deck. Played with making a ni200 build yesterday and ended up with 13 wraps spaced, dual coil 26ga ni200 and that came in at 0.06Ω. Luckily the 350J chipset can go as low as 0.05 so i was able to run it and it is a really nice vape. Going 30 or 28 would start becoming quite fiddly to work with.
> 
> 
> 
> Drippers running compressed makes a lot of sense.


Yeah getting the resistance right with ni is tricky. 

I do find ni200 to work best as a single coil though. I was never happy with duals.

I have had great success with either 26g single coils as well as twisted 30g 

Sent from my SM-N920C using Tapatalk


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## Rob Fisher (26/9/16)

The only time I ever do a spaced coil is for NI... personally I have found the flavour better on a tight coil... and my OCD hates a spaced untidy coil!

Reactions: Agree 1 | Funny 2


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## blujeenz (26/9/16)

Warlock said:


> I don’t have a fancy coil making thingy so I didn’t know how to make a spaced coil. Anyway I built a setup for my Velocity V2, SS 316 l 26ga 9 wraps on a 2.5mm mandrill and spaced them best I could (dual coils 0.3 Ohms)


Like @Soutie says wrap a parallel and unscrew the 2 from each other.
Fine demo by @BigGuy

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## Soutie (26/9/16)

Rob Fisher said:


> The only time I ever do a spaced coil is for NI... personally I have found the flavour better on a tight coil... and my OCD hates a spaced untidy coil!



I can get pretty OCD about getting my coils spaced decently too. I Don't think I did too bad of a job. This isn the 26g ni200 build I was talking about earlier.

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## johan (26/9/16)

I only do spaced coils (for the past 18 months+) on Ekowool, free hand - no OCD on my side.

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## Rob Fisher (26/9/16)

Soutie said:


> I can get pretty OCD about getting my coils spaced decently too. I Don't think I did too bad of a job. This isn the 26g ni200 build I was talking about earlier.
> 
> View attachment 69258



Now if I could make them look like that I could live with it!


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## Blu_Marlin (26/9/16)

Warlock said:


> I was always concerned that the tightly wound/wrapped coils would somehow ’trap’ the vapour inside the coil (not the claptons, but the perfectly round wire). I don’t have a fancy coil making thingy so I didn’t know how to make a spaced coil. Anyway I built a setup for my Velocity V2, SS 316 l 26ga 9 wraps on a 2.5mm mandrill and spaced them best I could (dual coils 0.3 Ohms)
> 
> Well it works very well for me and I’m Happy with the vape I get. Thanks for the good people here and this thread for finally getting me to do a spaced coil.


@Warlock have a look at this post. It`s a nice and easy way to build spaced coils. No need for the for the coiler tool, you can use screwdrivers, drillbits etc. You will get the same result.

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## Waine (26/9/16)

No wonder I am battling to get Stainless steel compressed coils to work on TC mode. My TC SS refuses to work on My RX 2/3 and Pico Mega. I must try spaced coils. Thanks for the useful information in this thread.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Ezekiel (29/9/16)

For the record, compressed coils have to be dry-burned to get rid of hot spots. Dry-burning expands the coil a little bit (not really noticeble), getting rid of hot-spots. Spaced coils generally don't have that problem. Any hot-spot on a coil with TC can wreck havoc. For that reason, compressed Ni coils are risky because you can't dry burn them, hence spaced. 

I still haven't noticed big differences between spaced and compressed. It mostly depends on the airflow for me, and how many wraps I'm planning. For cyclops airflow (such as on Velocity) I like to do spaced, but for round or directed airflow (Kennedy style, Crius, or round, such as Aromamizer) I like to do compressed. Matching in this way gives me the best flavour. I also have had bad experiences with long compressed coils (9+ wraps, I would guess), especially with small IDs, in line with what @blujeenz said. However, I've had anaemic TC vapes with spaced coils as well, especially with fewer wraps.

Reactions: Informative 1


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## KZOR (17/10/16)

I read in another post of a query concerning coil density and thought it would be interesting to get others takes on it.

When I used RDA's I used spaced coils, when build space allowed it, because I found to get less chance of dry hits, cotton lasted longer and coil build-up was less frequent.

I still use spaced 5 - 7 wrap 26g Claptons in all my RDA's since I seem to get more flavour because of a larger heated area. I also found coils when spaced to have less hotspots. Ohms are between 0.2 and 0.3 so heating the coil is still fast. Cooling also seems to be more efficient. Tanks got hot alot quicker and stayed hot for longer periods when I had tight coil builds.

Everyone has, and rightly so, their own preferred way but would still be interesting to hear what others prefer.


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## Atsbitscrisp (17/10/16)

I am not the most experienced builder yet, however, I found similar tendencies in my vaping too. Never found great joy in close packed claptons, and thats the way most people seem to build them. Tried ni80 and got hooked on the flavour from the wire. Been using spaced ni80 for a bit now in the avos and loving it. I need to try the claptons again cause I now got a dripper. Will try it spaced and hopefully, I can find a little more joy.

I was finding the flavour on close packed claptons a little muted and also suffered from dry hits and burnt wicks. I have one of my diy advs which is quite heavy on sweetner so it used to gunk up the coil way too quickly. Dry burning the coil just made it taste metallic and the ohm readings on the dry burnt coils were all over the place afterwards so I gave up on the whole clapton concept for a bit. Running twisted and spaced ni80 has been a revolution for me. Nice low ohm builds, clean flavours, nothing burnt besides a finger and an unfortunate bug... but I guess I need to try spaced claptons in the rda for next coil change.


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## PsyCLown (17/10/16)

I much prefer compressed / tight coils, I find the flavour lacks with spaced coils. I also much prefer RDA's over tanks.

Also with spaced coils you should not need to do any dry burns as there shouldn't really be any hotspots.
I only get dry hits when I forget to drip again.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Chukin'Vape (17/10/16)

I've never really got into the whole space game, because I simply have no idea how to perfectly space gaps between my wraps - i'll just simply cringe if they were not perfect. In my honest opinion the times I have tried spaced claptons I wasn't getting dense warm vapour, so I just gave up. My brain tends towards the more surface area debate. So yah TOIT on this side. When you are using captons, fused claptons, or any exotic coils - if you are wrapping them TOIT, they have enough breathing spaces for the vapour to escape.


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## Chukin'Vape (17/10/16)

KZOR said:


> I read in another post of a query concerning coil density and thought it would be interesting to get others takes on it.
> 
> When I used RDA's I used spaced coils, when build space allowed it, because I found to get less chance of dry hits, cotton lasted longer and coil build-up was less frequent.
> 
> ...





Chukin'Vape said:


> I've never really got into the whole space game, because I simply have no idea how to perfectly space gaps between my wraps - i'll just simply cringe if they were not perfect. In my honest opinion the times I have tried spaced claptons I wasn't getting dense warm vapour, so I just gave up. My brain tends towards the more surface area debate. So yah TOIT on this side. When you are using captons, fused claptons, or any exotic coils - if you are wrapping them TOIT, they have enough breathing spaces for the vapour to escape.



@KZOR @Atsbitscrisp


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## KZOR (17/10/16)

I think the title  of this thread needs to be changed.
There is absolutely nothing ugly about my spaced coils. 
With the toolkits available these days you can make a spaced coil perfectly symmetrical and uniform.


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## Anneries (17/10/16)

KZOR said:


> With the toolkits available these days you can make a spaced coil perfectly symmetrical and uniform.



The correct tools does help, but the video by SirVape also helps A LOT, you can build two extremely close to identical coils evenly spaced based on his method of wrapping them together and unscrewing one. It is also a very quick way of wrapping them, since you are actually only doing one coil. Have been using his method for all duel coils since the day I saw it. I even do it when I build for the Serpent Mini, I just save the extra coil for later use.


BigGuy said:


> HAd a few people ask me how i do nicely spaced coils.

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## Chukin'Vape (17/10/16)

Anneries said:


> The correct tools does help, but the video by SirVape also helps A LOT, you can build two extremely close to identical coils evenly spaced based on his method of wrapping them together and unscrewing one. It is also a very quick way of wrapping them, since you are actually only doing one coil. Have been using his method for all duel coils since the day I saw it. I even do it when I build for the Serpent Mini, I just save the extra coil for later use.


Thats pretty clever, so you rock a parallel wrap - and unscrew them. Nooooooice - this will work lekke for regular clapton - nothing heavier tho.


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## Rob Fisher (17/10/16)

KZOR said:


> I think the title  of this thread needs to be changed.



Done!

Reactions: Like 1 | Funny 1


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## Chukin'Vape (17/10/16)

Andre said:


> *Came accross an interesting discussion on ECF on this question. The part in black below was MacTechVpr's answer to this question by one Rudy. The part in blue was another member's response. And the last part (below the line) was MacTechVpr's reply to this response. You be the judge! Link to that page at the very bottom.*
> 
> Thanks your question rudy. Hey look the basic premise of my efforts here to teach tension Tension, yes! Tension winding is the key to achieving consistant wick compression (deflection) on every part of every wind in the coil. Thanks Mac for that innovation!is to get new vapors thinking in terms of basic electronics. What works most efficiently. Shorts less. Yes, shorts less. What I call hot spots.Delivers better vapor production. Simply attainable techniques. I never dreamed that tension coils could work that well myself. I'd been actually devoting my efforts to tensioned screw wraps and was extremely skeptical of the contact coil…for about two weeks! If I hadn't perfected the rest of the electrical principles to make it work in a tight tank rudy, I would've failed. But having accomplished that I've been trying to pay it back and get as many newcomers through as quickly as possible.
> 
> ...


Thanks for posting this - I can now confidently answer this question going forward, what was lekke to read is that my personal experience / findings support what is said here. This settles it. THANKS

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## KZOR (17/10/16)

I use my jig to do the same thing and it works like a bomb as well.





Also did a pair of 26ga Tigers

Reactions: Like 1 | Winner 2


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## Chukin'Vape (17/10/16)

KZOR said:


> I use my jig to do the same thing and it works like a bomb as well.
> View attachment 72004
> View attachment 72005
> View attachment 72008
> ...


Neat work bro - seriously... lots of respect was just gained! Will defo try this technique!!! Here is my build from today - when I say lots of wire and TOIT, this is what I meant.

Reactions: Thanks 1


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## Waine (17/10/16)

This spacing technique with the jig looks interesting. Can someone please explain how in more detail. A video clip would be great, or a step by step with pics.


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## KZOR (17/10/16)

Waine said:


> Can someone please explain how in more detail

Reactions: Like 2 | Creative 1


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## Waine (17/10/16)

@KZOR Thanks a ton. Definitely going to try this. 


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## 4RML (18/10/16)

Silver said:


> I have not experienced much with long coils with plenty wraps - just 6 or 7 wraps.
> And I mainly use thinner Kanthal (around 28g)
> Have experimented mostly in the Reo - so my coils have been small ID coils - around 1.6mm ID.
> 
> ...


Man if some builders made you wire like say start small for the reo and all a ss 28g wrapped with a 46g or 40 G ni80 and you put that in a RDA for you , am just saying small is not a problem for exotica.


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## Silver (18/10/16)

4RML said:


> Man if some builders made you wire like say start small for the reo and all a ss 28g wrapped with a 46g or 40 G ni80 and you put that in a RDA for you , am just saying small is not a problem for exotica.



Never tried that @4RML - thanks for the thought.
Would imagine too much ramp up time on the Reo mech with a single 18650 cell though
Do you have a picture of such a coil? - perhaps the topic of another thread though


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## 4RML (18/10/16)

Silver said:


> Never tried that @4RML - thanks for the thought.
> Would imagine too much ramp up time on the Reo mech with a single 18650 cell though
> Do you have a picture of such a coil? - perhaps the topic of another thread though


Naaaa no pic but just a thought

Reactions: Like 1


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## Anneries (18/10/16)

Back to the topic of spaced vs compressed coils, Compressed is something that I aim for. But with everything else in vaping for me it is something that I work up to. I am making the spaces closer and closer together on my coils and working to get my wicking on point. 

I like spaced coils for the fact that I have never burned the wick in half like I have done a lot when I just started and did compact coils all the time.


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