# New report about carcinogens in e cigz



## Muchis (11/2/17)

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2017/02/170207105312.htm

Any thoughts on this?

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## William Vermaak (11/2/17)

I think they test the best vapes they can find at China Mall. Doesn't make sense that they found all 5 metals in each vape. I mean it could be understandable if you find Ni if you use Ni200 or even Ni and some other metal when vaping on N20. I call BS study. They need to test the descent stuff and not the dodgy cartomiser vapes using expired juice and crap. These guys really starting to piss me off. They try to degrade the one thing that has proven to get people off stinkies. 

And even if all these metals are in there, it's a fraction of what we get in our lungs when smoking stinkies. I'm sure if someone did some research on brussel sprouts they will also promote cancer in some way if the sun is at the right angle and a comet flies past it at 23 degrees north.

Sorry, got that off my chest 


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Reactions: Agree 1 | Winner 2


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## Silver (11/2/17)

Something that Dr Farsalinos often emphasised (the pro vaping cardiologist) is that the research done on things found in ecigs should be compared to whats found in smoke from cigarettes

So echoing some of what you said @William Vermaak

Nevertheless, its worrying to hear they found those metals in first generation cigalikes.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Muchis (11/2/17)

They made a similar finding a couple of years back and when the data was provided it showed that many of these "toxic metals" were present....what they didn't state was that 3 of the 5 were in quantities less than normal air we breathe in

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## RichJB (12/2/17)

The problem with many of these studies is that they don't indicate what a hazardous level is. As the study itself says, they aren't sure if these levels are dangerous.

I did some cross-referencing with figures I found for metals in cigarette smoke. From that, it appears that there is about twice as much nickel in juice as in cig smoke (20 smokes per day versus 10ml juice per day). But I used median levels for both. It could be much higher in smoke if you use the highest cig brand and the lowest juice brand, or much higher in vape if you use the opposite extremes. The study for cigs concluded that cigarettes aren't an "important source" for nickel. So I don't know if vaping having more nickel (on average) would make it an "important source" or not.

Even the ranges could be misleading. For nickel in vaping, they give a range from 56.5 to 22,600 micrograms per liter. That covers five brands. Are the bulk of the brands closer to the 56.5 or to the 22,600? It makes a huge difference when assessing the overall impact. Are the highs and lows out-liers or closer to the norm?

The other thing is that this study only tested metal levels in the juice, not in the vapour. One assumes that some/much of the metals in the juice make it into our lungs in the vapour. But how much is unknown.

Anyway, it's good that they are testing these things. I shouldn't worry too much about this study. If there was something of great concern, I'm sure they would have noted it.

Reactions: Like 2 | Agree 1


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## Kalahari stoommasjien (20/4/17)

Haven't read the whole article, but just the 1st paragraph...
"The study, believed to be the first to examine a cross-section of metals in multiple e-cigarette brands, analyzed the liquid in five brands of first generation e-cigarettes for cadmium, chromium, lead, manganese and nickel. The liquid is the component of e-cigarettes that, when heated, delivers ingredients, often including nicotine and flavors, to the user. In first generation e-cigarettes, the liquid is stored in the cartridge in close contact with the heating coil. The researchers found all five heavy metals -- which can be toxic or carcinogenic when inhaled -- in all five brands, though levels varied by brand. The main source of the metals, the researchers believe, is the coil that heats the liquid that creates the aerosol, which is often but erroneously referred to as vapor. The study did not look at the possible presence of metals in e-cigarette aerosol."
Ok, I understand they are checking the liquid, not the aerosol/vape, but then toward the end of the paragraph they refer to the coil, ok, so they are looking at tanks, doesn't impact me with my drippers, I suppose and of course, I guess my drippers and not exactly cigarette style mods, don't exactly qualify as a "first generation" e-cigarettes... so, when they expand their horizon past 2007 or whatever timeframe first generation e-cigarettes came out of, it may be time to pay attention...

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Darryn Du Plessis (20/4/17)

Drippers still contain metal. It will impact you if there is a problem?

was temp control the reason for bringing down the temperatures? :?


Kalahari stoommasjien said:


> Haven't read the whole article, but just the 1st paragraph...
> "The study, believed to be the first to examine a cross-section of metals in multiple e-cigarette brands, analyzed the liquid in five brands of first generation e-cigarettes for cadmium, chromium, lead, manganese and nickel. The liquid is the component of e-cigarettes that, when heated, delivers ingredients, often including nicotine and flavors, to the user. In first generation e-cigarettes, the liquid is stored in the cartridge in close contact with the heating coil. The researchers found all five heavy metals -- which can be toxic or carcinogenic when inhaled -- in all five brands, though levels varied by brand. The main source of the metals, the researchers believe, is the coil that heats the liquid that creates the aerosol, which is often but erroneously referred to as vapor. The study did not look at the possible presence of metals in e-cigarette aerosol."
> Ok, I understand they are checking the liquid, not the aerosol/vape, but then toward the end of the paragraph they refer to the coil, ok, so they are looking at tanks, doesn't impact me with my drippers, I suppose and of course, I guess my drippers and not exactly cigarette style mods, don't exactly qualify as a "first generation" e-cigarettes... so, when they expand their horizon past 2007 or whatever timeframe first generation e-cigarettes came out of, it may be time to pay attention...


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