# Something doesn't seem right in the classifieds



## theyettie (24/6/16)

Hey guys and gals. 

This has been bugging me for a couple of days,so I decided to break my silence. 

I see more and more of the following:

1. People selling gear that joined a couple of days ago
2. People posting adds with no photos or avatars 
3. People posting adds and then not responding
4. People posting adds selling new,unopened gear

Obviously you can't say these people are all bad apples,but being a weary person by nature this makes me nervous. I really hope that our private market is not being infiltrated by crooks. 

I don't know what procedures one can put in place to protect prospective buyers, but I have this sneaky suspicion that there will be a deal or 3 within the next couple of weeks where honest members get screwed over. Call it a hunch if you will

Reactions: Like 3 | Agree 6 | Informative 2


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## Petrus (25/6/16)

One thing I can comment on is the fact that all of the sudden the classifieds section is VERY busy.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 2


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## brotiform (25/6/16)

VW Club of South Africa forum does not allow users with less than 50 non spam posts to advertise goods for sale

Reactions: Like 8 | Agree 3


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## Dubz (25/6/16)

brotiform said:


> VW Club of South Africa forum does not allow users with less than 50 non spam posts to advertise goods for sale


Other forums i belong to also adopt this method and i think it should be adopted here too...

Reactions: Like 2 | Agree 4


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## Silver (25/6/16)

Thanks guys

The Admin and Mod team has discussed this issue previously on a few occasions
We will continue to discuss it and let you know.
Things have also been very hectic with lots of initiatives especially VapeCon so we may not have been able to watch over the Classifieds as much as in the past.

For now, what I will re-iterate to prospective buyers is to exercise caution when dealing in the Classifieds. Be careful who you choose to deal with. Rather try deal with longer standing members that have a good reputation in the community. When in doubt, feel free to ask one of the longstanding members or one of the Admin & Mod team.

Reactions: Like 7 | Agree 6


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## OnePowerfulCorsa (25/6/16)

What I follow with a deal with someone new (I know I am also fairly new) is meet in person at a safe place and accept cash only. As tempting as it might seem to buy something at a bargain in another province rather be cautious and do it with someone who has been here for a while like @Silver said or have someone you know facilitate the deal in that region. Also remember when you buy secondhand you are doing so most times as a voetstoets purchase so take the time and test the item properly. 

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

Reactions: Like 2 | Agree 3


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## Mark121m (25/6/16)

On another forum I have been on.
If you haven't posted roughly 25/50 post to other thread you are unabLe to post a for sale thread.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 1


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## Clouds4Days (25/6/16)

I personally will never buy a mod from someone i dont know personally. Unfortunately i have been 1 of the unlucky ones to be skrewed over before and got a faulty piece of kak.
Guess we use the classifieds at our own risk.

So take caution when buying gear and if possible as mentioned above meet personaly and test out the gear. (Even that sometimes is not safe as in my instance the mod only showed sighns of being faulty once battry hit half way mark).

Reactions: Like 3 | Agree 1


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## maxjany (25/6/16)

A lot of people join for the second hand section. I own two none vaping based forums an it's the same story. We just have strict rules and if people don't fix their threads we delete them. 
Have bought and sold second hand stuff for years, and my one forum requires a photo of your ID and your user name on a piece of paper sent to the admins to sell gear.

Reactions: Like 3 | Informative 2


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## brotiform (25/6/16)

I joined purely to use the classifieds , and unfortunately I am very trusting of people , but never been burned here luckily! 

99% of ecigssa forumites are the berries ️

Reactions: Like 6 | Winner 1


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## Imotions (25/6/16)

What about the facebook site policy strict written details on a paper with date etc and pics of item if no pic or paper on the post its deleted... also vwclub forum policy is tops to have min post before posting

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk


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## Frikkie6000 (25/6/16)

is it possible to validate the add before it is publishes to the classifieds ? I'm guessing that actually gonna be a lot more work for the admins then. otherwise a minimum post count to even be allowed to post in the classifieds. 

Or maybe new member must be sent Ecigs SA Text Books (PDFs) with all the rules to study and then an online exam to be taken to actually start posting.

Just spit balling here

Reactions: Funny 3


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## Clouds4Days (25/6/16)

Frikkie6000 said:


> is it possible to validate the add before it is publishes to the classifieds ? I'm guessing that actually gonna be a lot more work for the admins then. otherwise a minimum post count to even be allowed to post in the classifieds.
> 
> Or maybe new member must be sent Ecigs SA Text Books (PDFs) with all the rules to study and then an online exam to be taken to actually start posting.
> 
> Just spit balling here



Hahaha and to add to that they have to send each member on ecigssa a large pizza with topings of there choice to validate there authenticity

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 1 | Funny 2


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## Frikkie6000 (25/6/16)

Clouds4Days said:


> Hahaha and to add to that they have to send each member on ecigssa a large pizza with topings of there choice to validate there authenticity




oh hell yeah. some form of initiation maybe ?


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## Gibo (25/6/16)

Frikkie6000 said:


> is it possible to validate the add before it is publishes to the classifieds ? I'm guessing that actually gonna be a lot more work for the admins then. otherwise a minimum post count to even be allowed to post in the classifieds.
> 
> Or maybe new member must be sent Ecigs SA Text Books (PDFs) with all the rules to study and then an online exam to be taken to actually start posting.
> 
> Just spit balling here



Lol at having to write an exam...

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Frikkie6000 (25/6/16)

Gibo said:


> Lol at having to write an exam...



like multiple questions. One question for example would be :

1. when posting in the classifieds what is mandatory in the post

a. picture of your grandma, her contact details, physical address
b. Picture of item being posted, price, age, condition, reason, location
c. Nothing at all
d. All of the above

Reactions: Funny 1


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## blujeenz (25/6/16)

The BidorBuy method works fairly well in that if someone nobbs you , you know exactly who and can thus lay fraud/theft charges at your nearest SAPS branch.



> Become a Verified User on bidorbuy.co.za for a once off *R100.00* (non-refundable) registration fee.
> 
> bidorbuy will submit your details for an Identity check, Credit check and a Fraud check. Approval is at bidorbuy's discretion, based on the outcome of the checks. The process can take up to 21 days.





> *To Become a Verified User You Must:*
> 
> *Have a valid South African Identity document.*
> *Complete the bidorbuy Verified User Registration Form  *
> ...



ps the R100 is used to facilitate the checks.

Reactions: Like 2 | Agree 2


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## bakersman (25/6/16)

when buying anything, you need to ensure what you buying is not rubbish, its a risk you have to take


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## Boktiet (25/6/16)

The sad side is that nowadays the electronic way of buying and selling has made it do easy for crooks to take from us good, hardworking folk. I try to only buy from someone I can meet personally for collection or a registered online enterprise. And with regards to selling I like to live by good old fashioned morals where my word is my bond. Do unto others....

Reactions: Like 2


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## Spydro (25/6/16)

IMO... just some random thoughts as I don't have time to do what would be a rather long reply to all of this (have company coming).

The classifieds are a free service provided by the Admin of this forum to its members. They should have stringent rules in place for them that protects the forum itself and Admin legally, and as much as possible also the members who use them. That requires the need to enforce them constantly. I can relate from being Admin on many past forums that being on staff is already near a full time job, and policing classifieds adds greatly to their duties. Add any disputes between seller/buyer that they try to drag Admin into and the classifieds can become a major time bandit for the staff.

1. People selling gear that joined a couple of days ago
Nobody should be allowed to post ads at all until well established on the forum. It's Admin's responsibility to require that as the bear minimum, and to discourage and ban anyone who only joins the forum to use the free classifieds. They add nothing to the vaping community here otherwise, so they have not earned the privilege of using the free classifieds.

2. People posting adds with no photos or avatars
Photos of items for sale/trade are a plus for the seller for quicker sales/trades, so they are missing a key tool by not posting pictures up front that they will be most certainly be asked for anyway by perspective buyers. No avatar is not a negative that makes sense... they are personal preference to use or not use on forums.

3. People posting adds and then not responding
Sh_t happens in the real world, so folks may not be able to get back to the forum for any of many valid reasons to reply to their ad. But there are also plenty of deadbeat sellers. So no activity by a seller after a set reasonable time the ad should be locked by Admin.

4. People posting adds selling new,unopened gear
Why that would be considered a negative escapes me, unless it is someone conducting the sales as what would be an illegal business on the forum classifieds without being a supporting vendor of the forum. I have still brand new gear that is in unopened packages that I never did use. Mostly items I bought more than one of and didn't like the first one tried so didn't open the second/third/or more bought. But also some that I did not buy to actually use myself as well. They were bought to be available for other folks on a given forum I ran who might not score one they wanted before they were sold out on a sale that sold out within minutes. IOW, I was faster at scoring them than most folks, important stuff for a prototype, one of three, one of less than 100, etc when up to thousands of folks worldwide are after them. At the time I would have resold them for my out of pocket costs only, to help those folks out, not for personal profit.

Reactions: Like 3 | Agree 3


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## theyettie (25/6/16)

I've got a suggestion that shouldn't be too taxing for the admin guys and will add a bit of security:

Scan through the adds, if you see something suspect or get a bad vibe, pm the seller and tell them that they have been selected for verification.

You then ask for some sort of identification, valid cellphone number, etc.

The bullshitters will back out and someone who's got nothing to hide (or a very ballsy tsotsi) will comply.

Reactions: Like 1


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## theyettie (25/6/16)

Spydro said:


> IMO... just some random thoughts as I don't have time to do what would be a rather long reply to all of this (have company coming).
> 
> The classifieds are a free service provided by the Admin of this forum to its members. They should have stringent rules in place for them that protects the forum itself and Admin legally, and as much as possible also the members who use them. That requires the need to enforce them constantly. I can relate from being Admin on many past forums that being on staff is already near a full time job, and policing classifieds adds greatly to their duties. Add any disputes between seller/buyer that they try to drag Admin into and the classifieds can become a major time bandit for the staff.
> 
> ...



Alo.

My reasoning behind the no avatar thing:

If you really want to be part of the community to learn, interact, teach and have a good time surely putting up a pic isn't too much to ask. I feel uneasy trusting someone who doesn't even take 10 seconds to create an avatar. If that is too much effort I question your commitment to the forum. Having said that, this is a very subjective thing, so many probably won't agree with me, but that's me, I don't trust easily.

My reasoning behind selling unopened goods:

Guys selling new stuff for R50 cheaper than the shops won't hook me. I'd rather spend that 50 bucks more and have the protection and after sales customer care from a vendor. If the seller can provide me with proof of purchase from a local vendor it slightly changes the picture. I say slightly because if the seller still makes me jittery I would first want the proof, which I will then authenticate through the vendor before finalising the deal. This point might be complete overkill, but I feel it's necessary to point out for members reading that are perhaps new to wheeling and dealing in the classifieds. Maybe this saves someone some heart ache.

That's me.

Cheers.

Reactions: Like 3


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## Pixstar (25/6/16)

Plenty good points and suggestions above. It's a difficult thing to handle and we must keep in mind that the solution cannot be one for admin alone to administer. We have to play our part by being vigilant and careful etc.
It sucks when we buy something that ends up being a dud, but that is the risk of buying used.
I have not bought much in the classifieds, but the three times I did buy were extremely pleasant.
I bought from seasoned members and each one went beyond expectation to make the sale a pleasant one.
Naturally it could of easily been the opposite...
Long story short: Do not buy from 'new' members and if it's not a saving worth risking I rather buy new.

Reactions: Like 2 | Agree 1


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## maxjany (25/6/16)

Spydro said:


> 1. People selling gear that joined a couple of days ago
> Nobody should be allowed to post ads at all until well established on the forum. It's Admin's responsibility to require that as the bear minimum, and to discourage and ban anyone who only joins the forum to use the free classifieds. They add nothing to the vaping community here otherwise, so they have not earned the privilege of using the free classifieds.


Some guys do more for the community by selling a second hand device to someone who can't afford the new price than some of the established users and keyboard warriors.

Reactions: Disagree 1


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## Pixstar (25/6/16)

maxjany said:


> Some guys do more for the community by selling a second hand device to someone who can't afford the new price than some of the established users and keyboard warriors.


Actually, it's the many members on here, mostly established, who PIF their devices that do the most for the community.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Spydro (26/6/16)

theyettie said:


> Alo.
> 
> My reasoning behind the no avatar thing:
> 
> ...



Opinions vary, just the real world. Nothing wrong with that, or following your own opinions that you feel more secure with.

You don't trust the lack of an avatar whereas I could care less... that's their right to have or not have one, so is not a warning flag to me. Joining a new forum just to sell is a huge warning flag, give away prices for new gear has the ring of clone gear, etc. Reminds me of the folks who started selling clone Chalice III atty's as authentic for something like $100 US. Their cost less than $10 US for clones when an authentic commonly sold for $150 US. So $90 profit when sold to anyone that didn't know how to tell the difference between the authentics and clones, especially from just pictures posted on an ad (where a couple can be clearly seen if clear enough pictures).

It's commendable that you support your local B&M's (and this forum). From what I've seen you do have some really great shops in SA. But I can't say the same for the 100+ B&M's in my city alone, so I do not support any of them.

Proof of authenticity and honesty, proof of reliability when buying from any source that you are not familiar with or do not have a trusted gauge to go by on them is always pucker time when considering a first time buy from them. Where most of my buys come from now days... total strangers. But I'm also a good judge of character, do know all the tricks and give my repeat business to those that have proven themselves on the first buy from them.

Reactions: Like 1


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## maxjany (26/6/16)

Pixstar said:


> Actually, it's the many members on here, mostly established, who PIF their devices that do the most for the community.


That's why I said some guys. 
I've seen it on my one secondhand forum a few times, guys can't afford spending 30-50k on new kit, so being able to buy secondhand at a much lower price gets them into the community. Some of those guys go on to contribute more to new guys joining than some of my memebers who have been on since we launched it in 2008.


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