# Purchases that disappoint



## Mufasa (4/5/15)

If you are not interested in ranting and raving, then stop reading now. I just have to get this off my chest.
Two weeks ago I purchased a Kbox and regular subtank, spoiling myself for my 1-year vaping anniversary. Right off the bat I could sense trouble with this sub-ohming business. I couldn't handle the 0.5 ohm OCC in the subtank. Way too hot for me. I built some coils on the RBA base, but I soon realised that the ultimate purpose of the subtank is lung hitting and that is not my scene. I have been using a MVP2 for the last year and a Tesla mod I bought when I was in China. On both of these I have Nautilus minis. It used to be mini protanks before that. 
Last night the Kbox stops working. I fiddle and find that if I tighten any tank on the Kbox it doesn't work. You have turn it out so that the tank is completely loose before it actually fires. I started reading up on this and see there are numerous such complaints on the internet. It seems like the little white rubber grommet that insulates the 510 connector, is made of inferior material. I loosen the screws at the top of the Kbox and check this grommet - completely perished and in two pieces. And this after 2 weeks of use!!!! I am so disappointed in this product, I want to throw it in the bin. 

Sorry, had to get that out of my system. Anybody interested in a subtank and Kbox? I am back on my MVP2 and R100 cheap Chinese Tesla mod that have lasted the better part of a year with no trouble at all.

Reactions: Informative 1


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## Gazzacpt (4/5/15)

@capetocuba

Reactions: Thanks 1


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## Silver (4/5/15)

Sorry to hear about your disappointment @Mufasa

I can identify with your frustration. I too have bought several devices that disappointed. Some were because it didnt do what I thought it would. And others that simply were not built properly. 

Over time I guess one learns what type of vape appeals and sticks to products that are known to satisfy that type of vaper well. 

I have a subtank mini and also found the 0.5 occ coil a bit too much. The 1.2 ohm coil is better though. Havent built on it yet but I do agree its more suited to lung hits. 

Hope you find a great upgrade in time that works well for you

Reactions: Thanks 1


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## Mufasa (4/5/15)

Thank you very much @Silver . Yes, the search continues. Like you said, I now have a better idea what works for me and what doesn't. Albeit at a cost of R1200.


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## Rob Fisher (4/5/15)

I wondered how long it would be before the sub-ohm backlash would appear... I agree 100% @Mufasa! These sub-ohm tanks may be great for some but for the vast majority I would say that the vape is far too severe!

Sorry about the KBox... I used a Atlantis V1 on mine (until @Philip Dunkley stole mine) and I loved it... and when I say loved it it was with very diluted Tropical Ice because plain Tropical Ice was un-vapable in a sub-ohm tank.

Reactions: Like 2


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## JakesSA (4/5/15)

Here are some of the points I highlight to clients when they ask about this. Its too late for the author of this thread but in case someone else is considering sub ohming..


Sub ohm tanks are meant for lung hitting, whilst some model's airflow can be choked off to allow for mouth to lung but they really aren't designed for it and the reduction in airflow can cause problems with the coil e.g. gurgling etc. Lung hitting is nothing like smoking a cigarette.

Drop the nicotine, 6 mg at most 3 mg is better. 

Higher VG juices seems better suited. 

The flavour profile on these sub ohm tanks are different and the taste usually more intense which is logical since it produces more vapour. Is it 'better'? Never let anyone tell you what is better, taste and the experience of vaping is entirely subjective. Better can only be argued on price point, practically and quality of equipment.


Expect to spend more on liquids.


The amount of vapour they produce make them somewhat unsuitable for vaping in certain places, unless you don't mind people staring.

I'd say return the KBox for a refund, swap out for gear to your liking or at least exchange it.

Reactions: Like 7 | Agree 11 | Winner 6 | Thanks 1


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## Paulie (4/5/15)

There also seems to be a real issue with the whole noob (sorry only word i could think off) starting to vape and recommended products these days i feel.

If i think back to when i started to vape and what i used i am really happy i started on a twisp/ce4 combo so that i found it alot easier to migrate off stinkies!

What i am noticing today is new vapers are skipping the who starter kit stage and moving onto e.g. Isticks\Kbox combos with subtanks and they do seem to be battling to get used to the amount of vapor that it gives off.

Dont get me wrong its cool that they are buying better gear but i have heard alot of them complaining that they battling to stop smoking cause the vape is to strong for them.

With the whole Sub Ohm issue:
Keep an eye out for this thread

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 6


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## free3dom (4/5/15)

JakesSA said:


> Here are some of the points I highlight to clients when they ask about this. Its too late for the author of this thread but in case someone else is considering sub ohming..
> 
> 
> Sub ohm tanks are meant for lung hitting, whilst some model's airflow can be choked off to allow for mouth to lung but they really aren't designed for it and the reduction in airflow can cause problems with the coil e.g. gurgling etc. Lung hitting is nothing like smoking a cigarette.
> ...



Great post @JakesSA 
That describes exactly what to expect when you're exepecting from a sub-ohm tank!

Lung hitting in particular is something of an "acquired taste" - and even then it just won't suit certain people, or at the very least not suit them all the time. Especially new vapers who are still trying to kick that other habbit 

Myself (and other people I know) will never go "full lung hit" - others can't stand to do mouth-to-lung anymore at all, so it depends on the person. I always have at least one device that delivers a very nice mouth-to-lung vape 

If you do go for a lung hitting device, get it as an extra and not as your only device

Reactions: Like 1


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## Silver (4/5/15)

@Alex has been 'converting' me to lung hit vaping for several months. I am now about 50/50. But I still love my concentrated flavour mouth to lung for some flavours and for more relaxed vaping from time to time, especially in the mornings. 

Definitely a firm place for both styles in my vaping at the moment.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## baksteen8168 (4/5/15)

Paulie said:


> There also seems to be a real issue with the whole noob (sorry only word i could think off) starting to vape and recommended products these days i feel.
> 
> If i think back to when i started to vape and what i used i am really happy i started on a twisp/ce4 combo so that i found it alot easier to migrate off stinkies!
> 
> ...



Similar path to lung hitting for me

Started on a CE4
Moved on to a spinner and PT2
Then on to eVic Supreme and Nauti
Then tanks changed to RTA's (kayfun lite and russians - This kept me at mouth to lung due to restrictive airflow)
After all that I got onto lung hitting

I still occasionally mouth to lung hit, but prefer full on lung hits now. That being said, if I straight up started on Sub Ohm lung hitting I would probably also have struggled to get off stinkies.

Also, @JakesSA - well written post!

Reactions: Like 4


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## Mufasa (4/5/15)

It seems like I managed to fix the Kbox. Lets see how long it lasts. The 510 connector on the Kbox has a white rubber grommet that goes into a hole at the top of the Kbox. This is the grommet that perished and caused the connector to touch the base and short. I unscrewed the top and replaced the rubber grommet with one from a BVC coil. The grommet from the BVC coil is much bigger, but after a bit of a struggle I managed to get it into the hole and the Kbox is working again.

Reactions: Like 2 | Winner 6


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## RevnLucky7 (4/5/15)

Also as a POI - lung hits just like when you first pick up a PV is a completely new experience. A smoker might prefer a mouth to lung as it more closely resembles the habbits they are use to. Thus straight lung inhales are unusual to someone who's never done it before. 

The evolution of vaping is it's trends is something a new vaper has to discover for themselves ultimately and is why we never recommend a sub ohm device to a noob, unless he's actually tried itm liked it and opted for it over a mouth to lung kind of device.

Truth is, eventaully eventually almost everyone sub ohms, but you'll never know until you try and trying costs money . Usually quite a bit of it too.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## ET (4/5/15)

Mufasa said:


> It seems like I managed to fix the Kbox. Lets see how long it lasts. The 510 connector on the Kbox has a white rubber grommet that goes into a hole at the top of the Kbox. This is the grommet that perished and caused the connector to touch the base and short. I unscrewed the top and replaced the rubber grommet with one from a BVC coil. The grommet from the BVC coil is much bigger, but after a bit of a struggle I managed to get it into the hole and the Kbox is working again.



There you go dude! Awesome stuff. That Kbox is now going to become one of your firm favourite vaping devices. Once you've had to fiddle with something to fix it, it becomes so much more awesome. Unless it breaks again. Then its a devilspawned piece of hatefull tech. Exorcism might be required.

Reactions: Like 2


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## Yiannaki (4/5/15)

Mufasa said:


> If you are not interested in ranting and raving, then stop reading now. I just have to get this off my chest.
> Two weeks ago I purchased a Kbox and regular subtank, spoiling myself for my 1-year vaping anniversary. Right off the bat I could sense trouble with this sub-ohming business. I couldn't handle the 0.5 ohm OCC in the subtank. Way too hot for me. I built some coils on the RBA base, but I soon realised that the ultimate purpose of the subtank is lung hitting and that is not my scene. I have been using a MVP2 for the last year and a Tesla mod I bought when I was in China. On both of these I have Nautilus minis. It used to be mini protanks before that.
> Last night the Kbox stops working. I fiddle and find that if I tighten any tank on the Kbox it doesn't work. You have turn it out so that the tank is completely loose before it actually fires. I started reading up on this and see there are numerous such complaints on the internet. It seems like the little white rubber grommet that insulates the 510 connector, is made of inferior material. I loosen the screws at the top of the Kbox and check this grommet - completely perished and in two pieces. And this after 2 weeks of use!!!! I am so disappointed in this product, I want to throw it in the bin.
> 
> Sorry, had to get that out of my system. Anybody interested in a subtank and Kbox? I am back on my MVP2 and R100 cheap Chinese Tesla mod that have lasted the better part of a year with no trouble at all.




@Mufasa - It sure is a frustrating experience to buy new vape gear, only to realise that you don't like it, or it doesn't work as it should

My frustration with purchases began when moving over from the twisp to other clearos such as the Aspire Nautilus, Iclear X1 and Mini Protank 3. I regretted all of these tanks as I found i was spending more time dealing with issues and trying to make them work than I was vaping on them. 

Obviously gear has come a long way since then. A good thing to do is to get out there to the meets or make arrangements to meet other members and try out their gear. A good bet is to also visit some of the bigger vape shops which people frequent. You're bound to find vapers there will all sorts of different setups that you could have a look at or try out.

I think that a big part of the journey is trying out as much as possible. At least in that way you quickly realise what your style and preferences are. Another important thing is to never ( I know you didn't say it specifically ) As a vaper your preferences might change over time so never write anything off completely.

I recall one evening I opened up the airflow and took a lung hit on my Nautilus at 12.W, thinking to myself : This is way too airy, and 12 watts is way too intense. I swore i would always vape mouth to lung and stick around 8watts or so. Needless to say, here I am, 10 months or so after the incident, a strictly lung hitter and not being able to vape under 20Watts.

PS I do hope you find the right setup to suit your particular needs and that you return the Kbox, at least in exchange for a working one which you can sell on here to fund something else.

Reactions: Like 1 | Thanks 1


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## Smoky Jordan (4/5/15)

I started out on the Twisp after trying a mate of mines one and that got me off the stinkies instantly. I used it for about 3 weeks and started investigating more and more about vaping. I was blown away about how much gear was around as I thought the Twisp was the 
" Meneer"
After pay day that month I tried the istick 30w with the Melo and I was sold on it- the flavour and vapour was mind blowing! Thought to myself that I couldn't continue with the Twisp after trying this set up and have never looked back.
Since then I bought the the Subtank Mini and got a combo of the Atlantis V2 and Smok M80 plus. But to add to some of the previous threads, some if not all my mates which have tried my devices have battled with them and coughed quite a bit saying that it was too strong.


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## WillieRoux (4/5/15)

1 ego starter kit / spinnersssss / Evic / 2 x MVP / E-grip / sigelei mini 30watt / 10-20-30 and now 50watt istick....and plenty tanks / rba ect ect....It's all part of a learning curve to get to the perfect device that fits u....Yes it costs a lot of money....Still worth it if u consider if u were on stinkies u had nothing to show for all the money u spent....Research research research and looking at youtube reviews and forums can save u also from getting the wrong device....Enjoy the ride its worth it 

Recently started using the subtank mini coming from a nautilus mini....The thing was like a wild horse and i could not stay on it  ...Only to find out i need to cut down my nic level from 12 to 6 or lower...

Reactions: Like 2


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## PeterHarris (4/5/15)

nostril hits for the win!!!!

Reactions: Like 2


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## Daniel (4/5/15)

pity about the KBox , was actually lookin at getting one but the QC seems bad ? Anyone other Kbox owners care to comment ?

for fear of sounding dof I will refrain comment on this whole lung hitting thing , as I'm still not sure I'm doing it right ..... but if I knew what I know now I could have saved myself a lot of moola by just getting a Reo from the start , finish and klaar .... don't get me wrong the RTA's still have a place but nothing beats the early morning mouth to lung vape nirvana of a fresh battery and a RM2

Reactions: Like 2 | Agree 1


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## Gazzacpt (4/5/15)

Daniel said:


> pity about the KBox , was actually lookin at getting one but the QC seems bad ? Anyone other Kbox owners care to comment ?
> 
> for fear of sounding dof I will refrain comment on this whole lung hitting thing , as I'm still not sure I'm doing it right ..... but if I knew what I know now I could have saved myself a lot of moola by just getting a Reo from the start , finish and klaar .... don't get me wrong the RTA's still have a place but nothing beats the early morning mouth to lung vape nirvana of a fresh battery and a RM2


I have a KBox sitting on my workbench with the same problem the little grommet is a bit flimsy at the top and the sleeve part breaks off and works its way down the positive pin leaving some nice exposed metal on the top of the positive pin. When you screw an atty on tight it shorts and the lights on the mod start imitating chistmas tree lights. I'm going to see if I can make it work with some heatshrink to insulate the pin and a small oring to keep the top of the positive pin away from the negative base.

Reactions: Informative 1


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## WillieRoux (4/5/15)

The istick 10 / 20 got the same issues....Buying a device without a floating center pin is a NO NO for me...

Reactions: Like 1


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## Guunie (5/5/15)

I'm surprised that kangertech never took market research into consideration...there are numerous posts about floating, self adjustable center spring contacts being the best option and most favoured...hopefully kbox v2 will have that upgrade and different colours  maybe even a charge point....hint hint


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## Xhale (5/5/15)

Going back to the original topic, I've found that everything online is disappointing. I hope you will give me time to clarify such a broad statement.

Vaping is a new thing. It isnt 100 years old, and isnt widely understood. As such, there's quite a few undesirables trying to make a very very quick buck on the back of other's hard work. And our other new medium, the internet, makes this so easy.

HYPE.
Create hype and sit back and wait.
That was Stage 1

now everything is Hyped to the max...we are at Stage 2.
Not one day goes by where I dont feel like I am doing the world a disservice by not buying this latest released gadget that is sure to put a smile on my face for the low low price of $9.99 etc etc.

It is almost an endgame now...if I see something advertised on t.v. it must be junk, because if it was good I would've heard about it organically beforehand. i.e. I have developed an anti-advert filter, by training given to me by those who want my hard-earned. Their own methods have backfired.

But that doesnt hold true for everyone...a heck of a lot of people still fall for the hype, daily.
"one word..WOW"
"reeks of quality"
"you get what you pay for, and quality costs"
"O...M....G!!!!!!"

statements like these are used to train us...just look at the apple watch recently launched...backorders till kingdom come for something that is going to be mildly useful at best, but which you can live without easily. And that is at a hefty price tag..people are lapping it up.

At the risk of doing a Julius, yes there are people who are paid to talk stuff up in forums around the world. It is not a conspiracy when there are public job positions advertised for this function. I'd go further to say that 80% of the revenue generating part of facebook exists for this sole purpose...to spread information amongst your peers to change your buying habits. The commercial side of twitter is infested with people paid to talk on twitter, talking to other people who are paid to talk on twitter. At least they all have jobs (talking on twitter) and convinced the companies that they need someone to talk on twitter to others who are talking on twitter and are being paid for doing so. Occasionally, they re-tweet each other in salute!

We may well be reaching the end of society. All great empires went this route at some point just before collapse.
A truly great product can go by almost unnoticed now in this era of instant sharing, unless they do decide to shout loudly too. We are in a room full of shouting going on, and one ones shouting have the least interesting things to say.

Going back to vaping, if an item is on a website and is being hyped in the body text etc, then no doubt you are setting yourself up for disappointment. The text is there to further entice you to ultimately make a purchasing decision that you may not at other times have made. Advertising 101. Nothing new there.

There's also a segment of society who follow this odd path
1) They're too important/busy (insert excuse here) to find out about this thingie myself
2) Ask $close_friend for advice (thereby mentally moving liability to $close_friend)
3) when purchase goes wrong/disappointment, blame $close_friend

You can even see this being played out on forums at regular intervals, with $close_friend being replaced by "first person to answer who seems knowlegeable"). Bonus points for withholding pertinent information, like you use thingies in bath and $close_friend didnt read your mind and suggested something not waterproof. The audacity! Also, at this point $close_friend may well be a paid person as mentioned above....or a youtube reviewer.....the disappointment continues...

*No expectations. No disappointments.*
Its a good way to live. I take personal responsibility for stuff I buy....I buy with open eyes. It is always my decision to swop funds for item. The new way seems to push that responsilibity onto others, such that if/when it goes wrong, you do not damage your own ego by admitting a bad decision was made. We are shifting blame.

I love the internet, I was there when it first because part of home use in the very early 90's. But this commercialsed internet gets in the way more than it helps.

Sorry for the long post. I have run out of potatoes.

Reactions: Like 3 | Disagree 1


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## Rob Fisher (5/5/15)

No argument here @Xhale! You are 100% correct... most of the purchases are disappointments... but there are a few exceptions... The REO, The Cyclone, Ceramic Tweezers, Atlantis 1 and Atlantis 2, Rogue RDA, Dischem R7 scissors, iStick 20W, Nautilus Mini, SX Mini, Russian 91%, Sigelei 20W, eFest LUC V4 Charger, Menthol Ice, Tropical Ice, Indian Giver, Monster Melons, Antarctica, Fight your Fate... just to name a few non disappointments for me off the top of my head.

Reactions: Agree 2


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## Genosmate (5/5/15)

Rob Fisher said:


> No argument here @Xhale! You are 100% correct... most of the purchases are disappointments... but there are a few exceptions... The REO, The Cyclone, Ceramic Tweezers, Atlantis 1 and Atlantis 2, Rogue RDA, Dischem R7 scissors, iStick 20W, Nautilus Mini, SX Mini, Russian 91%, Sigelei 20W, eFest LUC V4 Charger, Menthol Ice, Tropical Ice, Indian Giver, Monster Melons, Antarctica, Fight your Fate... just to name a few non disappointments for me off the top of my head.


No Screwdrivers

Reactions: Funny 2


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## Rob Fisher (5/5/15)

Genosmate said:


> No Screwdrivers



Oh yes The screwdriver that came at the same time as the Nuppin was kewl... but I sold my Nuppin...

Reactions: Funny 2


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## JakesSA (5/5/15)

Most products released into the vaping world only present incremental changes on the theme and the majority of the successful/popular changes are really orientated towards convenience.

BUT, make no mistake, the introduction of the sub-ohm commercial coil has changed the vaping landscape forever. 

It married the world of convenient tanks and easy to replace coils with the world of mechs and custom coil building. 

It may not be everyone's cup of tea but I do know far more people that have adopted sub ohm commercial coil tanks, than have tried it an rejected the experience. 

The fact that there is now an endless variety of mods and tanks to choose from also means good strong competition in the market. If the sub tank mini was the only sub ohm tank available, can you imagine what they would cost?

The hype is just a part of plain ol' marketing, which is probably the second oldest profession in the world...

Reactions: Like 4


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