# Help! First TC Build



## Franky (8/2/16)

Hey fellow vapers, after having built on kanthal I'm now trying to build my first TC coil on a Subtank Mini.

I have the following:


UD 26g SSL 316
Smok XCube 2
I'm confused as it's totally different as to building with Kanthal - no pulsing the coils til it glows red hot etc etc.

Can anyone give me advice?


----------



## Clouder (8/2/16)

I might have been wrong, I built my first SS coil last night and I did pulse it, but only for a fraction of a second. There was a smoke that came off it and then I wicked it....


----------



## Ernest (8/2/16)

A spaced coil is your friend with TC. No hot spots and always heats evenly. SS can be pulsed and even used in power mode so you are quite safe. 8 wraps on 2.5 spaced should give you a good coil for Subtank mini.

Reactions: Like 1 | Informative 1


----------



## Franky (8/2/16)

I got told yesterday to NOT do a spaced coil - I did my build on the coilmaster and ran it at 200 deg F at first - cut out after not even a sec. 350 deg just to test and boom - cotton on fire. The build was 0.43 ohm.
My XCube 2 is at it's latest firmware too with all TC modes supported and installed...


----------



## Ernest (8/2/16)

Franky said:


> I got told yesterday to NOT do a spaced coil - I did my build on the coilmaster and ran it at 200 deg F at first - cut out after not even a sec. 350 deg just to test and boom - cotton on fire. The build was 0.43 ohm.
> My XCube 2 is at it's latest firmware too with all TC modes supported and installed...


For TC you have to do spaced coil as most TC wires can not be pulsed to get rid of hot spots. Check your wattage or joules, it might be to high for the temperature setting you are vaping at.

Reactions: Agree 1


----------



## Franky (8/2/16)

Ernest said:


> For TC you have to do spaced coil as most TC wires can not be pulsed to get rid of hot spots. Check your wattage or joules, it might be to high for the temperature setting you are vaping at.


I had in on 19 watts... Upon closer inspection the cotton appears to be just fine - guessing the steel caught alight somehow?

The TCR on the XCube 2 for stainless steel is 0.00106 - is that correct?


----------



## Andre (8/2/16)

I have the TCR for SS316 as 0.000915

SS can be done contact or spaced. Pulsing is fine. Just do the first few pulses on a new coil very quick with strumming in between.

200F is but around 93C, which will barely heat up your coils - probably why it cut out. Start at around 390F.

Reactions: Informative 1


----------



## Kuhlkatz (8/2/16)

As @Andre said, there is no need for spaced coils on SS. SS can safely 'oxidize' just like kanthal and create an insulating layer on the outside. 
With Ni and Ti, this oxidization is the last thing you want, hence the requirement for spaced coils on those.

Strumming a compressed SS coil does work like a charm after the initial pulsing shows up hot spots. The best thing about SS is that you can use it in both Power and TC mode, with no worries. Be aware that SS coils are about half the resistance of their Kanthal equivalents, so keep that in mind for Mech builds.

I run my Subtank Mini in TC mode with SS-316L, but prefer my Billow v2 in power mode using the same 26G SS-316L.

Reactions: Like 1


----------



## rogue zombie (8/2/16)

Hey... @Andre @Kulhkats, so you guys are saying with SS316 I can coil as I normally do, and switch to TC?


----------



## rogue zombie (8/2/16)

So I could go up a guage, still getting low ohms, quick ramp up and keep the vape 'cool'?


----------



## Kuhlkatz (8/2/16)

@rogue zombie , no reason not to. I frequently switch my tanks from my Evic VTC mini to the iStick TC40 in Power mode or even switch between TC and Power modes on the Evic just to get a different vape off of it. @zadiac 's been using only SS for quite a while now, and he is swearing by it last I saw. He mostly uses mechs afaik, but I'm sure he got a Rolo that must have also seen some action.
I have not used Ti at all, but SS is quite easy to work with and even sturdier than Kanthal for a lekke tight wick. Ni was mostly just a PITA to wick, unless you used a twisted pair. Still gave a very good vape though 

As far as I'm concerned, I've made up my mind that SS is the safest bet in the TC game as there is no talk about seepage, poisonous gases or particles above temperature X etc. when dry-firing like with the other two.

The only snag is SS's low resistance, but most of the modern mods with decent high current batteries will fire safely with quite low builds. It's particularly on mechs that you need to calculate that you are 100% safe with the build and battery specs.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Winner 1


----------



## rogue zombie (8/2/16)

Kuhlkatz said:


> @rogue zombie , no reason not to. I frequently switch my tanks from my Evic VTC mini to the iStick TC40 in Power mode or even switch between TC and Power modes on the Evic just to get a different vape off of it. @zadiac 's been using only SS for quite a while now, and he is swearing by it last I saw. He mostly uses mechs afaik, but I'm sure he got a Rolo that must have also seen some action.
> I have not used Ti at all, but SS is quite easy to work with and even sturdier than Kanthal for a lekke tight wick. Ni was mostly just a PITA to wick, unless you used a twisted pair. Still gave a very good vape though
> 
> As far as I'm concerned, I've made up my mind that SS is the safest bet in the TC game as there is no talk about seepage, poisonous gases or particles above temperature X etc. when dry-firing like with the other two.
> ...



Thanks so much for the feedback, I may just give it a bash now.

I was put off in the beginning with the soft metal being hard to work with, since I'm heavy handed.
Then Paulie's post on metals further put me off, and topped off by seeing Andre selling a bunch of SS saying it was not for him.

So I just never payed more attention, and thought I would wait till its sorted. I carried on with thick Kanthal, low ohm builds at a cool temp.

Reactions: Like 1


----------



## zadiac (8/2/16)

I'm using SS317L permanently now. Haven't used it in TC yet. Just normal power mode.

Reactions: Like 2


----------



## Andre (8/2/16)

rogue zombie said:


> Hey... @Andre @Kulhkats, so you guys are saying with SS316 I can coil as I normally do, and switch to TC?


+1 on what @Kuhlkatz said. I actually quite liked Titanium, but do not like to be so careful about wire - especially since I used it for contact coils, which requires a really controlled way of pulsing and dry burning.


rogue zombie said:


> Thanks so much for the feedback, I may just give it a bash now.
> 
> I was put off in the beginning with the soft metal being hard to work with, since I'm heavy handed.
> Then Paulie's post on metals further put me off, and topped off by seeing Andre selling a bunch of SS saying it was not for him.
> ...


No, I did not sell my SS, only the Titanium for the reasons set out above. Also do not use Ni (too soft and too much trouble for me). Nowadays it is Kanthal, SS304 and NiFe52 - they can all be torched and dry burned well.

Reactions: Like 2 | Thanks 1


----------



## Franky (9/2/16)

OK guys, I was very wary of SS due to all the talk of poisonous gases etc etc. So if I'm correct, @Andre, I can build this in power mode spaced or non-spaced? I had parts of the coil turn black in my first 2 attempts to use TC on the XCube 2 so that scared the crap outta me  
So I can build it like a normal kanthal build, PULSE it instead of doing a dry burn like I do with kanthal, wick it then vape it e.g. 0.4 ohm build at 60watts on a Subtank Mini?


----------



## Andre (9/2/16)

Franky said:


> OK guys, I was very wary of SS due to all the talk of poisonous gases etc etc. So if I'm correct, @Andre, I can build this in power mode spaced or non-spaced? I had parts of the coil turn black in my first 2 attempts to use TC on the XCube 2 so that scared the crap outta me
> So I can build it like a normal kanthal build, PULSE it instead of doing a dry burn like I do with kanthal, wick it then vape it e.g. 0.4 ohm build at 60watts on a Subtank Mini?


Yes, build like normal Kanthal, spaced or contact. Pulse and strum when new to get it to settle, and glow evenly and remove hot spots and hot legs - then wick. Dry burn thereafter when rewicking.

Not sure how the Smok works, but on most TC mods you have to lock in your resistance for TC vaping. If so, be sure to first cool the deck down to room temperature.

Reactions: Like 1


----------



## BuzzGlo (9/2/16)

I havent been able to get a lekkah build, actually given up on ss is it really worth it ? ...


----------



## Christos (9/2/16)

BuzzGlo said:


> I havent been able to get a lekkah build, actually given up on ss is it really worth it ? ...


Yes it is. SS has a nice clean crisp flavour that enhances the vape taste in my opinion. Kanthal seems like a flat taste these days. 
26 AWG SS works beautifully for me.

Reactions: Like 1


----------



## Franky (9/2/16)

Ok guys, did my build - a 0.4ohm spaced 2.5mm ID - running it at 430 deg F with a temp co-eff of 0.00092 on my XCube 2. Everything seems ok? Adjusting the wattage in Power mode doesn't seem to make a diff...


----------



## stevie g (9/2/16)

Stick to spaced, contact coil will not wick as efficiently. No idea on the power mode thing though.


----------



## Franky (9/2/16)

Ok after all is said and done...I was expecting TC to blow me away... but I really can't seem to tell the difference between this and wattage mode...
Seems like on the XCube it ramps up the watts itself as you ramp up the temperature.


----------



## stevie g (9/2/16)

My use case for TC is to allow long lung inhales without worrying about the dry hit, that's pretty much it. Oh ja and it allows clouds without that over cooked taste tou get when you are running your atomizer on the knifes edge between just enough and too much power.


----------



## Kuhlkatz (9/2/16)

As @Sprint mentioned, a very good use case for TC is no or less chance of dry hits. 
As I mentioned before, I often swap between TC and Power mode since I started using SS. My Subtank Mini is still a v1 RBA with the side slots in the base of the deck, not the larger holes on the side of the chimney like the newer v2 decks have. Using Kanthal, it was very unforgiving on wicking, and very easily did dry hits on thicker joose, even after I slightly enlarged the juice channels. 
Since I moved over to Ni-200, I have not had a single dry hit on it, but Ni was very tedious as you cannot really dry-burn it when you rewick. I preferred twisted 28G, so had to twist new coils every time I changed wicks. Having to space them was a PITA, as Ni is quite soft, so you have to ensure that they are still spaced after wicking especially if you are using a single strand.
The previous 2 evenings, I was using the Subtank with a 0.5 ohm SS coil in Power mode, and as there is just too much stuff to catch up on the forum, mindless reading and vaping without checking your juice level is a disaster... even as low as 15W. Empty tank, nice roasted cotton flavour, fantastic coughing fit and obviously a forced tank wash and rewick as a result.
So, in the name of science, I used the existing SS build on a custom TCR of 92 at 175 deg Celcius on the VTC Mini at 25W and vaped it till it's bone dry. It's not even producing any vapor any more, but I'm not scorching the cotton at all. A big win for TC as far as I'm concerned.

Reactions: Winner 1


----------

