# High End Liquids



## moonunit (9/4/15)

Hi All

So I recently got into the _true_ world of vaping and tried some Rocket Sheep Booster, which I absolutely love. Now I see there are relatively expensive liquids and relatively cheap liquids, is there a major difference between these? I want to try more flavours and purchase more liquids. I have tried cheaper brands from tobacconists but that was in my Twisp and the flavours were OK.

For example I was looking at the Five Pawns Black Flag liquid which sounds delicious but is it worth the premium, especially for a noob like myself?

On a side note I tried some Twisp Café Latte I had lying around in my Aspire Atlantis Smok BT50 setup and I nearly died from the throat hit. Cant believe how different it tasted compared to using it in the Twisp. This was my favourite flavour before upgrading.

Not a major fan of fruity flavours but willing to try anything if it is worth it.


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## Silver (9/4/15)

Hi @moonunit 

You are asking an excellent question! And I think you will get many different answers. 

Personally I think in general one gets what one pays for. But there are the exceptions. 

For example, a cheap and nasty mass produced Chinese (no offence) artificial tobacco flavour for say R80 from the flea market is no match against say the premium Witchers Brew Blackbird or one of the Heathers Heavenly Vapes naturally extracted tobacco flavours. Its a chalk and cheese comparison. Try and you will see. 

There is one other thing though, it does depend on your gear. I usually vape my premium juices in my drippers (in my case, mostly Reos) where i find the flavours come out the best. 

On my simpler tanks like the Evod1 i can easily vape a lower quality juice and enjoy it. Its asif its more forgiving. But put that lower quality juice in a Reo and it often tastes terrible. 

If I were to split the juices into three broad families :

Cheap and nasty - i would stay away from these
Premium international juices - select a few you think you will like and try
Good quality well priced local juices - here is the area I end up doing most of my vaping. Around R130 per 30ml bottle seems to be the going price for well made local juices. I think you can get a great balance of value for money and taste in this area. 
I think if you stick to the good local juices and work your way through those to find a few gems, you will be happy. (I am talking about the retailers on this forum that have their own juice lines). They also tend to be more readily available. 

Then you can occasionally buy an international juice like you did with Rocket Sheep - and try a few of those as budget permits or something seems appealing. Try those juices out on a well set up dripper just to see the difference. 

Dont rush and I suggest you take notes of what you vape so you start to discover what types of flavours you enjoy. 

Hope it helps

Reactions: Like 2 | Winner 5 | Informative 1


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## Andre (9/4/15)

You generally get what you pay for, but do bear in mind that exchange rate and duties do add to imported juices. 

Our local vendors do also, in general, vet the juices they import.

Our local juices are good and getting better, and the choice is also getting better. Also, we are getting more complex local juices, comparable to the imported ones at a much better price.

A good place to start is our joose review section.

Imported juices I like are, off the cuff: Bowdens Mate by 5 Pawns (VapeMob/eCiggies), Bombies juices (VapeKing), Ripe Vapes juices (Sir Vape), Nicoticket (Juicy Joes) and Vaponaute (Vape Cartel).

If you like Rocket Sheep Booster, you might want to consider Wakonda by Nicoticket.

Blag Flag - probably not worth that money unless it really does it for you. Sweet espresso with truffle. I like it for a very occasional vape. Shall probably not re-order at the price.

My favourite vendors for local juices are Vapour Mountain, Voodoo Vapour and Vape Cartel.

Reactions: Like 4


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## rogue zombie (9/4/15)

For me personally, the expensive juices that I am willing to buy are getting less and less.

I mean don't sell me a "Strawberry Milkshake" juice for R300. I know of three brilliant local "strawberry milkshakes" between R120-R150.

Then it seems to me that EVERY US juice is now "premium". If you make a great Strawberry Milkshake, then good, charge a little more. But is it really "premium"? Is it really "complex"?

For example - Suicide Bunny Derailed. I taste Banana, Cookie, Cinnamon... but I think there is more, it's exquisite and every other puff tastes a little different. That's proper complex and so I am willing to pay more.

This is the same with quite a few US juices, but definitely not all of them. Fortunately the local retailers do have a good idea of proper juices, so they do most of the work in sorting for us.

So what I am saying, is for me the line between premium and well-priced is getting a little blury. Especially as others have said, there are some great local juices coming up.

Reactions: Agree 2


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## free3dom (9/4/15)

Juice is a lot like food. Paying 500 for a plate of dinner with some fancy cuisine can be very rewarding, but would you eat that every day? Some people would and that's great for them, but you can be just as satisfied going to a fast food restaurant and paying significantly less. But that brings us to the guy who sells food on the street, here it's a bit hit and miss, you sometimes get something great and other times...not so much 

Personally I like the local juices, and as the others have mentioned the local juices are catching up and even surpassing the imported ones in terms of quality and flavour - and they always win on pricing 

I would avoid the really cheap juices however...they ones you don't buy from proper vendors (registered on here). In addition to tasting like bath water, there is no guarantee that they are not filled with all sorts of nasty stuff that you should not be vaping 

In the end taste is a very subjective thing and only you can decide what works for you and what doesn't...experimentation is key, but don't think that just because a juice is expensive you will like it

Reactions: Like 2 | Agree 4


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## rogue zombie (9/4/15)

On the local front, if you stick to the vendors listed here on the retailer section, you wont get any cheap and nasty.

http://ecigssa.co.za/categories/retailers-vendors.11/

Reactions: Agree 3


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## Ashley A (9/4/15)

I have to disagree with the 2 comments about getting what you pay for.

Our local liquids from VM and Skyblue are premium quality and to me, outrank most of the +-R300 import juices. I'd choose Melinda's Nilla Custard over Jimmy's Crème Brûlée any day at a third the price.

I agree, never buy the cheap copy stuff from the street side vendors (unless you just want the bottles) as that can make you sick and tastes bad.

All being said, try reputable juices in your gear. It tastes different in different setups. Each has different nicotine level requirements and different PG/VG ratios that will suite you. Pick a flavour or flavourless and try it at different nic levels, then try different PG/VG ratios which may also need you to readjust the nic level until you find your sweet spot, then order your juices in those requirements which our local juice vendors are happy to prepare for you.

Then enjoy but don't let a high price make you think it is better than a good price. Stay away from too good to be true prices unless 1 of our vendors here are doing a rediculous promo on this forum (then order extra)

Reactions: Like 1 | Can relate 1


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## moonunit (9/4/15)

Thanks for all the informative responses. Everything being said makes a lot of sense.

Busy ordering some liquid from a local vendor, at a 3rd the price and it seems highly rated by a lot of members. Will definitely get some more Booster though.

Reactions: Like 1 | Winner 1


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## Viper_SA (9/4/15)

Have to agree with the above comments. By the way, most of the cheaper juices are more PG orientated, thus the massive throat hit at sub ohm levels compared to the twisp. I started mixing my own juices, and I have to be honest, some of the concoctions taste great and I will gladly use them as all day vapes for the economy of it, but on occasion a nice imported juice is really awesome. I wouldn't pay that price for a staple juice supply though. Think of it as having a nice single malt scotch as a started and then switching to a cheaper, say Black Grouse whiskey to use all day. When you need to get plastered fast, there is always Harrier 

I recently got a bottle of Tark's Reserve Rasputin, it is heavenly! But I mouth-to-lung that like a real scrooge .... Too expensive to enjoy every day, all day

Reactions: Like 1


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## Andre (9/4/15)

Viper_SA said:


> Have to agree with the above comments. By the way, most of the cheaper juices are more PG orientated, thus the massive throat hit at sub ohm levels compared to the twisp. I started mixing my own juices, and I have to be honest, some of the concoctions taste great and I will gladly use them as all day vapes for the economy of it, but on occasion a nice imported juice is really awesome. I wouldn't pay that price for a staple juice supply though. Think of it as having a nice single malt scotch as a started and then switching to a cheaper, say Black Grouse whiskey to use all day. When you need to get plastered fast, there is always Harrier
> 
> I recently got a bottle of Tark's Reserve Rasputin, it is heavenly! But I mouth-to-lung that like a real scrooge .... Too expensive to enjoy every day, all day


Ah, I was wondering about that from that thread of yours. Glad you like it. I am a Tarks (Matador, Troy) fan too.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Paulie (9/4/15)

When it comes to getting juice i only give advice based on my own experiences as i dont think its fair to tell people whats better or not as everyone has different taste buds and also opinions. The best way i can explain it is that you will go on a flavour journey and depending on what you like will determine which juice will be your favorite! Hopefully you will be able to find a few ADV (All Day Vapes) on your journey and then you will also know what exactly you will like.

Some of the local juices have improved alot over the last few months and have defiantly got closer (Not quite there yet) to some of the international juices quality. However i still feel there is a gap as there are more options and flavour profiles available that you can get from overseas.

Also there are different categories when it comes to choosing juices :

Menthol/Mint
Desserts/custards/baked
Sweets 
Fruit
Tobacco
Cereal
etc

Hope this helps.

Reactions: Like 3


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## ShaneW (9/4/15)

What I find really exciting is that the local juices are evolving at such a pace, the gap between local and imported is closing quickly. 

One thing that I still find lacking in local juices is NET(naturally extracted tobacco) and NEF(naturally extracted flavouring) and I feel this the main difference between our local and imported. NET and NEF is what gives juices an exclusive flavour, once the local producers (hint hint  ) get the hang of this, it's pretty tricky ... I'm convinced the imports will slow massively. 

I have been vaping imports exclusively for many months and only now have started enjoying local again.

Reactions: Like 4


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## cfm78910 (10/4/15)

ShaneW said:


> What I find really exciting is that the local juices are evolving at such a pace, the gap between local and imported is closing quickly.
> 
> One thing that I still find lacking in local juices is NET(naturally extracted tobacco) and NEF(naturally extracted flavouring) and I feel this the main difference between our local and imported. NET and NEF is what gives juices an exclusive flavour, once the local producers (hint hint  ) get the hang of this, it's pretty tricky ... I'm convinced the imports will slow massively.
> 
> I have been vaping imports exclusively for many months and only now have started enjoying local again.


I agree with @ShaneW about the NET and NEF issue. It makes a huge difference. I've been using imports exclusively since I started vaping and would love to rather support local juice manufacturers. But I haven't been able to find a local juice that comes close to imported ones like Five Pawns, Tark's, Nicoticket or Whitcher's Brew.


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## rogue zombie (10/4/15)

cfm78910 said:


> I agree with @ShaneW about the NET and NEF issue. It makes a huge difference. I've been using imports exclusively since I started vaping and would love to rather support local juice manufacturers. But I haven't been able to find a local juice that comes close to imported ones like Five Pawns, Tark's, Nicoticket or Whitcher's Brew.



I think this is arguable, and subjective.

An example is a mate of mine, not a vaper but likes to taste our "good stuff" - we let him try juices from Rocket Sheep Purple Alien, Mothers Milk... all of which he loved. Tasted Skyblue Nilla Custard and deemed that the best juice he had ever tried.

I'll admit, my two absolute favourite juices are Castle Long and Derailed, but there is so many "premium juices" that are matched by local juices, particularly some of the local stuff that's popped up in the recent few months.

Also, a DIY veteran should agree, you make one really good juice, be it clone or your own invention, and you will re-look at all these juices in a new light.

I don't think its like a great Single Malt versus a cheap one. A cheap one will never taste like a premium one. Whereas a local bottle of R150 juice can compete with one at twice the price.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 2


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## moonunit (13/4/15)

From my very limited experience I tried some local juices which were very nice and will do for an ADV for the time being, but when I vaped some rocket sheep after vaping the local juice for a couple of days they were worlds apart. The RS just had such an amazing depth of flavour. In defense of the local juice it hadn't had much chance to steep so want to give it another go in s week or 2. 

One major difference I did notice was the throat hit, with both being 6mg, the RS was much smoother/lighter. This left me a little unsatisfied to an extent, especially after a coffee or a meal. 

Ordered some local juices to broaden my horizons.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Reactions: Like 1


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## rogue zombie (13/4/15)

moonunit said:


> From my very limited experience I tried some local juices which were very nice and will do for an ADV for the time being, but when I vaped some rocket sheep after vaping the local juice for a couple of days they were worlds apart. The RS just had such an amazing depth of flavour. In defense of the local juice it hadn't had much chance to steep so want to give it another go in s week or 2.
> 
> One major difference I did notice was the throat hit, with both being 6mg, the RS was much smoother/lighter. This left me a little unsatisfied to an extent, especially after a coffee or a meal.
> 
> ...



Ye Rocket Sheep and Witchers are some of the finer juices out there for sure.

In regards to throat hit, I *think* a lot of these US boutique juices will be catering more to the vaper thats using higher-end equipment, usually more powerful and often drippers on top. So they will want to deliver a smoother vape with less throat-hit, so that the vaper can take in more vapour with every puff.

So you will find many of the boutique liquids will have higher VG content, and will generally deliver less throat-hit.

Reactions: Like 1


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## crack2483 (13/4/15)

ShaneW said:


> What I find really exciting is that the local juices are evolving at such a pace, the gap between local and imported is closing quickly.
> 
> One thing that I still find lacking in local juices is NET(naturally extracted tobacco) and NEF(naturally extracted flavouring) and I feel this the main difference between our local and imported. NET and NEF is what gives juices an exclusive flavour, once the local producers (hint hint  ) get the hang of this, it's pretty tricky ... I'm convinced the imports will slow massively.
> 
> I have been vaping imports exclusively for many months and only now have started enjoying local again.


Just watch out for the locally added NES.

Reactions: Funny 1 | Informative 1


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