# Newbie wanting to mix



## Faraaz (21/7/17)

Hi There 

Im have no clue at all how concentrates etc work 

always thought i would just buy and carry on but its starting to get heavy on the pocket 

&&& the recipes are looking good especially @Andre 's recipes

Could someone please assist ?

Thanks

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## Hardtail1969 (21/7/17)

ROTFLMAO... welcome to the jungle... and this rabbit hole goes deep alice.

1. Never buy a flavour unless its part of a recipe you want to make.
2. Places like plastic shops, such as westpack have cheap mixing equipment

there are many more...

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## OPium46 (21/7/17)

Hey @Faraaz, 

There is a great channel on Youtube for everything vaping  
Check out the links below for DIY e-juice.

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## aktorsyl (21/7/17)

Hardtail1969 said:


> 1. Never buy a flavour unless its part of a recipe you want to make.


Hmm. If you want to keep DIY as cheap as possible, I agree with that one.
If you want to discover the possibilities and potential with DIY, then I strongly disagree

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## Andre (21/7/17)

Here is a list of DIY Vendors.

A few great tips for success here.

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## contrid (21/7/17)

I started out with DIY ejuices by buying flavors for 2 or 3 recipes.

Then you can expand your flavor range by looking at recipes for what you have already and buy the flavors you may need to complete those recipes. Soon you'll have enough flavors to make a few recipes and also experiment on your own.

Many of the ejuice recipe websites allow you to filter/search by flavor as well so that makes it easier.

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## KZOR (21/7/17)

@Faraaz
Forum members don't often support their own members so i will link you to three of my locally made videos which could possibly assist.
DIY is great fun and definitely a must especially if you on a tight budget.

Have a look here.

See numbers 7 , 9 and 13.

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## Imtiaaz (21/7/17)

This is how I started and actually kept mixing for a long time, a bit tiresome but it is probably the cheapest way to go and the results are still awesome.

1. Went on a couple of websites, for e.g. http://e-liquid-recipes.com/ and found some 3 ingredient recipes that I thought sounded good. 
2. I then downloaded a mixing app, e.g. Vape tool from the app store.
3. Inserted all the information I needed in the app and now knew how much of each ingredient, PG, VG and NIC I needed.
4. I then purchased the amount I needed and decided I will be mixing by volume.
5. So I picked up a few syringes for my concentrates, two bigger syringes for the PG and NIC (as they usually don't require as much in the mix) and a Huge syringe for the VG (As its the biggest component of the mix). 
6. Also picked up some nice 16 gauge needles (nice and wide) just for the concentrates at Dischem. The needles and syringes will work out to like 30 to 40 bucks depending on how much concentrates you planning to use.
7. Picked up some bottles from Bonpack (If you're from Cape Town) and was ready to mix.
8. Just threw in the amounts of concentrates and bases the app told me to and there we go. DONE!!!JUICE!!!!

Well not quite, Be sure to give the juice the correct amount of steep time, the recipes usually state how long is required.

You will naturally, begin to buy excess concentrates and bases and then it will really become cost effective (until you start experimenting, lol), and you will grow from there as you sink deeper and deeper into the rabbit hole.

I hope this helps...Mix on people

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## Raslin (23/7/17)

Agree with all the above, ejuciemeup is a great calculator. I have been vaping diy exclusively for about 2 years now. Costs me about 1k every three months or so.

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## RichJB (23/7/17)

@Faraaz, your starting costs will depend quite a lot on the range of juices that you like to vape. If you only have a couple of profiles that you prefer and are willing to vape all the time, like a strawberry cream and a menthol tobacco, then you can start off very cheaply. If you vape a wide range of juices and you like trying almost every profile there is, then you will need to buy a lot more concentrates to get up and running. So it will take a bit longer to get established in DIY.

Either way, you should not have to spend more on DIY in any given month than you already spend on store-bought juice. And, over time, you will end up spending considerably less. I have done an exhaustive breakdown of DIY v store-bought costing over time here.

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## Glytch (23/7/17)

@Faraaz I started small about a year ago and I have not, to this day, spent more than R700 per month on DIY stock. In fact I've gotten to the point now where I only spend R700 every second month which means every other month I have $$$ for hardware. I only used to buy new concentrates when I needed them for a recipe. Slowly I learnt what the regular flavours were and buy those monthly.

I have now gotten to the point that after buying what I need for my recipes I still have money left over on my DIY months and I now buy flavours I don't have just for the sake of making testers of those flavours.

To give you an idea of quantity, I mix about 600ml juice every six weeks.

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## TheV (2/8/17)

Hoping I can hi-jack this thread instead of creating a new one...

Would this be a good place to start?
https://blckvapour.co.za/collections/starter-kits/products/starter-kit-2-scale-mixing
Obviously add some concentrates to that after researching a couple of recipes

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## aktorsyl (2/8/17)

TheV said:


> Hoping I can hi-jack this thread instead of creating a new one...
> 
> Would this be a good place to start?
> https://blckvapour.co.za/collections/starter-kits/products/starter-kit-2-scale-mixing
> Obviously add some concentrates to that after researching a couple of recipes


Well.. yes.
But if you're going to mix by weight, you don't really need syringes, pipettes, beakers, etc. If you were to take the scales and the bottles, and the VG/PG/Nic bases all separately, you end up with a total of around R450. That leaves R300 for more bottles and/or concentrates.

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## aktorsyl (2/8/17)

What I do is the following:

1) I keep my VG in the 500ml bottle that it comes in, but I put a witch-hat nozzle on it. Dispense straight from the bottle.
2) I decant my PG into a 100ml needle-tip PET bottle. Dispense from the smaller bottle.
3) I decant my nicotine into 100ml needle-tip PET bottles too. Dispense from those smaller ones.

With all of the above, I dispense directly from a container into the final container. So dripping nicotine from a PET bottle into an HDPE bottle which is the one where my juice ends up in.

The only time I use gloves nowadays is when I decant the nicotine into the smaller 100ml PET bottles (I also use a small funnel when I do this, maybe get one of those too).

And then, juice bottles. HDPE is fine, although lately I started to prefer PET with needle-tips. The dropper tips on HDPE are messy as hell. But either way.. you need a LOT. Like a lot a lot. Your testers you will typically mix in 20ml or 30ml bottles, and it can reach high numbers before long.

For labeling, in the beginning just use plain old masking tape. I used it for months. Tear off a piece, write the name of the jiuce and the nic content on it, and stick it on the bottle. Very easily removed when you wash them.

EDIT: Also, get this: http://diyjuicecalculator.com/
It manages your inventory (of bases and concentrates) as well as your recipes. If you set it up right it also calculates your costs and manages your shopping lists. And in my case it contains copious amounts of notes on each recipe.

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## Andre (2/8/17)

TheV said:


> Hoping I can hi-jack this thread instead of creating a new one...
> 
> Would this be a good place to start?
> https://blckvapour.co.za/collections/starter-kits/products/starter-kit-2-scale-mixing
> Obviously add some concentrates to that after researching a couple of recipes


Presuming:

For a start you will only be mixing tried and tested popular recipes in quantities of 30 ml.
Your nic content is low enough to use 36 mg in PG. Not more than 6 mg I would say. Higher than that you either need the 36 mg Nic in VG or you need 72 or 100 mg Nic in PG. Imo, latex cloves are really not needed for 36 mg nic.
You will mix directly into the final bottles, which just means you have to shake well after capping.
Your ratio will be 70VG/30PG or 60VG/40PG
My list:

1 x scale 0.01
500 ml VG
200 ml PG
100 ml 36 mg Nic in PG
20 x 30 ml dropper bottles
3 x witch hat nozzle caps to dispense the VG, PG and Nic.

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## RichJB (2/8/17)

For R795, I'd buy:

Scale R240
Nic R110
VG R50
PG R20
4x100ml amber glass bottles R60
6x50ml dropper bottles R30
Funnel R15
Nozzles for VG and PG R8
100ml dropper for nic R7
FW Fruit Rings R40
TFA Bavarian Cream R40
FA Fuji R40
TFA Vanilla Bean Ice Cream R40
Cap Vanilla Custard v1 R45
Cap Sugar Cookie v2 R45
Total: R790

With those concentrates, you could make 250ml of skiddlz's Cereally Easy Loops, 125ml of shyndo's D Cream and 125ml of ID10-T's Simple Sugar Cookie. You'd still have about half a bottle each of nic, Cap VC1 and FA Fuji left over, the rest would be finished. But that's 500ml of finished juice. At ordinary commercial prices, 500ml of juice would cost you around R2500. You've spent R790. So you've got everything you need to DIY (scale, bottles, funnel, nozzles) and you've already saved R1700 with your first batch.

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## TheV (2/8/17)

aktorsyl said:


> Well.. yes.
> But if you're going to mix by weight, you don't really need syringes, pipettes, beakers, etc. If you were to take the scales and the bottles, and the VG/PG/Nic bases all separately, you end up with a total of around R450. That leaves R300 for more bottles and/or concentrates.


Thanks. This is the kind of information I need.

What I have:
100ml bottles (plastic)
50ml bottles (plastic)
30ml bottles (plastic)
30ml bottles (glass)

What I don't need:
Nic - I don't vape nicotine

What I need:
Scale - I see the is a bigger one for R240. Would this be easier/more comfortable to work with?
VG & PG - Pretty cheap so might as well get quite a bit of it.
Concentrates - This is the trickiest part to decide on!!!

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## RichJB (2/8/17)

I would get the R240 scale for sure.

Concentrates are quite easy. Go to the All The Flavors flavour search. In the search bar, just type the name of a flavour you want. Don't worry about manufacturer at this stage. Say you're interested in lime vapes. Just type "lime" in the search bar. It will then give you a list of all the lime flavours. Look at which one(s) has been used in the most recipes and then click on that name. It will take you to a page which lists all the recipes. From there, you can decide which lime recipes look appealing to you and write down the names of the other flavours required.

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## TheV (2/8/17)

@aktorsyl @Andre @RichJB, thanks for all the information! I really appreciate it.
I've scanned over it and it looks very informative and will really help me to start out.
I'm gonna go over it in detail in a bit. Have a bit of a crisis at work at the moment (just as my new RTA comes in, typical).

Thanks again. I'll report back here once I've had a chance to process everything

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## PAM (2/8/17)

RichJB said:


> For R795, I'd buy:
> 
> Scale R240
> Nic R110
> ...


This looks like my plan as well. I only started last month and bought R600 worth of goodies , Part of that was scale PG VG and nic wich left a few rands for flavours. Only got 3 flavours for a start. Now i decided i wil budget R500 per month for new goodies and as mentioned higher up in the post i will decide on 2 or three recipes and buy those flavors. One of those will be a shake and vape recipe to keep me going wile i wait for the more complex mixes to steep. So i will build my arsenal over time. Only also started now with diy so sooooooo looking foreward cant wait for next months juice. I already made about 300ml of juice with what i bought so my scale ect is paid for already by what i saved on my first purchase..thx guys i enjoy reeding all your advice

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## TheV (2/8/17)

RichJB said:


> For R795, I'd buy:
> 
> Scale R240
> Nic R110
> ...


Thanks so much for the comprehensive list including 3 easy mixes to start! 

I'd like to get the order to R1000 for free shipping so I'm making the following changes:
4 x 500ml VG
1 x 500ml PG
0 x Nic (no nicotine for me)

Perhaps I should add some more concentrates.
Any recommendations for some more simple mixes?

What are the amber glass bottles for?
Can I mix directly into the droppers?

Thanks again to everyone for the info. Really helps a noob like me

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## aktorsyl (2/8/17)

TheV said:


> Thanks so much for the comprehensive list including 3 easy mixes to start!
> 
> I'd like to get the order to R1000 for free shipping so I'm making the following changes:
> 4 x 500ml VG
> ...


Well recipes are subjective as hell, but these are simple staples that worked for me:

WATERNANA:
TFA Watermelon: 3%
FA Banana: 1%

DOUG's AWESOME SAUCE
TFA Bavarian Cream: 3%
TFA Juicy Peach: 6%
TFA Strawberry Ripe: 5%
INW Shisha Strawberry: 3%

BLUE'ADDY YOGURT
TFA Bavarian Cream: 1.33%
FA Blackcurrant: 2%
TFA Blueberry Extra: 6.6%
TFA Greek Yogurt: 8%


That said, I wouldn't get FA Blackcurrant, TFA Greek Yogurt or FA Banana now, unless you like the profiles. The rest of the ingredients above are very widely used and are a safe bet. I would add FA Cream Fresh to the list.

I usually order 2 or 3 brand new concentrates every month when I do my restocks. This month I got INW Creme Brulee and... well I can't remember now. But even if I don't have a recipe for it on hand, I know it's a profile that works and a concentrate that's highly rated. So if you want to build out your collection, that's an option too.

To begin with, however - shop for recipes. To be honest, you'd have better luck looking here: https://www.ecigssa.co.za/forums/e-Liquid-recipes/
Find the recipes you think would suit you, and make a list of the concentrates required. Just a warning: you're going to end up with a list of 20 or so because it's a bottomless pit  But then you can start whittling away at them, one or two recipes at a time.

Then again, if you really just want to burn R100.. get a pack of Streaky Cotton (I see BlckVapour sells it now). It's bloody amazing cotton.

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## TheV (2/8/17)

aktorsyl said:


> Well recipes are subjective as hell, but these are simple staples that worked for me:
> 
> WATERNANA:
> TFA Watermelon: 3%
> ...


Thanks for the suggestions. Those sound like cool mixes and I'm definitely willing to give them a try as well.
Oh, I'll definitely add some Streaky Cotton to the order! Keen to give that a go.
I think I'll place my first order with what you guys suggested here and then look through the recipes at leisure, getting a list together for the restock order.

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## aktorsyl (2/8/17)

TheV said:


> Thanks for the suggestions. Those sound like cool mixes and I'm definitely willing to give them a try as well.
> Oh, I'll definitely add some Streaky Cotton to the order! Keen to give that a go.
> I think I'll place my first order with what you guys suggested here and then look through the recipes at leisure, getting a list together for the restock order.


Sounds like a good plan, yup.
As for the Streaky Cotton, yes I can definitely recommend it. I tried a sample this evening and it slurps up juice like a monster. It's extremely fluffy and loose.. so much so that if you comb it out you don't even feel any resistance on the tweezers. First time I saw that the cotton soaks up the juice in less than a second when I prime it.

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## TheV (2/8/17)

aktorsyl said:


> Sounds like a good plan, yup.
> As for the Streaky Cotton, yes I can definitely recommend it. I tried a sample this evening and it slurps up juice like a monster. It's extremely fluffy and loose.. so much so that if you comb it out you don't even feel any resistance on the tweezers. First time I saw that the cotton soaks up the juice in less than a second when I prime it.


Sounds great. I've added a packet of that to my order.
I hope I get it in time for the weekend!

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## aktorsyl (2/8/17)

TheV said:


> Sounds great. I've added a packet of that to my order.
> I hope I get it in time for the weekend!


Knowing @Richio , if you order it now you'll *definitely *get it before the weekend (unless the couriers themselves screw up somehow). There's a reason it's my primary DIY vendor.

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## RichJB (2/8/17)

TheV said:


> What are the amber glass bottles for?
> Can I mix directly into the droppers?



You can mix directly into the droppers. It is a leeetle bit trickier than mixing into glass bottles because the necks of droppers are very narrow. So you have to aim your VG and PG nozzles very carefully. It's not a biggie, I do it all the time but, in an ideal world, I'd rather mix into a wide-necked glass bottle than a narrow-necked dropper bottle.

I included the amber bottles because you might also want to mix up bigger quantities. The dropper bottles only hold 50ml, the amber bottles 100ml. So if you want to mix 100ml of a juice, you can do it in one amber bottle and then fill two 50ml dropper bottles from it. Also, some people prefer using glass, others plastic. So you could tailor it either way, switching the amber glass for more droppers or switching the plastic droppers for glass bottles with pipettes. I haven't noticed any difference between the two so I'm happy using either.

In terms of simple recipes, @aktorsyl has given you some good ones. Others I could recommend include the "3" series by MrColdOne:
3 Banana Nuts 
3 Peanuts PB Cheesecake
3 Doughnuts

Now you start seeing common concentrates coming into play, which is where you maximise your bang for buck in concentrates. For example, the 3 Banana Nuts has Cap Vanilla Custard in it. As I explained in the previous post, you would have about half a bottle of Cap VC left over from ID10-T's Simple Sugar Cookie recipe. So there you already have one ingredient needed in 3 Banana Nuts without needing to buy another concentrate. The more recipes you can find with common ingredients, the more efficiently you use your (initially) small stock of concentrates.

Another really easy one is Atmose Chifles, just two ingredients. 
Here's another simple one, CloudState's Banana Puddin'.
Catalan Dream is both very simple and very economical, only 4% total flavouring!
Harvest Cheesecake by Kopel is just Cap NY Cheesecake 4% and Cap Harvest Berry 3.5%

If you like fruit mixes, have a look at the World Mixing Competition Round 1 recipes. All of those are fruit mixes with just 3 ingredients.

That should give you something to start with.

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## TheV (2/8/17)

aktorsyl said:


> Knowing @Richio , if you order it now you'll *definitely *get it before the weekend (unless the couriers themselves screw up somehow). There's a reason it's my primary DIY vendor.


Cool. Sounds like a good supplier!



RichJB said:


> You can mix directly into the droppers. It is a leeetle bit trickier than mixing into glass bottles because the necks of droppers are very narrow. So you have to aim your VG and PG nozzles very carefully. It's not a biggie, I do it all the time but, in an ideal world, I'd rather mix into a wide-necked glass bottle than a narrow-necked dropper bottle.
> 
> I included the amber bottles because you might also want to mix up bigger quantities. The dropper bottles only hold 50ml, the amber bottles 100ml. So if you want to mix 100ml of a juice, you can do it in one amber bottle and then fill two 50ml dropper bottles from it. Also, some people prefer using glass, others plastic. So you could tailor it either way, switching the amber glass for more droppers or switching the plastic droppers for glass bottles with pipettes. I haven't noticed any difference between the two so I'm happy using either.
> 
> ...


Awesome. More recipes for me to research for my next round.
I've placed the order (including glass bottles) with the recipes you guys suggested. That should definitely be good to get me started.
I appreciate you guys taking time to answer all my silly questions and provide me with such detailed explanations and links to help me on this journey.
I promise I will try to contribute in due time and not just leech

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## aktorsyl (2/8/17)

TheV said:


> Cool. Sounds like a good supplier!
> 
> 
> Awesome. More recipes for me to research for my next round.
> ...


The DIY community here is a very cool group, I've found the information-sharing here extremely valuable over time.
Now for the big test, when you start mixing: whether you taste pepper in TFA VBIC, and whether you can taste any strawberry other than the shisha.

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## TheV (2/8/17)

aktorsyl said:


> The DIY community here is a very cool group, I've found the information-sharing here extremely valuable over time.
> Now for the big test, when you start mixing: whether you taste pepper in TFA VBIC, and whether you can taste any strawberry other than the shisha.


Man I'm looking forward to it! This is such an interesting hobby. And the people on here are fantastic.
Haha, I'll have to get back to you on those! Hopefully over the weekend 

Thanks guys. I'm gonna call it a night here. Its been great!

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## TheV (3/8/17)

Thanks again to @aktorsyl @Andre @RichJB. You guys are legends!
This is what I ended up ordering. I can't wait for the weekend! 


> 1x	Streaky Cotton (Prime-Wick) 10g
> 1x	Greek Yogurt Flavor Concentrate (TFA) - 10ml
> 1x	Blueberry (Extra) Flavor Concentrate (TFA) - 10ml
> 1x	Black currant Concentrate (FA) - 10ml
> ...

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## Glytch (3/8/17)

TheV said:


> Thanks again to @aktorsyl @Andre @RichJB. You guys are legends!
> This is what I ended up ordering. I can't wait for the weekend!



Damn. That's a great starter kit! Well done and happy mixing.

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## RichJB (3/8/17)

That is indeed a super kit. Congrats on the decision to mix by weight from the get-go. It is one of those things in life that 99% of DIYers start out wanting to mix by volume and 99% end up mixing by weight. It is probably the second most important decision to take in mixing. The most important being the decision to take up DIY.

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## Stillwaters (3/8/17)

I've also entered the rabbit hole know as diy. Thanks to all the more experienced his and halls here, i started mixing by weight from the start. However, never let it be known that I do things the easy way...first recipe I did requires a minimum 2 month steep...lol. Am enjoying the journey though and hope to be able to contribute at some time

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

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## TheV (3/8/17)

Damn these guys were super quick!

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## Stillwaters (3/8/17)

That they are. Great service from them

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

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## aktorsyl (3/8/17)

TheV said:


> Damn these guys were super quick!


Told you

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## RenaldoRheeder (3/8/17)

I'm watching this thread closely, because I will take the leap in September. But I have one chance only to buy right, because the next time will only be in December when I pop over to SA 


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## TheV (3/8/17)

RenaldoRheeder said:


> I'm watching this thread closely, because I will take the leap in September. But I have one chance only to buy right, because the next time will only be in December when I pop over to SA
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


The guys here got me from planning to order in under a day.
I'm sure they could assist you in getting together what you need

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## RenaldoRheeder (3/8/17)

TheV said:


> The guys here got me from planning to order in under a day.
> I'm sure they could assist you in getting together what you need



I'm sure they will - I have a good idea already on the equipment needed. Now it is just to find the recipes that I think I will like and then add the concentrates. Experimenting with own recipes is a venture for another day and another year.

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## TheV (3/8/17)

RenaldoRheeder said:


> I'm sure they will - I have a good idea already on the equipment needed. Now it is just to find the recipes that I think I will like and then add the concentrates. Experimenting with own recipes is a venture for another day and another year.


Agreed. I at least wanted some reference recipes that work to get me started. I'll worry about mucking up my own recipes when I'm feeling more comfortable with all this wizardry

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## Silver (3/8/17)

RenaldoRheeder said:


> I'm sure they will - I have a good idea already on the equipment needed. Now it is just to find the recipes that I think I will like and then add the concentrates. Experimenting with own recipes is a venture for another day and another year.



Great to hear 
I sense a @RenaldoRheeder recipe brainstorming thread coming soon

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## RenaldoRheeder (3/8/17)

Silver said:


> Great to hear
> I sense a @RenaldoRheeder recipe brainstorming thread coming soon



Hahaha @Silver - careful - do not let me discover that you have knowledge and/or expertise that can feed my frenzy I'm on the vape express train mate I am on a certain DIY vendor site busy planning my order. Just need to determine the flavors - so recipe and DIYers research phase now 


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## Silver (3/8/17)

RenaldoRheeder said:


> Hahaha @Silver - careful - do not let me discover that you have knowledge and/or expertise that can feed my frenzy I'm on the vape express train mate I am on a certain DIY vendor site busy planning my order. Just need to determine the flavors - so recipe and DIYers research phase now
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



Lol
You wont get much knowledge from me in this area @RenaldoRheeder - not yet..... Hehe

But i think once you have figured out a few recipes and the concentrates, i suggest you create a thread and just let some of the experienced DIY folk have a look. You never know, you may pick up some great tips that can optimise your ordering seeing that you have to get it right and cant just order a few more here and there.

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## Raindance (3/8/17)

aktorsyl said:


> The DIY community here is a very cool group, I've found the information-sharing here extremely valuable over time.
> Now for the big test, when you start mixing: whether you taste pepper in TFA VBIC, and whether you can taste any strawberry other than the shisha.



Heartwarming to see @TheV being so elegantly introduced to the wonderful and sometimes frustrating world of DIY. @RenaldoRheeder , hope to see you taking the plunge soon as well. DIY is not as daunting as it may look at first, and then again, once you get hooked and venturing out on your own without the help of tried and tested recipes, it can get hectic. Hats off to those mixers out there that just seem to have a talent for creating juices from scratch.

In any case, @aktorsyl you make a striking statement above. I am one of those to whom strawberry concentrates taste like old dumpster. Do you imply that I would actually be able to taste strawberries in Strawberry Shisha? That would be great news.

Thanks and Regards

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## aktorsyl (3/8/17)

Raindance said:


> In any case, @aktorsyl you make a striking statement above. I am one of those to whom strawberry concentrates taste like old dumpster. Do you imply that I would actually be able to taste strawberries in Strawberry Shisha? That would be great news.


It's a bit like magic, but yes chances are pretty good that you will. Bear in mind that it's not a fresh/ripe strawberry but rather tastes like... well like strawberry shisha. It's like the strawberry flavour you find in YogiSip. In fact, that's probably the best way to describe it. That's also why it shines in pink milk recipes.

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## Raindance (3/8/17)

aktorsyl said:


> It's a bit like magic, but yes chances are pretty good that you will. Bear in mind that it's not a fresh/ripe strawberry but rather tastes like... well like strawberry shisha. It's like the strawberry flavour you find in YogiSip. In fact, that's probably the best way to describe it. That's also why it shines in pink milk recipes.


Just received this months concentrates but will for sure include in next months. Is it a brand specific concentrate, CAP, TFA,...?

Regards

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## aktorsyl (3/8/17)

Raindance said:


> Just received this months concentrates but will for sure include in next months. Is it a brand specific concentrate, CAP, TFA,...?
> 
> Regards


Solid plan!
It's Inawera (INW)

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## Raindance (3/8/17)

aktorsyl said:


> Solid plan!
> It's Inawera (INW)


Expensive but worth it I hope. Thanks for this revelation, I really appreciate it.

Regards

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## RenaldoRheeder (3/8/17)

Guys - respect to you all - the culture of sharing makes this a great community 


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## Glytch (3/8/17)

aktorsyl said:


> Solid plan!
> It's Inawera (INW)



Strawberries are dull on my palate to. Need to use TFA SRipe, CAP Sweet Strawberry and TFA Sweet Strawberry at 3% each for juice to even resemble strawberry.

INW Strawberry Shisha tastes like dirt and damp leaves. It has that hookah tobacco taste that I can't get out of my coils unless I rewick. It's way to potent for me even in a mix at 2%.

JF Sweet Strawberry sweet is apparently the last great hope for us strawberry challenged individuals. I have a mix steeping at the moment. Holding thumbs.

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## aktorsyl (3/8/17)

Glytch said:


> Strawberries are dull on my palate to. Need to use TFA SRipe, CAP Sweet Strawberry and TFA Sweet Strawberry at 3% each for juice to even resemble strawberry.
> 
> INW Strawberry Shisha tastes like dirt and damp leaves. It has that hookah tobacco taste that I can't get out of my coils unless I rewick. It's way to potent for me even in a mix at 2%.
> 
> JF Sweet Strawberry sweet is apparently the last great hope for us strawberry challenged individuals. I have a mix steeping at the moment. Holding thumbs.


It's interesting how sometimes our palates make up their own minds, yes. Like I can't stand TFA VBIC. Not even a little bit. People praise it far and wide, I remove it from my concentrate cupboards with the help of clergy.

Having said that, I've never tasted dirt or dry leaves in INW Strawb

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## Glytch (3/8/17)

aktorsyl said:


> It's interesting how sometimes our palates make up their own minds, yes. Like I can't stand TFA VBIC. Not even a little bit. People praise it far and wide, I remove it from my concentrate cupboards with the help of clergy.
> 
> Having said that, I've never tasted dirt or dry leaves in INW Strawb


I know right! Still can't find a genuine banana that I like. All too sweet and candy like.

Worst thing about the INW Strawberry is I mixed 100ml of Forest Blaster with it in because someone swore it worked in that mix. Tasted some last night and needed to rewick today because I kept tasting Hookah. Here's hoping a steep sorts it out or it's going to become "Forest Blaster Menthol and Sweetener".

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## aktorsyl (3/8/17)

Glytch said:


> I know right! Still can't find a genuine banana that I like. All too sweet and candy like.
> 
> Worst thing about the INW Strawberry is I mixed 100ml of Forest Blaster with it in because someone swore it worked in that mix. Tasted some last night and needed to rewick today because I kept tasting Hookah. Here's hoping a steep sorts it out or it's going to become "Forest Blaster Menthol and Sweetener".


FA Banana doesn't have that much sweetness (for me), but it's dry as hell. I usually pair it with LA Banana Cream in tiny quantities, but yes - you do get a lot of inherent sweetness that way  And creaminess, obviously.

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## Andre (4/8/17)

Glytch said:


> Strawberries are dull on my palate to. Need to use TFA SRipe, CAP Sweet Strawberry and TFA Sweet Strawberry at 3% each for juice to even resemble strawberry.
> 
> INW Strawberry Shisha tastes like dirt and damp leaves. It has that hookah tobacco taste that I can't get out of my coils unless I rewick. It's way to potent for me even in a mix at 2%.
> 
> JF Sweet Strawberry sweet is apparently the last great hope for us strawberry challenged individuals. I have a mix steeping at the moment. Holding thumbs.


You could try adding some FLV Alpine Strawberry. Expensive, but a little (0.25%) goes a long way.

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## RichJB (4/8/17)

Yes, I've also heard that Flv Alpine is a good bet for the strawberry non-tasters. Shisha Strawb is a polarising flavour, much like VBIC. Half love it, half can't stand it. I can taste strawberries and don't get pepper so I love them both. 3% Shisha Strawb with 4% TFA VBIC, me love you long time.



aktorsyl said:


> FA Banana doesn't have that much sweetness (for me), but it's dry as hell.



ID10-T will agree with you there. He is forever complaining that Pear and Blackcurrant are the only two FA fruits that aren't inexorably dry. He describes FA Strawb as "freeze-dried", heh. It doesn't bother me, sometimes you want dry for bakeries and such. But it is a thing.

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## Glytch (4/8/17)

Is there a banana concentrate that tastes like actual Banana? Like ripe fresh banana without the sweetness?

All the banana's that I've tried taste like these:

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## RichJB (4/8/17)

No, there isn't. For me, all bananas are runts to a degree. The ones I haven't tried yet and which have drawn positive reviews are Hangsen, FW which Shyndo describes as "banana baby food" and Purilum which Mysticrosell describes as:



> At 3 days this is definitely an authentic fresh banana. It's balanced on the edge of ripeness, just barely past the green yet not over ripe. It almost has a creamy texture to the body, but just the creamy meatiness of a natural banana and not an added cream. Not cloying at all, and not candy.
> 
> At 4 weeks this has smoothed out and become a creamy fresh banana without any hints of green. It's ripe and has natural levels of sweetness, nothing cloying or over ripe. A very balanced flavor, beyond green and before over ripe. There are no peel or green flavors in this.



I'll give it a go but I'm not holding my breath.

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## Glytch (4/8/17)

RichJB said:


> I'll give it a go but I'm not holding my breath.



Please let me know! From the description seems to be what I'm after.

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## TheV (4/8/17)

RichJB said:


> 4x100ml amber glass bottles R60


@RichJB, just to check... the white plastic insert that comes with these bottles is not something that I should be using, right?

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## RichJB (4/8/17)

White plastic insert? Is that a disk that fits into the cap? I dunno, never noticed it in my bottles.

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## TheV (4/8/17)

RichJB said:


> White plastic insert? Is that a disk that fits into the cap? I dunno, never noticed it in my bottles.


Yeah. It is inside the black cap. Once you screw the cap onto the bottle it the lodges itself into the neck of the bottle.
Something like this:

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## RichJB (4/8/17)

Oh no, that's a dropper mechanism. You don't need that.

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## TheV (4/8/17)

RichJB said:


> Oh no, that's a dropper mechanism. You don't need that.


Thanks for the confirmation. Just wanted to make sure I'm not missing anything.

I'm already itching to buy more concentrates. Oh my, there is no telling how deep this rabbit hole goes

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## RichJB (4/8/17)

A dropper like that might actually be useful if it fitted into the neck of a nic bottle. It would allow one to dispense nic from the original glass bottle without needing a pipette or syringe. But you don't use nic so not any use to you. Besides, I've found that these things drip so slowly that they're usually no bueno anyway.

Yeah, you'll want more and more concentrates as you go. As long as you have a plan for each concentrate, i.e that you're buying it for a recipe that you have and that there are other popular recipes it can be used in, you won't go far wrong. The danger is when you start buying unknown concentrates, for which you don't have recipes, on the basis of "this looks interesting". Usually, it won't be. That's where you end up with 50 bottles of junk where, after a year, you've used 1ml of the 10ml and end up ditching the rest. Stick with the known and popular concentrates and you'll get good bang for buck.

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## aktorsyl (4/8/17)

RichJB said:


> A dropper like that might actually be useful if it fitted into the neck of a nic bottle. It would allow one to dispense nic from the original glass bottle without needing a pipette or syringe. But you don't use nic so not any use to you. Besides, I've found that these things drip so slowly that they're usually no bueno anyway.
> 
> Yeah, you'll want more and more concentrates as you go. As long as you have a plan for each concentrate, i.e that you're buying it for a recipe that you have and that there are other popular recipes it can be used in, you won't go far wrong. The danger is when you start buying unknown concentrates, for which you don't have recipes, on the basis of "this looks interesting". Usually, it won't be. That's where you end up with 50 bottles of junk where, after a year, you've used 1ml of the 10ml and end up ditching the rest. Stick with the known and popular concentrates and you'll get good bang for buck.


Hey, @RichJB , I have some FA Guava for you 
It looked interesting....

Disclaimer: @TheV : Never ever buy that shit.

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## TheV (4/8/17)

RichJB said:


> A dropper like that might actually be useful if it fitted into the neck of a nic bottle. It would allow one to dispense nic from the original glass bottle without needing a pipette or syringe. But you don't use nic so not any use to you. Besides, I've found that these things drip so slowly that they're usually no bueno anyway.
> 
> Yeah, you'll want more and more concentrates as you go. As long as you have a plan for each concentrate, i.e that you're buying it for a recipe that you have and that there are other popular recipes it can be used in, you won't go far wrong. The danger is when you start buying unknown concentrates, for which you don't have recipes, on the basis of "this looks interesting". Usually, it won't be. That's where you end up with 50 bottles of junk where, after a year, you've used 1ml of the 10ml and end up ditching the rest. Stick with the known and popular concentrates and you'll get good bang for buck.


Most definitely. I'm going to stick to popular recipes and concentrates initially for sure.
I now have a wonderful starter kit that allows me to get going and get my toes wet.
While that is happening I can look for recipes to figure out what the next batch of concentrates is that I should be getting.
I definitely don't want to end up with a bunch of useless items but I also understand that there will obviously just be same concentrates and recipes that I just don't like. All part of the process.

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## TheV (4/8/17)

aktorsyl said:


> Hey, @RichJB , I have some FA Guava for you
> It looked interesting....
> 
> Disclaimer: @TheV : Never ever buy that shit.


I've read about your disappointment regarding that concentrate.
Maybe we should do: Dry Hits & Kak Mix instead?

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## aktorsyl (4/8/17)

TheV said:


> Maybe we should do: Dry Hits & Kak Mix instead?


Sold!

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## RichJB (4/8/17)

You will end up with some duds, it is inevitable. The trick is to limit the damage. This again is where the ATF flavour search is invaluable. To use the FA Guava example that @aktorsyl quotes, the typical new DIYer will reason "well, it's FA which HIC says are excellent flavours, so it'll probably be pretty good". That's when you do your double-checking, enter "guava" in the ATF search and it informs you that the various guava flavours have been used in the following number of recipes:
Cap Sweet Guava 401
Flv Pink Guava 237
FW Guava 20
FA Guava 18
TFA Guava 14

That gives you a pretty good idea of which guavas work and which don't. DIY is not a democracy, majority rule doesn't mean that you'll love flavours that the majority love and hate flavours that the majority hate. But it's a good starting point to help you decide.

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## TheV (4/8/17)

RichJB said:


> You will end up with some duds, it is inevitable. The trick is to limit the damage. This again is where the ATF flavour search is invaluable. To use the FA Guava example that @aktorsyl quotes, the typical new DIYer will reason "well, it's FA which HIC says are excellent flavours, so it'll probably be pretty good". That's when you do your double-checking, enter "guava" in the ATF search and it informs you that the various guava flavours have been used in the following number of recipes:
> Cap Sweet Guava 401
> Flv Pink Guava 237
> FW Guava 20
> ...


Pro-tip right there! I will definitely keep that in mind when getting my list together.
I'll pop my list in here before I'm ready to order, perhaps someone can just tell me which items I should definitely remove from there

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## RenaldoRheeder (9/8/17)

So - I took the plunge - equipment and stock ordered. Now wait for my trip to SA in September to collect (together with some other vapemail) - did I mention that it is only 44 more days before I start the trip to SA  So when I return to Nigeria in October, I will quietly start mixing. You will either hear back from me or not 


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## TheV (9/8/17)

RenaldoRheeder said:


> So - I took the plunge - equipment and stock ordered. Now wait for my trip to SA in September to collect (together with some other vapemail) - did I mention that it is only 44 more days before I start the trip to SA  So when I return to Nigeria in October, I will quietly start mixing. You will either hear back from me or not
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


This is great news Renaldo. Mind me asking what you ended up ordering?

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## RenaldoRheeder (9/8/17)

TheV said:


> This is great news Renaldo. Mind me asking what you ended up ordering?



Let's see ...

















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## TheV (9/8/17)

@RenaldoRheeder, that looks like a great list to start with. Please keep us posted on the mixes that you make with this (eventually, that is).

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## RenaldoRheeder (9/8/17)

TheV said:


> @RenaldoRheeder, that looks like a great list to start with. Please keep us posted on the mixes that you make with this (eventually, that is).



Feel free to suggest any additions - equipment or concentrates. For now I will play with only a few recipes to get the "hang of it" and get to know these flavours. Aiming at Strawberry/cake, Fruity, and menthol additions to this to see. I have not had much time to research recipes - just wrapped up month-end and year-end, and our new fiscal year with many changes has started. So in between all of this google and the forums had to make do for now



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## TheV (9/8/17)

RenaldoRheeder said:


> Feel free to suggest any additions - equipment or concentrates. For now I will play with only a few recipes to get the "hang of it" and get to know these flavours. Aiming at Strawberry/cake, Fruity, and menthol additions to this to see. I have not had much time to research recipes - just wrapped up month-end and year-end, and our new fiscal year with many changes has started. So in between all of this google and the forums had to make do for now
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


Out of the 6 recipes I've tried (most still steeping!) these 2 are my favorite so far:
D Cream: https://alltheflavors.com/recipes/38862
Doug's Awesome Sauce: http://e-liquid-recipes.com/recipe/754910/Doug's Awesome Sauce

I'm also just starting so will stick with tried and tested recipes. For my next order I'm definitely going to include the necessary for the following:
God Milk: https://alltheflavors.com/recipes/15504#god_milk_by_skiddlzninja
GuaBerry: https://www.ecigssa.co.za/diy-beverage-recipes.t25792/#post-400661

I'll also be looking for some nice menthol recipes to add to my next order... I'll post back with whatever sounds interesting.

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## aktorsyl (10/8/17)

TheV said:


> Out of the 6 recipes I've tried (most still steeping!) these 2 are my favorite so far:
> D Cream: https://alltheflavors.com/recipes/38862
> Doug's Awesome Sauce: http://e-liquid-recipes.com/recipe/754910/Doug's Awesome Sauce
> 
> ...


If I can suggest one, I created this one a while back. Might not be to your taste, but I love it. The "draft recipes" numbered up to almost 20 before I settled on the final version, but I'm tempted to start tweaking it again.
Link: https://www.ecigssa.co.za/lychberry-advice-needed.t38288/#post-551256

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## TheV (10/8/17)

aktorsyl said:


> If I can suggest one, I created this one a while back. Might not be to your taste, but I love it. The "draft recipes" numbered up to almost 20 before I settled on the final version, but I'm tempted to start tweaking it again.
> Link: https://www.ecigssa.co.za/lychberry-advice-needed.t38288/#post-551256


Thanks bud. I shall most certainly be adding that to my list. It definitely sounds like a recipe that I would enjoy!

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## TheV (11/8/17)

So one week into my DIY journey and here is my second batch:






Definitely enjoying D Cream, Cereally Easy Loops and Doug's Awesome Sauce so I made 100ml of those (96.5ml of D Cream actually  )
I'm trying a slight modification to Waternana. 2% Watermelon and 2% Banana. Calling it Waternana v2.
I took the Greek Yogurt out of the Blue'addy Yogurt. 2% Bavarian Cream, 2% Blackcurrent and 6% Blueberry (Extra). Calling it Blue'addy Nogurt.

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## aktorsyl (11/8/17)

TheV said:


> So one week into my DIY journey and here is my second batch:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Nice! That Greek Yogurt is tart as hell if you're not used to it, yes.
When you get some more ingredients, you should try my new yogurt base with it:

_FA Cream Fresh: 2%
CAP VBIC: 2%
CAP Creamy Yogurt: 1%
FA Vienna Cream: 1.5%
FA Meringue: 0.5%
FA Caramel: 0.5%_

Then you just add the fruit to that.

I've mixed up a yogurt stone (mixed up all the yogurt base concentrates together as one new concentrate, also known as a "stone") and then I just use that one at the right percentage (roughly 7.5%).

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## TheV (11/8/17)

aktorsyl said:


> Nice! That Greek Yogurt is tart as hell if you're not used to it, yes.
> When you get some more ingredients, you should try my new yogurt base with it:
> 
> _FA Cream Fresh: 2%
> ...


Thanks for the share. That sounds like a really cool base. I will certainly give that a try at some point!
So many cool new things to try with this DIY nonsense 
Yeah man, the Greek Yogurt is INTENSE  haha
I can definitely see it having a place in my arsenal though. Perhaps just in lower percentages. The Blue'addy Yogurt is getting better over time. I'm curious to see where it goes.

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## RichJB (11/8/17)

Glad to hear they're working for you, @TheV. If you're up for buying a Flavorah flavour shortly, there are two ridiculously simple yet tasty recipes that use Flv Milk and Honey. The first is Cokecan's Sick AF and the second is Cody's Vurvacious. Simple two-ingredient recipes that vape smooth and taste great. Slightly more complex but still simple and economical is Cheeba's Milk & Honey. You can sub FA Cream Fresh for the Flv Cream and it's still excellent.

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## TheV (11/8/17)

RichJB said:


> Glad to hear they're working for you, @TheV. If you're up for buying a Flavorah flavour shortly, there are two ridiculously simple yet tasty recipes that use Flv Milk and Honey. The first is Cokecan's Sick AF and the second is Cody's Vurvacious. Simple two-ingredient recipes that vape smooth and taste great. Slightly more complex but still simple and economical is Cheeba's Milk & Honey. You can sub FA Cream Fresh for the Flv Cream and it's still excellent.


Oh wow, thanks for the suggestions. Milk and Honey sounds really interesting. All 3 those recipes look like something I might enjoy so I'll definitely put that on the list of things I need to get.
Looks like my next order is going to be a bit bigger than I had initially anticipated 
I'll just need to pick up a couple of extra bottles as well. Thinking some chubby gorilla 30ml's will do nicely!

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## RichJB (11/8/17)

Milk & Honey is delicious. It's a bit of a misnomer, it's more of a dark brown caramel than actual milk and honey. But it vapes great on its own and it improves almost anything it's added to. It's also a very smooth and soothing vape, both Cokecan and Cheeba mention in their recipe notes that it's ideal for tired palates or sore throats. It's expensive at R75 a bottle but the three recipes I linked use it at 1.5, 2 and 2.5%. So taking 2% as an average, you can make 500ml of juice from a single 10ml bottle. That is crazy economical even at the R75 price tag.

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## TheV (12/8/17)

RichJB said:


> Milk & Honey is delicious. It's a bit of a misnomer, it's more of a dark brown caramel than actual milk and honey. But it vapes great on its own and it improves almost anything it's added to. It's also a very smooth and soothing vape, both Cokecan and Cheeba mention in their recipe notes that it's ideal for tired palates or sore throats. It's expensive at R75 a bottle but the three recipes I linked use it at 1.5, 2 and 2.5%. So taking 2% as an average, you can make 500ml of juice from a single 10ml bottle. That is crazy economical even at the R75 price tag.


I don't mind paying a bit extra for the right ingredient. Its all about the flavor at the end of the day so no point in not giving this a try.
And as you pointed out, the low percentages means that you will be getting a lot of value out of the "expensive" concentrate!
Besides, no matter which way you look at it, it is just so much cheaper going DIY.
I've mixed up about 600ml of juice and I still have so much stock left!

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## TheV (12/8/17)

aktorsyl said:


> Nice! That Greek Yogurt is tart as hell if you're not used to it, yes.


Day 6 ... oh hell no!
Day 8 ... wow, what is this?

I'm just testing but I keep redripping the Peerless with the Blue'addy Yogurt. Very lekker stuff once the Greek Yogurt mellows down a bit. It is still there and it is still tart but now it allows the other flavors to come through and completes the experience as a whole instead of completely overpowering everything.

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## aktorsyl (12/8/17)

TheV said:


> Day 6 ... oh hell no!
> Day 8 ... wow, what is this?
> 
> I'm just testing but I keep redripping the Peerless with the Blue'addy Yogurt. Very lekker stuff once the Greek Yogurt mellows down a bit. It is still there and it is still tart but now it allows the other flavors to come through and completes the experience as a whole instead of completely overpowering everything.


Yip, it's an acquired taste but I like it. It's not something I can vape as an ADV, but for a now-and-then? Very tasty.

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## TheV (12/8/17)

aktorsyl said:


> Yip, it's an acquired taste but I like it. It's not something I can vape as an ADV, but for a now-and-then? Very tasty.


Agreed! Thanks for the recipe recommendation. It is turning out to be a lekker flavor and a nice hands on learning experience in terms of how the taste changes while steeping.
Now if I can just get that Waternana sorted...

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## aktorsyl (12/8/17)

TheV said:


> Agreed! Thanks for the recipe recommendation. It is turning out to be a lekker flavor and a nice hands on learning experience in terms of how the taste changes while steeping.
> Now if I can just get that Waternana sorted...


Bring watermelon down to 2% and Banana to 0.75%. If you have Cream Fresh, add 0.4%, otherwise 0.5% Bavarian Cream. The Bav.Cream will change the taste profile a bit, but at 0.5% it won't be major and should still be able to tone down the top notes.

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## TheV (12/8/17)

aktorsyl said:


> Bring watermelon down to 2% and Banana to 0.75%. If you have Cream Fresh, add 0.4%, otherwise 0.5% Bavarian Cream. The Bav.Cream will change the taste profile a bit, but at 0.5% it won't be major and should still be able to tone down the top notes.


Thanks. I'll give the Bavarian Cream a try. I have 2 mixed bottles, 1 at standard 3% 1% and a v2 I'm trying at 2% 2%.
I'll give it a couple of days and add some Bavarian Cream to see how that changes the flavor.
I like watermelon so would really like to get this one fixed up

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## RenaldoRheeder (26/8/17)

SHOPPING List V2. Did a bit more reading up, added a recipe or two to try, added a few ingredients to try and compare. Ready for collection in September.

Also developed my spreadsheet system - must just work on the recipe side now.




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## TheV (10/9/17)

Newbie was finally forced to make a dedicated space for the growing amount of components involved in the process:

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## RenaldoRheeder (10/9/17)

TheV said:


> Newbie was finally forced to make a dedicated space for the growing amount of components involved in the process:



Impressive



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## TheV (10/9/17)

RenaldoRheeder said:


> Impressive
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


Thanks. It pales in comparison to some of the collections I've seen but I'm happy with it for my 2nd month of DIY

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## RichJB (10/9/17)

Your stash is growing apace, @TheV. Mine has nearly filled three seedling trays now, which is about as big as I want it to get. When you reach Apexified's level, things start getting out of hand. From the profile on Apexified by DIYorDie:

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## TheV (10/9/17)

RichJB said:


> Your stash is growing apace, @TheV. Mine has nearly filled three seedling trays now, which is about as big as I want it to get. When you reach Apexified's level, things start getting out of hand. From the profile on Apexified by DIYorDie:
> 
> View attachment 106833


Thanks @RichJB! Now I have a target in mind. Goal set... here I go building a Lab 
Seriously though, I think it will be up and down for me with growth of the stock.
Next month is most likely gonna not be this excessive

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## RichJB (10/9/17)

Yeah, that's a little extreme for me. At least half those concentrates will degenerate into nothing before he gets around to using them. I believe he has over 1000 concentrates. Even with my paltry stash of less than 300, there are concentrates I bought this time last year which are still almost untouched. Unless you're mixing for a group of friends, you just can't use up the more esoteric concentrates quickly enough. Kopel mixes a LOT. Not only does he mix for others, he's also a developer who creates his own one-shot line. In a year, he has managed to use 1ml of Flv Rich Cinnamon. There is not a chance he will use up the bottle before it fades into nothing.

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## TheV (10/9/17)

Yeah I'm definitely not aiming for that level.
I'm mixing for one and I don't really vape all that much. At work I maybe go out to vape twice a day.
So these mixes are going to last forever.
I'd like to find some ADV's (which I already have) and try some new recipes along the way.
This is very much a hobby for me. I shall try to keep it to that

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## haCid (20/9/17)

Good afternoon everyone,
Started vaping about a month ago.
Just want to say, after reading this thread, the community on here is awesome!

Would just like to ask a question or 2, I want to try my hand at self mixing, I would like advise on the following if possible;

I quit smoking after 14 years and took up vaping same day (bout a month ago), I have a problem where I do not taste everything as clearly as with menthol / cool flavors, especially the Opus Sonic one.

When you are mixing your juice, I would like to follow the recipe spot on, but, when will it be OK if I would like to add say another 1% of strawberry or vanilla? 
- Does this only happen after the steep time passed? 
- Not sure when to test, do you only test the juice after the steep time?
- Can I up all the flavors by say 1% for more taste? Or will this just turn out bad?

Bit of a newby here still 

Hope someone can help on this 

haCid

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## RichJB (20/9/17)

Recipes only provide a guide. More experienced mixers will often know, just by looking at a recipe, whether it suits their palate or not. I know many mixers who only take the recipe as a template and then tweak it. For example, Jenn Jarvis is a super-taster so her recipes are exceptionally lightly flavoured. Many mixers automatically double her percentages to get a juice that is closer to their palate. Things like sweetener are also palate-specific. Wayne likes a lot of sweetener, I don't. So I'll usually reduce the amount of sweetener in his recipes.

If you want to add more, I would mix up the recipe as is first. If the flavour balance is wrong, adjust to taste. But at least try the original first. What you also need to remember is that many concentrates have off-notes or attributes which only become apparent at a particular percentage. The recipe creator may have pushed the flavour as far as possible already. If you up the percentage without knowing the flavour, you could make it perfumey/bitter/cloying/floral/chalky. Increasing the percentage doesn't just increase the flavour strength. It can change the flavour and how it interacts with other flavours dramatically. 

You can test the juice straight after mixing to see how it is. But then I'd give it a proper steep. You can also taste at various points during the steep. So if it calls for a two-week steep, you can taste it fresh, after 3 days, after one week, after ten days, and then again at two weeks. This will give you a good idea how it changes as it steeps.

Upping all the flavours by 1% might actually result in you getting less flavour from the juice. A large number of flavours mute other flavours. If a recipe calls for 0.25% Ethyl Maltol and you increase to 1.25%, you will wonder where all your flavour suddenly went. Rather look at it as a ratio thing. Increasing Strawberry Ripe from 6% to 7% is a lot different from increasing Flv Rich Cinnamon from 0.1% to 1.1%. One is increasing the flavour ratio by about 16%, the other by about 1000%. So rather increase proportionally, like increasing each flavour by 10% or 20% of what it was. So increase a flavour from 5% to 6%, but only increase a 1% flavour to 1.2%. That way, you're increasing the flavour components proportionately.

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## haCid (20/9/17)

@RichJB thank you so much, you have explained this clearly and answered all my questions. It is much appreciated.

I will dive into this and see what happens. Will keep you updated though I will only start next week when I'm on leave 

haCid

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## Friep (20/9/17)

haCid said:


> Good afternoon everyone,
> Started vaping about a month ago.
> Just want to say, after reading this thread, the community on here is awesome!
> 
> ...


Basically I would say do not change anything on the recipe for now. Adding 1% of strawberry or 1% of vanilla can result in the recipe changing a great deal.

But do not let this get you down. As your experience with flavour concentrates grow and your taste buds and gear improve with time you will start to taste better and you will have a better understanding of the flavours and know wich ones you can increase etc. For instanse in a recipe like strawberry fog:
10% tfa strawberry ripe
5% tfa cheesecake Graham crust
2% tfa vanilla custard
3% tfa Bavarian cream
Now I feel that I can't taste the vanilla custard and bump it up by 1% and unfortunately now I can only taste vanilla custard.

On a second note what makes diy fun is that you can make changes and add that extra 1% if you want but I would make a small 10ml batch to test this first.

Testing takes place from the beginning after a mix I test a little bit in a rda and then putt it away for a steep and then test it periodically ever second day or every day and once I find the place where it tastes awesome I note it and know for the next mix 3days will do.

Hope you get into this rabbit hole of a mixing your own juice its really alot of fun and not all mixes will turn out vapeable but when they do they are amazing and its hand crafted.

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## haCid (20/9/17)

Thank you @Friep, will definitely try the 10ml approach

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## haCid (3/10/17)

Want to say a big thank you to everyone's help and suggestions and making this a bit easier,
made my first batch of Grape & Dragonfruit and a batch of Strawberry Cheesecake. 
Busy steeping them now. 

Will update on the taste after a few days as the Grape & Dragonfruit still tastes a bit dull (recipe asked for 2 days steeping).

Kind regards
haCid

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## Jengz (4/10/17)

Sorry to hijack this thread, just a quick question to the pros, I made a few mixes yesterday and they tasted wonderful! Followed recipes given on this forum, I then warmbathed the juices shook them up and left for steeping, when sampling them today the juices seem to have lost some substance, flavours are there but much weaker than yesterday, is this normal?

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## Friep (4/10/17)

Jengz said:


> Sorry to hijack this thread, just a quick question to the pros, I made a few mixes yesterday and they tasted wonderful! Followed recipes given on this forum, I then warmbathed the juices shook them up and left for steeping, when sampling them today the juices seem to have lost some substance, flavours are there but much weaker than yesterday, is this normal?



I don't consider myself a pro lol but this is normal. What recipes did you make? Some mixes I have found change for the better after 24h others not so much but pick up at the three day mark again.

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## Jengz (4/10/17)

Friep said:


> I don't consider myself a pro lol but this is normal. What recipes did you make? Some mixes I have found change for the better after 24h others not so much but pick up at the three day mark again.


I made simple cookie, loaded cranapple clone which was spot on day 1, shyndos d cream... all amazing on day one and now just so bland

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## Andre (4/10/17)

Jengz said:


> I made simple cookie, loaded cranapple clone which was spot on day 1, shyndos d cream... all amazing on day one and now just so bland


Could be your taste buds - I get those off days from time to time. Everything tastes either to sweet or muted.

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## Friep (4/10/17)

Simple sugar cookie I know needs some time to develop those custard and cookie notes. Shyndos d cream I made a variation last night of that will give it a go tonight. But it will benifit from a 2 week steep for that vbic to develop. The cranapple should be good still.

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## Friep (4/10/17)

Agree with the taste bud thing as well. And something else some clean wicks might help as well. 
Some other things to consider did you breathe the mixes? Don't this can lead to some flavour los in some mixes. 
The hot bath if the bath is too hot it might result in some nic degradation.

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## Jengz (4/10/17)

THanks for the responses, off to the shops to get some lemons, maybe it is vapers tongue, didn’t bring any shelf juice with me today, will taste some at home and if they are bland then Defs maybe the buds

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## Simon Kruger (11/10/17)

Awesome thread, quick question is there a guide that explains the different effects a given product provides, for instance, I want to create a Cherry Cola mix, so to me there are 3 parts to this: Cherry, Cola and something to simulate the carbonated sensation [fizz]. Yes a Google search brings up Koolada as an example for the fizz. But a search-able index of flavors vs effects would be great.

PS. the 3 part Cherry Cola is just an example it could be that simple or it could be complicated I know

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## RichJB (11/10/17)

Koolada doesn't provide fizz, only cooling. Nothing really provides fizz as effervescence is the interaction between liquid and gas bubbles and, well, there ain't any liquid in vapour. Gaseous bubbles leave a certain taste on your tongue - the taste of the gas used to make the drink fizzy. Cola concentrates attempt to emulate that taste and get close to it. But effervescence is primarily a tactile sensation and secondarily a taste. Vaping provides only the taste so it's a case of "close but no FA Cuban Supreme".

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## Simon Kruger (11/10/17)

Well you see, my Google-Fu let me down, if i had decided to create that concoction I would have ended up with a Cherry Cola Menthol / Minty flavor? Bleh...

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## RichJB (11/10/17)

Not even menthol/mint, Koolada is ostensibly flavourless. Although some report a cardboard taste from it. So maybe a cherry cola in a soggy box.

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## RenaldoRheeder (11/10/17)

RichJB said:


> Koolada doesn't provide fizz, only cooling. Nothing really provides fizz as effervescence is the interaction between liquid and gas bubbles and, well, there ain't any liquid in vapour. Gaseous bubbles leave a certain taste on your tongue - the taste of the gas used to make the drink fizzy. Cola concentrates attempt to emulate that taste and get close to it. But effervescence is primarily a tactile sensation and secondarily a taste. Vaping provides only the taste so it's a case of "close but no FA Cuban Supreme".



@RichJB - I recently tasted a commercial lemonade, and I could have sworn that I tasted a hint of ginger which added a "fizz". Maybe i was imagining it. 


Sent by iDad's iPhone

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## RichJB (11/10/17)

Various flavours are reputed to add fizz, Dazcole said he thinks FA Oba Oba in his Timebomb recipe added an effect "like marshmallow but with some sparkle or fizz". I am skeptical, though. As Wayne says, "You have to use your imagination a lot in vaping."

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