# Nicotine Craving or Psychological Habit



## johan (25/9/14)

After quitting the stinkies I hardly ever put my PV down long enough to tell if it's a nic craving or just a psychological habit . I don't leave home without it and carry extra batteries and e-juice too, just in case. After vaping for 7+ months, I find myself without vaping for hours when occupied with something else. Any other members apart from the vapist's experience this?

Reactions: Like 3 | Agree 5


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## Riddle (25/9/14)

This is definitely the case with me as well. When busy it barely bothers me and I go on with what ever I'm busy with. Only when I'm done do I pull my PV out and start vaping away. Always have a backup device and even a charger on me


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## johan (25/9/14)

Same here @Riddle - maybe I should experiment with 0-nic ejuice and see if it is indeed a psychological thing or not.


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## Riddle (25/9/14)

@johan I must say one morning I left in a rush and only juice I had in my car was a 0mg I vaped on that till about 2pm in the afternoon when I went past my house to pick up my other juices. I didn't really suffer much that morning. 

I think yeah maybe we should try 0mg for a day. Only thing that might play mind tricks with a person is the lack of throat hit with 0mg

Reactions: Agree 2


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## RATZ (25/9/14)

I believe a it is mainly psychological. 

Due to sudden financial difficulties, I have had to make the choice between China juice or drastically cut back. Going from an average of 5ml/day @ 12mg to 1ml over 2 days has actually been painless. Vaping is now something I do because I enjoy, not because I need to. I am still prone to chain vaping when sitting at the PC, but that is definitely a habit.

I started with the goal of getting rid of my addiction and can safely say I have won.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 1


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## johan (25/9/14)

Reading your post @RATZ, I wonder if I can go without nic altogether - maybe worth a try. PS: sorry to hear about your difficulties and all I can offer is this: "_a bad situation can't last forver_" - hope you get sorted very soon.

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## RATZ (25/9/14)

johan said:


> Reading your post @RATZ, I wonder if I can go without nic altogether - maybe worth a try. PS: sorry to hear about your difficulties and all I can offer is this: "_a bad situation can't last forver_" - hope you get sorted very soon.



Try the zero nic, you may be surprised. When I first started vaping I had a bottle of 0mg and could go a whole weekend on it -(if it was a mellow weekend).

^Thanks for the support. Thankfully I fall into the scarce skills category and start a new better job on Tuesday. Then all those upgrades I have plotting come. Maybe I should just save a month and try get one of those woodvilles due in December?

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## johan (25/9/14)

Yip @RATZ - save up for a woodville and prewarn Oupa at VM.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Riaz (25/9/14)

when i drive, i chain vape until i reach my destination

the other day i was driving home from work, sitting in traffic and decided to have a sweet (which i NEVER do LOL) and for the full duration of that sweet and even a few moments after i didnt feel like vaping.

i deduced from that, that its more the motion of vaping than the actual nicotine craving that gets me going.

at work, if my devices are in my draw and out of sight i can go hours without a vape - TRUE STORY

i wouldnt go 0mg juice though, coz when i do feel for that vape, i want it to hit lekker hard

Reactions: Like 2


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## johan (25/9/14)

Can relate to that @Riaz, but when I'm in a tight spot I tend to grab whatever is closest, Reo or coffee pot or dop  - and when I grab the last one too much, the wife hits lekker hard .

Reactions: Like 1 | Funny 6


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## Riddle (25/9/14)

Lol REO and coffee sounds like the safer option @johan ... stick to the first two haha

Reactions: Funny 1


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## johan (25/9/14)

Riddle said:


> Lol REO and coffee sounds like the safer option @johan ... stick to the first two haha



Problem is certain drastic tight situations require a really "stywe dop" and no Reo or coffee will calm that down .

Reactions: Agree 1 | Funny 1


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## TylerD (25/9/14)

This is exactly why I went down to 6mg. And to tell you the truth, it's going very well. 6mg works for me!
I will have a look a bit later on going down to 0mg, but I still enjoy the bit of TH I get from lung hits on 6mg.

Reactions: Like 1


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## TylerD (25/9/14)

I must add that the Reo makes the transition much easier!

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 2


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## Riddle (25/9/14)

When I got into rebuilbables I also dropped down on my nicotine by like half. That's what makes me agree and say it's psychological

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## johan (25/9/14)

TylerD said:


> This is exactly why I went down to 6mg. And to tell you the truth, it's going very well. 6mg works for me!
> I will have a look a bit later on going down to 0mg, but I still enjoy the bit of TH I get from lung hits on 6mg.



I didn't notice a decline in TH when I went down from 24 to 18 or from 18 to 12 - maybe I'm to thick in the throat to notice  - next up for me is 6mg. Think of it, there must be something else than nic to give that thump, maybe one of the juice mixologists like @Oupa, @Derick or @Mauritz etc. can enlighten us?

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Derick (25/9/14)

Mostly it is the nic content that gives a TH(some flavours do as well), but it is also something that is not the same with all people. Melinda will feel even the smallest change in TH, whereas I will only notice a large jump (like from 6 to 24).

PG can also affect throat hit, but once again it differs from person to person.

Best is to experiment and find out what works for you

Reactions: Like 1 | Thanks 1 | Informative 1


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## Danny (25/9/14)

A month or so into vaping I decided to test just this. Not the most scientific but what I did was bought 3 bottles of juice, one in my normal concentration at the time it was 18, one in half that concentration and then one in zero. I had my hubby receive the parcel, remove all the labels and everything then he gave me one bottle to use a day for seven days. Obviously changing the bottles everyday, the result being I would get a different concentration everyday, not know what I had and have no way to easily get higher nic if I was craving for example.

At the end of it all my results were interesting. On each day I vaped pretty much the exact same amount of juice, irrelevant of what concentration of nic was present and didnt have cravings etc. I in absolutely no way knew which Juice I was getting. In fact it worked so well that on my highest consumption day (there was drinking involved, so it skewed the results a little) I was absolutely convinced I had the 0, it just wasnt working for me only to find out at the end that it was actually the 18!!!

Its not a conclusive study at all. It could be my subconscious inducing bias in the result because I wanted vaping to be that much better than smoking and not hold such power over me! But all in all it has convinced me that the behaviour, routine and habits are much more of the addiction than the nic is.

Reactions: Like 2 | Informative 2


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## johan (25/9/14)

Thanks @Derick - I dilute certain overpowering (flavor wise) e-juice with 0-nic vg and in essence I can experiment with 0-nic PG if TH seems lacking?


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## Derick (25/9/14)

johan said:


> Thanks @Derick - I dilute certain overpowering (flavor wise) e-juice with 0-nic vg and in essence I can experiment with 0-nic PG if TH seems lacking?



Yep, more PG will give more TH (to most people) Some volatile flavours (flavours that are really strong smelling a evaporate quickly ) will also add to the throat hit. Seeing as PG carries more flavour, I am unsure if it is the actual PG that adds to the throat hit, or just the fact that you are getting more flavour with each puff - or perhaps it is a combination of both.

Just note that PG rich mixes will tend to irritate the mouth and throat with some people, even if you do not have a PG sensitivity. For me, this irritation (burning sensation in mouth and throat) will disappear after a few days if vaping high PG mixes, for other people it persists. (Liqua for example, which is a high PG mix does this to me)

Steeping in general can also reduce TH (probably as the flavouring evaporates), so it is a bit of a trade-off - better, smoother flavour, or stronger TH. 

I have also read that some tobacco flavours can give a good TH, but I'm not a fan of those, so I can't really comment.

Reactions: Thanks 1


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## johan (25/9/14)

Thanks @Derick very informative - I think I had a good idea, but a k@k plan with the PG .


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## Mauritz (27/9/14)

johan said:


> I didn't notice a decline in TH when I went down from 24 to 18 or from 18 to 12 - maybe I'm to thick in the throat to notice  - next up for me is 6mg. Think of it, there must be something else than nic to give that thump, maybe one of the juice mixologists like @Oupa, @Derick or @Mauritz etc. can enlighten us?



I think Derick has pretty much summarised this. The throat is percieved from either chemical or heat stimulus. 

Most effective way of increasing TH in low nic juice is by blending menthol, even small amounts. 

The tobacco's that give good throat hit contain ethyl alcohol. A dash of vodka can also hugely help throat hit in DIY mixes.

Regards,

Reactions: Informative 2


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## johan (27/9/14)

Mauritz said:


> I think Derick has pretty much summarised this. The throat is percieved from either chemical or heat stimulus.
> 
> Most effective way of increasing TH in low nic juice is by blending menthol, even small amounts.
> 
> ...



Thanks for the info Mauritz - now I can put some Matterhorn Menthol in low nic e-juice and proper Mampoer in my low nic tobacco e-juice with authority.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Silver (27/9/14)

Hi @johan

Great thread. 

Personally, I think we are still addicted to the nicotine, but _less _addicted than we were when we smoked 

After vaping for a few months, I can go for much longer without vaping than I ever could without smoking. When I now go to a shopping centre, I can easily spend 3 hours walking around, forgetting to vape - without any craving for nicotine. That would never ever have happened when I smoked. Never. I would go into the car park every 40 minutes for a smoke. 

I think it has to do with the nicotine absorption from smoke being more effective than with vapour, so you get a more intense nicotine hit and much quicker. Now with vaping, we are effectively "weaning" ourselves off the nicotine high. And I stand to be corrected, but I think it's not the nicotine itself that our bodies crave, but the high the nicotine produces in our brain when we have it. The higher the high, the more we crave it and the more addicted we become. 

As for throat hit on various juices, some juices definitely produce more throat hit than others with the same nic content. Take @Mauritz's Melon on the Rocks 18mg as an example. That juice kicks like a mule. Yet say @Oupa's VM Strawberry 18mg is much smoother - in the same device. 

Another thing - when Vape King first brought in Five Pawns, to my dismay, they were only available in 12mg. I was quite surprised that their throat hit was satisfying even at 12mg. To me, their 12mg has more throat hit than other 12mg juices. @RevnLucky7 also mentioned at the time that Five Pawns "manufactures" their throat hit. I can believe it - from something they perhaps add to the juice. Not sure how they do it - but I can firmly say that it is true. 

Fascinating stuff...

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## johan (27/9/14)

Thanks @Silver, I might get stoned for writing this following personal thought; I think after 7+ months without stinkies, obviously with the assistance of vaping and this awesome forum, I am know closer to quit nicotine altogether. I am not there yet, but I would like to quit the nicotine in full, followed by vaping at some stage as well. I believe in setting achievable goals, but haven't contemplating the latter yet and its due to happen sometime in future.

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## Alex (27/9/14)

johan said:


> Thanks @Silver, I might get stoned for writing this following personal thought; I think after 7+ months without stinkies, obviously with the assistance of vaping and this awesome forum, I am know closer to quit nicotine altogether. I am not there yet, but I would like to quit the nicotine in full, followed by vaping at some stage as well. I believe in setting achievable goals, but haven't contemplating the latter yet and its due to happen sometime in future.



I have more or less the same goal in mind, not that I mind the nicotine at all. But I am beginning to hate that nic rush more and more now, which is something that happens all to frequently with me late at night. I blame it on the awesome juice flavours which keep me vaping more than I should. And subsequently lead to that nic rush. Lately I've been much more focused on flavours and far less on any TH.

An interesting point to note is that there are zero peer reviewed published scientific articles that can prove that nicotine is addictive in the absence of tobacco. Which I read about recently.

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## Silver (27/9/14)

johan said:


> Thanks @Silver, I might get stoned for writing this following personal thought; I think after 7+ months without stinkies, obviously with the assistance of vaping and this awesome forum, I am know closer to quit nicotine altogether. I am not there yet, but I would like to quit the nicotine in full, followed by vaping at some stage as well. I believe in setting achievable goals, but haven't contemplating the latter yet and its due to happen sometime in future.



@johan, lets face it, most of us started vaping as a means to stop smoking.
And most of us probably thought we would vape for a while and then quit vaping altogether.

I never in my wildest dreams thought vaping would be this much fun. Gadget wise and flavour wise...
And of course, this forum and all the great people.

So for now, I am continuing and enjoying it thoroughly. 

But I totally respect your desire to quit in full. And anyone else's for that matter. I won't be stoning you at all.
I just hope that if you manage to do that - you will still pop in at the vape meets to say hello and drink a whiskey or two

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## Silver (27/9/14)

Alex said:


> I have more or less the same goal in mind, not that I mind the nicotine at all. But I am beginning to hate that nic rush more and more now, which is something that happens all to frequently with me late at night. I blame it on the awesome juice flavours which keep me vaping more than I should. And subsequently lead to that nic rush. Lately I've been much more focused on flavours and far less on any TH.
> 
> An interesting point to note is that there are zero peer reviewed published scientific articles that can prove that nicotine is addictive in the absence of tobacco. Which I read about recently.



@Alex, I hear you on the nic rush issue

I think it's a good idea to have a strong setup for when you need a big nic hit and then two milder setups more for enjoying the flavour and for mindless vaping.... what do you think?

Reactions: Agree 1


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## johan (27/9/14)

Very interesting @Alex, I am for sure still addicted to nicotine (apart from other things) and that after 7+ months , but must add not so critical as before - it might just be "bullshit-baffled-brains" in my personal instance.


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## Alex (27/9/14)

Silver said:


> @Alex, I hear you on the nic rush issue
> 
> I think it's a good idea to have a strong setup for when you need a big nic hit and then two milder setups more for enjoying the flavour and for mindless vaping.... what do you think?



Absolutely, having a zero nic juice that tastes great would be a winner for me. Calling @VapeGrrl


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## johan (27/9/14)

Silver said:


> @johan, lets face it, most of us started vaping as a means to stop smoking.
> And most of us probably thought we would vape for a while and then quit vaping altogether.
> 
> I never in my wildest dreams thought vaping would be this much fun. Gadget wise and flavour wise...
> ...



Thanks @Silver, well I don't drink whiskey but liters of beer and w


Silver said:


> @johan, lets face it, most of us started vaping as a means to stop smoking.
> And most of us probably thought we would vape for a while and then quit vaping altogether.
> 
> I never in my wildest dreams thought vaping would be this much fun. Gadget wise and flavour wise...
> ...



For sure Silver, and I know you won't, but some people are really very religious about vaping

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## Alex (27/9/14)

johan said:


> Very interesting @Alex, I am for sure still addicted to nicotine (apart from other things) and that after 7+ months , but must add not so critical as before - it might just be "bullshit-baffled-brains" in my personal instance.



Could be true.

You should check out this site, and have a look through the NICOTINE section

Reactions: Thanks 1


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## johan (27/9/14)

I agree on the nicotine, its not harmful in moderation, exactly like coffee or alcohol and in moderation actually very good for the average person, what bugs me personally is more the "dependancy" on the habit.


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## VapeGrrl (27/9/14)

nudge nudge wink wink @Alex


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## n0ugh7_zw (28/9/14)

I've weened myself down to 3-4.5mg/ml so nicotine really isn't a big thing for me. It's more the process (psychological) of it. I can clear my head and take few hits, then get back to what I'm doing. I've noticed i can go for quite a while without a vape when i'm busy, and when i'm not, i vape quite a lot.

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