# DIY Mixing By Weight



## Christos (12/5/17)

I don't see a thread to discuss scales and mixing by weight. I have seen mixing by weight come up in a few threads but I think a dedicated thread should be created.

I for one am over the moon with a mixing scale. No more syringes and droppers and pipettes. No more mess or spills.

Something to remember for new people getting into mixing by weight is that not all concentrated are 1ml =1g.
Ejuice me up has a nifty feature of importing all flavours etc with the g/ml ratio. Alternatively the g/ml ratio is online for most concentrates. 

Looking forward to the wealth of knowledge the DIY guys will add to this thread.

Reactions: Like 2 | Can relate 1


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## spiv (12/5/17)

I use http://e-liquid-recipes.com/

You tell it how much you want to make, your nic % you want and what concentrate your nic is at. Also if your concentrate is PG or VG based.
It will tell you in grams and ml how much to add based on the recipe. (see attached pic)

Best of all, it's web based. So I can capture a recipe on my laptop, grab my tablet and head to the mixing table.

Reactions: Like 1 | Can relate 1


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## craigb (12/5/17)

Christos said:


> Something to remember for new people getting into mixing by weight is that not all concentrated are 1ml =1g.


VIP to know what the recipe creator used when publishing. I understand that a lot of people use 1ml:1g so if you calibrated your calculator differently, you will get a different result. I know @RichJB did the math a while ago, will try find the post.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 1


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## Andre (12/5/17)

The vast majority of mixers do not use specific gravity for concentrates, but rather 1.:1. This is because the specific gravity for concentrates are either not available or not readily accessible, most are PG-based and thus close to 1.:1 and, being the smallest percentage in a mix, not really crucial. For PG and VG and nicotine specific gravity is used by most. For VG-based concentrates (which are few and far between), seeing the larger difference, I presume it would be better to use specific gravity.

The DIY community would do well in trying to establish a set standard in this regard.

Good information here.

Reactions: Agree 2 | Informative 2


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## Patrick (12/5/17)

Andre said:


> The vast majority of mixers do not use specific gravity for concentrates, but rather 1.:1. This is because the specific gravity for concentrates are either not available or not readily accessible, most are PG-based and thus close to 1.:1 and, being the smallest percentage in a mix, not really crucial. For PG and VG and nicotine specific gravity is used by most. For VG-based concentrates (which are few and far between), seeing the larger difference, I presume it would be better to use specific gravity.
> 
> The DIY community would do well in trying to establish a set standard in this regard.
> 
> Good information here.



After a prolonged and garbled attempt to convey this to Lars (ELR mastermind) I did manage to get him to add grams to the final recipe. That means that it takes into account the specific gravity wherever this is known. That makes a big difference especially when I'm moving from premix to actually mixing the

recipe.

Reactions: Winner 1


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## aktorsyl (12/5/17)

Andre said:


> The vast majority of mixers do not use specific gravity for concentrates, but rather 1.:1. This is because the specific gravity for concentrates are either not available or not readily accessible, most are PG-based and thus close to 1.:1 and, being the smallest percentage in a mix, not really crucial. For PG and VG and nicotine specific gravity is used by most. For VG-based concentrates (which are few and far between), seeing the larger difference, I presume it would be better to use specific gravity.
> 
> The DIY community would do well in trying to establish a set standard in this regard.
> 
> Good information here.


Correct, although the vast majority drive me up the wall by using 1:1. In large quantities it won't make much difference, sure - but in small quantities it does. Especially with additives.
A good rule of thumb is to use PG's specific gravity for concentrates when you can't find the concentrate's SG. HOWEVER: Especially on ELR, most people designed their recipes around 1:1 ratios. Which means you have to continue on that same ratio or you'd end up with something different. So the problem never gets fixed


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## Andre (12/5/17)

Patrick said:


> After a prolonged and garbled attempt to convey this to Lars (ELR mastermind) I did manage to get him to add grams to the final recipe. That means that it takes into account the specific gravity wherever this is known. That makes a big difference especially when I'm moving from premix to actually mixing the
> View attachment 94360
> recipe.


On the concentrates the difference is about 0.22 for that recipe of 50 ml - would it make that much of a difference?

Looks a great recipe btw. Not published on ELR?


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## SAVaper (12/5/17)

1:1 works perfectly fine for me.


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## aktorsyl (12/5/17)

SAVaper said:


> 1:1 works perfectly fine for me.


There's nothing wrong with it if you always work on the same ratio when developing  Then it comes down to personal preference, and if it works for you then that's great.
It just becomes tricky when sharing recipes.

EDIT: I should probably specify here.. in most cases, that SG difference isn't going to make a difference to your mix. But with really strong additives (tobacco supreme, etc) it might affect it by one drop this way or that way.. and that could be palpable.

Reactions: Like 2


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## Patrick (12/5/17)

Andre said:


> On the concentrates the difference is about 0.22 for that recipe of 50 ml - would it make that much of a difference?
> 
> Looks a great recipe btw. Not published on ELR?



Almost ready. The only problem is that its a touch too sweet for me. Trying to see if the Sour tames the lemonade a smidgen.

Reactions: Thanks 1


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## Kalashnikov (12/5/17)

If you have an android and want to mix by weight i would really suggest E-Juice Lab on the Google Play store.
It does cost to download but at R14 its one of the best apps i ever come accross.

It stores all your flavours for you so when its time to create recipes you just need to click on the flavour from your list and type a percentage.



It also allows you to switch between mixing by weight /percentage/ml/drops all just by clicking a tab. Its a very user freiendly app. Anyone keen on mixing should give it a try.


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## Christos (12/5/17)

Would anybody be interested in a database of concentrates with actual correct ml/g ratios available to the public?
If there is enough interest I may put one together online. A standard mixing database that members of this community can use and share receipts knowing the ratios are correct.

Reactions: Like 1


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## aktorsyl (12/5/17)

Christos said:


> Would anybody be interested in a database of concentrates with actual correct ml/g ratios available to the public?
> If there is enough interest I may put one together online. A standard mixing database that members of this community can use and share receipts knowing the ratios are correct.


If you could base them off the MSDS's - I would certainly find that very handy.


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## RichJB (12/5/17)

I just go 1:1 as the actual weight of the concentrate added is irrelevant. The key to juice tasting right is that you add the same amount as the recipe developer did. If Wayne assumes 1ml = 1g and decides that 4% is needed in a recipe, he will add 4g to a 100ml mix. If I know that the specific gravity of that concentrate is 1.15g per ml, I will be technically more correct in adding 4x1.15 = 4.6g. But I am now, in Wayne's terms, adding 4.6%. It's now a different recipe. I would far rather add the amount that Wayne added rather than adding the scientifically correct amount. My taste buds don't care what the scientifically correct amount is.

In order to popularise specific gravity, you would need to convince all flavour houses to release specific gravities for all their concentrates. Then you'd need to convince the top mixers to adopt it and change their formulae. And then go back and rework all their published recipes to date with the correct specific gravities. Long story short: ain't gonna happen.

It doesn't matter that published recipes are wrong. As long as the DIYer is wrong by the same amount as the original recipe developer was, then it will be right. Consistency is more important than scientific accuracy.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 5


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## RichJB (12/5/17)

This is also where mixing by weight is more accurate than mixing by volume. The key is that:

1) Most DIY recipe developers mix by weight but, more importantly
2) They *verify* by weight.

Example: on Live Mixing, Wayne thumbsucks a recipe and decides that he'll use 4% of concentrate X. If he wanted to verify volumetrically and was mixing 100ml, he'd have to take a syringe, measure out exactly 4ml of the concentrate and use that to verify that he is indeed adding 4% by volume. But he never does that. Instead, he adds 4g into his mixing bottle on the scale. Although it's an extreme example, let's assume that the specific gravity of that concentrate is 1.2g per ml. Wayne is neither adding 4ml nor 4% by volume, even though the final recipe states that he is. Instead, he is adding 4/1.2 = 3.33ml or 3.33%. So if you mix up his recipe by volume and you faithfully add 4ml, you will be over-flavouring. You should add 3.33ml in order to arrive volumetrically at the same juice that Wayne concocted by weight. If you mix by weight and make the same assumptions as Wayne, you will arrive at the same juice. That it's scientifically inaccurate is neither here nor there.

Of course, the specific gravities are usually close enough to 1 for any differences to be trivial, whether mixing by volume or by weight. But there are some concentrates with sufficient deviation to totally change the recipe.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 2


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## clinton.spaceship (13/5/17)

If you ask your supplier, they will give a lab report for flavours etc, that states specific gravity, etc. But different purities of VG and PG might have different specific gravity.VG is much heavier then 1ml-1gram.The Vape tool on playstore shows the ml and grams. In the end I just use ml to safe.

Sent from my GT-I9195I using Tapatalk


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## RichJB (13/5/17)

Andre said:


> For VG-based concentrates (which are few and far between), seeing the larger difference, I presume it would be better to use specific gravity.



This has been on my mind too, particularly considering that Valley and Blck now stock the Real Flavors line that has a VG base. From what I've read on Reddit, DIY recipe developers are still adopting a 1:1 approach for these. As these are slightly heavier and many run around 1.18g/ml or thereabouts, it does mean that volume mixers will need to be careful as they will be nearly 20% out if they apply volume to 1:1 weight-based recipes.

Reactions: Like 2


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## Nightwalker (14/5/17)

Also vape tool pro has weights


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