# Step-down... I'm confused



## KB_314 (15/10/15)

Hey guys. I'll start with the back-story coz I feel like chatting, but if you haven't time and patience, just skip to para 2. 
Last week I decided that I "needed" another mid/high wattage regulated mod - I mainly rely on a VS DNA40, a Reo, and a Provari - I like small box mods best, which aren't obtrusive at the office and are pocket friendly. I was torn between the ipv d2 and the sigelei 75. Someone, let's call him VapeMOB ninja 1, had the d2 but recommended I get the sig. I felt he was giving me good advice and I know that sigelei has a much better reputation for quality, but just to hear it again, i decided to send a whatsapp to a man with extraordinary patience and who's helped me a lot in all this, even building my first coil for my first rda and teaching me how to build my own... VapeMOB ninja 2, who was not in store that day. He just said "sig every time". So naturally, I went with the D2. And anticipated buyers remorse to follow. The DC charging isn't an issue for me because I use a wall charger only. The lack of step-down, after SD was explained to me, might be an issue with Kanthal, but I'm now aware and can probably live with it, plus the TC workaround just incase I need to go lower voltage. Fine for a second mod (and I know there's a big battery monster mod in my future). It's just so damn smaaaall! And form factor got my vote that day. Anyway, I understood the lack of step down to mean basically, that I could never set a lower wattage (and corresponding voltage) to lower than that of the battery i.e on a fully charged battery, lets call it 4.2V, on say 0.5ohm coil, at 25W (3.54V), I would actually be getting 35W, regardless of what the display was telling me. So the issues seemed straight forward. But like I said, the builds I'm using it for, I can work around that. If this is the right understanding...

This is what confuses me, considering my mod lacks step-down. I'm using a fully charged, 2 week old LG battery. With a Goblin mini and 0,52ohm build, at 34W - the mod is reading 4.2V. When I lower it to 29W, its reading 3.88V - I expect the vape to be pretty much the same as when I'm at 34W - but it isn't. I'd put my head on a block that at 29W it's noticeably cooler with less vapour production. Is this possible? I'm in power mode so haven't activated the TC work-around. Seems strange. Anyone else noticed this with the ipv d2? Am I misunderstanding something?


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## Marzuq (16/10/15)

the wattage mode on the ipv d2 does not work. in my opinion its like having a mech mod with a constant output till your battery dies. basically a regulated mech. no matter what the wattage the vape remains the same. 
I believe this unit was made specifically for TC as the TC functions works properly.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Informative 2


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## stevie g (16/10/15)

I think you might be experiencing voltage drop. I'll explain it as I understand it. 

I have a dimitri box in parallel so I should be getting even less v drop that the D2.

Both batteries fresh off the charger @4.17v fired from the mech voltage tested with a multimeter from the 510 comes to exactly 4.17v as you would expect.

Build a coil @0.3r and test again. Probes on the negative and positive posts of my dripper when fired reads 3.65v so massive drop under load.

That's pretty much it when you put load on the battery volts drop to way below the 4.2 that you expect. 

In the future work with your assumed maximum voltage around 3.8 for high ohm loads and 3.6 for low ohm builds. That will give you an accurate idea of when step down would have kicked in when using steam engine to calculate wattage from ohms.

Reactions: Like 1 | Thanks 1


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## stevie g (16/10/15)

Your experience of a difference in heat going from 35 to 29 supports my view.


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## KB_314 (16/10/15)

Marzuq said:


> the wattage mode on the ipv d2 does not work. in my opinion its like having a mech mod with a constant output till your battery dies. basically a regulated mech. no matter what the wattage the vape remains the same.
> I believe this unit was made specifically for TC as the TC functions works properly.


Interesting observation especially that you've given this device a lot of vape time. It does seem best suited to TC. 
Right now, I think I'm getting a slightly better understanding after reading Sprints post. It seems (to me, in theory only) like a sort of regulated mech with constant output as you say, but for low ohm builds where you will find yourself at low voltages. At higher voltages (my mistake as I understand was in wrongly assuming a higher voltage output where I should have factored in voltage drop) it does, apparently, regulate power. I'm going to play around this weekend but have a feeling that I should rather use this as an opportunity to give TC another chance! - I haven't fully warmed up to it (no pun..).
Are you still enjoying your D2 @Marzuq ?


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## Marzuq (16/10/15)

KB_314 said:


> Interesting observation especially that you've given this device a lot of vape time. It does seem best suited to TC.
> Right now, I think I'm getting a slightly better understanding after reading Sprints post. It seems (to me, in theory only) like a sort of regulated mech with constant output as you say, but for low ohm builds where you will find yourself at low voltages. At higher voltages (my mistake as I understand was in wrongly assuming a higher voltage output where I should have factored in voltage drop) it does, apparently, regulate power. I'm going to play around this weekend but have a feeling that I should rather use this as an opportunity to give TC another chance! - I haven't fully warmed up to it (no pun..).
> Are you still enjoying your D2 @Marzuq ?


I've since sold my d2 and moved onto the sigelei 150tc. I mostly use the device in wattage mode but do enjoy tc from time to time with certain juices. Also did not like the 'regulated mech' as i do use a lower wattage in the morn and up it as the day moves along.


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## chamberlane (16/10/15)

Argh just as I'm about to get the IPV D2 someone says it doesn't work for variable wattage. And that's all I'm after, not TC. @Marzuq, what you mean it doesn't work?


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## Marzuq (16/10/15)

chamberlane said:


> Argh just as I'm about to get the IPV D2 someone says it doesn't work for variable wattage. And that's all I'm after, not TC. @Marzuq, what you mean it doesn't work?



Exactly that. You can change the wattage to whatever you prefer but from my experience there is no change in the vape at all. It's a constant vape from fully charge to empty regardless of what wattage you set it to. What it actually fires at I'm not certain of. But in TC she works very well.

Reactions: Informative 1


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## Silver (16/10/15)

Sprint said:


> I think you might be experiencing voltage drop. I'll explain it as I understand it.
> 
> I have a dimitri box in parallel so I should be getting even less v drop that the D2.
> 
> ...



@Sprint, slightly off topic, but for the record, the Volt drop on my Reo with a 0.9 ohm coil is about 0.25V. So if fresh batt is 4.20V, the voltage at the posts when firing is about 3.95V. 

With a lower ohm coil, ( i have tested down to about 0.6), the volt drop under load increases to about 0.3. Once i got 0.4, but after cleaning the atty and checking again, it was back to about 0.3V


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## stevie g (16/10/15)

@Silver it must be the superior metals used in the REO giving numbers like that. For the record my voltage drop was measured on a dimitri box with all contacts filed clean.


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## stevie g (16/10/15)

I am having trouble believing that if the D2 is set to 75w in power mode the Vape is the same as 40w if this was the case i'm sure the forums would be blowing up with D2 bashing.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Silver (16/10/15)

Sprint said:


> @Silver it must be the superior metals used in the REO giving numbers like that. For the record my voltage drop was measured on a dimitri box with all contacts filed clean.



The Reos are claimed to have a Vdrop under load of 0.2V at about 1 ohm
I think you are right, its the metals used in the firing mechanism
Copper beryllium if i remember correctly. Or is it gold plated
Anyhow, they changed the firing pin and the spring under the battery about a year ago and I think this improved it a lot. Maybe one of the Reonauts with experience of the older Reos before the new contacts can confirm.


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## Marzuq (16/10/15)

Sprint said:


> I am having trouble believing that if the D2 is set to 75w in power mode the Vape is the same as 40w if this was the case i'm sure the forums would be blowing up with D2 bashing.



Having owned a d2 I speak of experience. Many other d2 owners experience the same. I Googled the issue and it came up alot as well. The reason for the lack of bashing is that even tho the step down does not work the mod is still pretty awesome


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## stevie g (16/10/15)

I thought you were saying that the mod doesn't increase wattage at all my bad I misunderstood you. 

But again when I owned an ipv mini 2 I side stepped this issue by building higher ohm coils.


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## KB_314 (16/10/15)

Sprint said:


> I thought you were saying that the mod doesn't increase wattage at all my bad I misunderstood you.
> 
> But again when I owned an ipv mini 2 I side stepped this issue by building higher ohm coils.


I think that's what was meant - no power regulation, up or down. 
For me, in my very limited time so far (one week) I do feel a difference in power mode between say 25w and 35w depending on the coil. But from my readings, there's a pretty simple fix for those who might be affected by the lack of step-down, involving setting high temp, locking resistance and using kanthal builds in TC mode and basically substituting joules for watts. If interested, best to search on ECF because I don't remember the specific details - seems to be a successful fix.


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## SAVapeGear (16/10/15)

Marzuq said:


> the wattage mode on the ipv d2 does not work. in my opinion its like having a mech mod with a constant output till your battery dies. basically a regulated mech. no matter what the wattage the vape remains the same.
> I believe this unit was made specifically for TC as the TC functions works properly.


Maybe yours was faulty.

I am using the crown tank on my IPV D2 and when changing wattage there is a clear difference.

From 40W to 75W.A clear difference.

Wattage mode works perfectly on mine.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Winner 1


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## DougP (17/10/15)

There is tons of forums about this..it's when the volts required at a certain watts is less than the volts output of the battery the ipvd2 doesn't step down below that..
Drop your watts to a voltage below battery current voltage and see
They say like if you use a 0.5 ohm coil in power mode and try 20 watts it will not drop to there but stop decreasing to about 35 watts.
That is why there is lots of posts about how you have to use the kanthal in TC mode with max temp setting and then use joules mode to emulate watts mode.. The also say that the Chinese kinda messed it up a bit by comparing 1 watt to 1 joules on the ipvd2 so it kinda helps cause when you use the joules it will be same number as watts.. So 20 joules would be 20 watts


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## DougP (17/10/15)

https://m.reddit.com/r/electronic_c...o6/ipv_d2_power_issue_cant_return_to_101vape/

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## DougP (17/10/15)

https://m.reddit.com/r/electronic_cigarette/comments/3g98yl/ipv_d2_power_mode/

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## DougP (17/10/15)

https://www.planetofthevapes.co.uk/...74-ipv-d2-no-step-down-what-does-it-mean.html

And the list is endless



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## stevie g (17/10/15)

Dude we gathered that part we are just confused by marzuq's statements.


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## Marzuq (17/10/15)

Sprint said:


> Dude we gathered that part we are just confused by marzuq's statements.


 @DougP pretty much cleared up my. Statements. And also reiterated @SAVapeGear saying that 40w up has a clear difference. Most tank users set wattage below 40w. 
Does that answer ur question @Sprint

Reactions: Like 1


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## DougP (17/10/15)

Was just trying to clarify what marzuq was saying.. DUDE

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## stevie g (17/10/15)

@Marzuq this is still not a correct view point. Build the coil acording to the minimum wattage you want and work up from there.

For instance a 0.9r coil accounting for v drop will take you minimum watts to 16. And that's only 7 wraps of 28g around 3mm in dual coil configuration.

Anyway I'm done discussing this not my problem if some don't know how to work with what they have.


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## stevie g (17/10/15)

DougP said:


> Was just trying to clarify what marzuq was saying.. DUDE
> 
> Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk


How kind of you. DUDE.

Still you didnt stop to think did you? It's something to work around not be stumped by.


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## Marzuq (17/10/15)

Sprint said:


> How kind of you. DUDE.
> 
> Still you didnt stop to think did you? It's something to work around not be stumped by.



Why do we have 'work around' a known issue. The device either works or it doesn't. Every other regulated device I've got works regardless of coil build and battery being used. If i vape at 35 on a 0.4ohm build I expect exactly that regardless of what mod I am using. Bit silly of me to buy a device and expect that I suppose.

Reactions: Agree 2


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## DougP (18/10/15)

@Sprint

Going through the box my ipvd2 came in I never found any disclaimer telling me that the device I just bought can't in actual fact run sub ohm coils in power mode with the coil volts lower than the current battery voltage as it does not support step down in power mode. 
I then checked all the sales materials on the web and also could not find any disclaimer on any sales material for the Ipvd2 stating the same.

Sadly there is numerous people like myself that trust the manufacturer when we go out to purchase a new regulated mod assuming that we would be buying a device with this basic capability given that literally every other mod in this price range has this as a entry level standard feature. 

The ability to have step down capabilities in power mode surely should be one of the basic functions and corner stones in a regulated mod. If not then surely it should be clearly advertised as such.
..
I spent a lot of money on a regulated mod that lacks the basic functionality to allow me to run my sub tank mini with a OCC 0.5 ohm coil on it in power mode unless I use a unconventional method of using it as a Kantian coil (set as a nickel coil) in TC mode with the temperature set at maximum and joules for power.. 



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Reactions: Agree 2


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## stevie g (18/10/15)

Instead of moaning at least I gave the guy some tips to mitigate the issue.

Reactions: Dislike 1


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## stevie g (18/10/15)

Marzuq said:


> Why do we have 'work around' a known issue. The device either works or it doesn't. Every other regulated device I've got works regardless of coil build and battery being used. If i vape at 35 on a 0.4ohm build I expect exactly that regardless of what mod I am using. Bit silly of me to buy a device and expect that I suppose.


No me is telling you how to spend your money but these are Chinese companies and a bit of research goes a long way. I'm a bit surprised someone on the forum as long as you have been didn't pick this up. I swear I remember you had an ipv mini 2 at some stage which exhibits the same behaviour.

Reactions: Dislike 1


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## Yusuf Cape Vaper (18/10/15)

Sprint said:


> No me is telling you how to spend your money but these are Chinese companies and a bit of research goes a long way. I'm a bit surprised someone on the forum as long as you have been didn't pick this up. I swear I remember you had an ipv mini 2 at some stage which exhibits the same behaviour.


His ipv mini2 had no step down issues. There was an auto fire issue. 


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Reactions: Thanks 1


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## DougP (18/10/15)

@Sprint
These might be Chinese companies but they are sold by local agents..

Can you give me a tip as to how I should use my sub tank mini running a standard OCC 0.5 coil on this device in power mode



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## Marzuq (18/10/15)

Sprint said:


> No me is telling you how to spend your money but these are Chinese companies and a bit of research goes a long way. I'm a bit surprised someone on the forum as long as you have been didn't pick this up. I swear I remember you had an ipv mini 2 at some stage which exhibits the same behaviour.



That is correct I did have the ipv mini 2 but it bombed out long before I had a real chance to use the unit. As for the d2... Like I said. It either works or it doesn't. And in my opinion. If it does not cover every scenario. Regardless of where it is manufactured. And it's not been marketed jn the manner that it works. Then it does not work


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## Marzuq (18/10/15)

Sprint said:


> Instead of moaning at least I gave the guy some tips to mitigate the issue.



I don't believe anyone was moaning. The member asked for advice and opinions and that is all that everyone here was offering. I don't see your opinion being more correct than any of the others being posted in this thread. You have stated yours and for anyone using the device for 40w and above. Your advice works. In the majority case where members are using tanks and firing 35w and below, well you get the point

Reactions: Agree 2


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## DougP (18/10/15)

@Marzuq
We'll put 
@Sprint I really don't understand your abrasive responses to me and comments that come across directed more at the person than the issue
I was under the impression when a thread was created and a question was asked a person could contribute by sharing their knowledge on that thread.
Right now you are like me, a contributor on this thread, so I fail to see why you would steam roll you way over all of us here with such a abrasive and demeaning attitude. 





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Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 3


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## DougP (18/10/15)

Anyway i have given my 10 cents worth so time to depart before I get my next stream rolling

I would just like to say that I own a new ipvd2 and use it for TC mode. In TC mode this device performs amazingly well. 


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## Yusuf Cape Vaper (18/10/15)

DougP said:


> Anyway i have given my 10 cents worth so time to depart before I get my next stream rolling
> 
> I would just like to say that I own a new ipvd2 and use it for TC mode. In TC mode this device performs amazingly well.
> 
> ...


Don't let his arrogance put you off bud. All comments and advice is welcome on the forum. Just ignore the steamrolling that sprints around these parts every now and then. 


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Reactions: Like 2 | Agree 1


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## DougP (18/10/15)

@ yusaf
Brilliant 10/10..
quite frankly I am more than willing to spend money on data costs to assist and impart knowledge on a forum, but why the hell would I spend my own money to indulge and justify myself to somebody I don't know and have no intention of wanting to know who is more focused on attacking the person then contributing to the forum



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## stevie g (18/10/15)

Seems I shook a few trees. 

The OP asked for help in figuring out step down which I did. 

He didn't ask an opinion of the device which as we all know are like arseholes yadda yadda.


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## Gazzacpt (18/10/15)

This has been an issue for a while the with various mods the first one that comes to mind is the hanna/canna build over 1ohm and you styling. If the voltage readout flashed while firing it wasn't regulating just dumping straight batt voltage to the atty. 
Moral of the story. Build to what the mod requires and happiness is. 
On the hanna for instance I built 1ohm then tuned the watts till I found my happy place. Still got the vape I wanted.

Reactions: Like 1 | Winner 1


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