# Need some advice on twisted wire & builds



## TheLongTwitch (7/11/15)

Hey guys!!!

So I have a few drippers now and I am interested in trying something a little different.
i.e. Trying out some different builds/coils etc.

My standard builds thus far are 24g Kanthal, 2.5 ID, 6 wraps, which normally comes out to 0.28Ohms
On the Fishbone this is pretty perfect for me and is so amazing!
However the same build doesn't seem to really shine in the velocity mini or Mutation X v4.
(Which I currently want to rebuild)

So while chatting with @Oliver Barry his suggestion was to to take 3 strands of 29 and twist them, adding the twisted wire with a strand of 26 or 24 for a parallel and then having dual parallel.
It came out great....but @ 0.14Ohms which I don't have the power/mod to fire 

So in the past 24 hours I've made a few variations of different twisted wires, but don't know how I'm supposed to make sense of what wire to twist and how many wraps with all this experimental in order to get 0.28 Ohms 

I have 29, 26 and 24 Kanthal to currently work with : does anyone have any suggestions to help? 

Also I have been documenting/taking pictures of each twisted wire and the builds if anyone wants me to post them?


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## shaunnadan (7/11/15)

I have a dual twisted 24g build in my deadmods. Let me go hunt for the dripper and il let you know what the build is exactly


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## brad511 (7/11/15)

Hey Bud, depending on the mod and batteries you're using. I find twisted 26ga with only two wires twisted together at an ID of 2mm and 6 wraps single Coil works best in the mutation.

If you can fit the coil and you're not stressing your mod or batteries out, try up to 8 or 9 wraps on a big ID like 3mm, I'll build one or two dual twisted builds and give you an idea of how to get to 0.28 

What's the lowest ohm rating on your mod currently?

Reactions: Like 1


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## TheLongTwitch (7/11/15)

Thanx @shaunnadan sounds like it's going to be LOOOOOW though 

@brad511 my mod can go down to 0.1 Ohm but it's only an 80w mod and obviously I don't have the kind of power to really make use of .1
(Cloupor GT)

Hence why I'm after .28 or so for best battery life and performance.
According to my calculation I may actually succeed with 2 strands of 29 wrapped, then doubled over and wrapped again.
(Kinda making the equivalent of 4 strands)
5 wraps per coil should get me in the .25 range....I think


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## shaunnadan (7/11/15)

0.2 build . 

24g twisted 

7 wraps a side around a 3mm I'd 

Shines at 80w but can take a beating all the way to 120w easily. 








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## shaunnadan (7/11/15)

TheLongTwitch said:


> Thanx @shaunnadan sounds like it's going to be LOOOOOW though
> 
> @brad511 my mod can go down to 0.1 Ohm but it's only an 80w mod and obviously I don't have the kind of power to really make use of .1
> (Cloupor GT)
> ...



So not a huge fan of the doubling over idea. Even with lots of power to play with. The 4strands don't always behave nicely and getting them to glow evenly is a problem. Also they tend to have a lot of hot spots , this with the fact you need max power to pulse them and a hotspot can turn you fancy looking braided coil into a melted mess. 




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## Eequinox (7/11/15)

shaunnadan said:


> I have a dual twisted 24g build in my deadmods. Let me go hunt for the dripper and il let you know what the build is exactly



i have been playing around with dual twisted 26g kanthal pretty surprised how my vaping has changed for the better


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## TheLongTwitch (7/11/15)

Been out for the day with the lady, so sorry for the silence in my thread 

I quickly made a 2strand 29g twisted, then doubled it over and twisted again.
My prediction was not far off, as I managed to get to 0.3 in my Velocity mini.
(This was before I went out this morning)
The 4 strands took +- 1 min to manipulate into place, but it's so damn springy that as soon as I was pulsing for hot spots it changed into a spaced coil and wont compact again...but otherwise good!
Though....I swear there is more of a metallic/earthy taste to these coils  

Forewarning: Will be posting a bunch of pictures of my wires etc just now.


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## Chris du Toit (7/11/15)

TheLongTwitch said:


> Been out for the day with the lady, so sorry for the silence in my thread
> 
> I quickly made a 2strand 29g twisted, then doubled it over and twisted again.
> My prediction was not far off, as I managed to get to 0.3 in my Velocity mini.
> ...


Take a blowtorch to the wires before wrapping, makes life much easier

Reactions: Agree 1


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## n0ugh7_zw (7/11/15)

TheLongTwitch said:


> Hey guys!!!
> 
> So I have a few drippers now and I am interested in trying something a little different.
> i.e. Trying out some different builds/coils etc.
> ...



with your standard build, what sort of wattage are you running it at?

I ask, because my standard build is kinda similar. Except with a 3.5mm ID I find that it works really pretty well in most drippers, you just need to up the wattage on the more airy ones. I find my fishbone is happy at about 60-65W, but for the Sapor its more like 72.5W and the velocity is more like 80-85W. 

I've done quite a bit of testing with claptons and twisted wires. What I've found is that for the most part you can achieve the same vape with plain wire, by just upping the wattage (Providing your wicking can handle it, hence the big ID)


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## TheLongTwitch (7/11/15)

Busy getting the photo's all together at the moment 
...there is some serious wire/coil porn coming 

Still need to purchase a blowtorch @Chris du Toit ...without someone running in fear 
Was quite a pyromaniac in my younger days  But I've cleaned up since! Haha

@n0ugh7_zw I was actually thinking of asking you a few questions some weeks back with regards to the Fishbone as I can't think of anyone else that has shared the love we have for this RDA.
....but knowing me it may be more of an interrogation with my level of neediness in regards to specifics and details! 
My standard 2.5 ID @ 0.25-0.28 Ohms I fire between 44.4 (OCD) and 50w, depending on the juice.
Does the 3.5 ID seriously make that much of a difference?
And as previously stated I only have 80w of power, so I avoid anything 60+ purely for battery life.
Though I am in the market for a new device with more power, purely for low Ohm RDA builds;
But is it really necessary?

I am 150% satisfied with the Fishbone between .25-.28 Ohms @ 44.4-50w
My problem is purely that other tanks and RDA's don't seem to even come close to satisfaction, when I compare them to the Fishbone!!!

So either the builds are wrong...or my sweet spot and perfect setup is the Fishbone 
Hence why I am trying to experiment a little and/or build better.
Though; Waiting on December to get me a new and stronger device, enabling me to experiment even further with power, Ohms and builds etc.

P.S. Anyone check out the new Fishbone(Plus)? ....and any thoughts?
Glass inner chamber for flavor, Glass outer chamber for air ceramic juice well and velocity build posts


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## n0ugh7_zw (7/11/15)

TheLongTwitch said:


> Busy getting the photo's all together at the moment
> ...there is some serious wire/coil porn coming
> 
> Still need to purchase a blowtorch @Chris du Toit ...without someone running in fear
> ...



Ok, well  here it goes.

3.5mm does make a pretty significant different IMHO, you have a lot more surface area, so more vaporisation can take place. Also I've found that with larger ID you tend to have much better wicking at higher wattages.

The Cloupor GT is a regulated series dual 18650 box, Step down is way efficient, so erm, I wouldn't worry too much about living at 60-65W it shouldn't hurt your battery life too much.

If you're in the market for something like that. You should really take a look at the Wismec Reuleaux (Rolo) it's looking like it'll be the best DNA200 device for a while, and frankly with the amount of control the DNA200 gives you, its the kinda mod that should last a normal person like really long time.

If you like what the fishbones giving you, you should try out a Sapor.
Flavour is slightly better than the fishbone, it has more air, top airflow, so no leaking, really easy build deck, with space for wicking 

Sapor is my daily driver, I've used it almost everyday since I got it... Like 3 or more months ago.

Fishbone plus looks interesting. not too keen on the ceramic cup for some reason.

Edit: looking at numbers on steam engine...

Looking at the heatflux specs for your typical build at 44.4W you're sitting at a heatflux of 175mw per cubic mm. my standard build at 65.5W (my names greg, i may have OCD) is a bit higher at 219mw per cubic mm.

What I've found is that slowly I'm chasing a hotter and hotter vape, incrementally they're pretty small jumps. like now, i'm sitting with my standard build at 72.5W (mmmm... if my mod could gimme 72.25W I'd be on that s***) which is 243mw per cubic mm

What those numbers don't show, is that the airflow on a fishbone is way tighter than a Sapor.

So I think it might be right on the money, to just up the power on your standard build when you're using other atties.

I mean on my velocity I'm at 309mw per cubic mm


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## TheLongTwitch (16/11/15)

So I know this thread is OOOOLD now, but I did promise some visuals and still feel the need to, since I actually did take lots of pictures.
Though embarrassingly, it has been about 2 weeks since and I don't remember the exact specifics of everything I did but I'ma try 

It started with a cordless drill, plank of brandering, a screw and an Alan-key...
2 strands of 26g Kanthal twisted rudimentary done  


Just kept spinning the drill till 1 end of the wire snapped off, giving a great twisted.



As @Oliver Barry Suggested, I parallel wrapped the twisted with a single strand of 24g.



Both parallels wrapped and ready...



Getting them seated wasn't an easy task 



Checking and fixing hot spots



Both coils seated and primed



...wicked



and puffing away



Though...I missed my mark of 2.5-2.8 Ohms just a little 



Decided to try a TRIPLE twisted (24 + 26 + 29 gauge) ....and she was PRETTY! 


...Very pretty!



Then ANOTHER twisted (24 + 2 strands of 29)



But then decided to Frankenstein 2 of my twisted wires into a SERIOUSLY TWISTED coil (With no intention of really using/keeping)



She really did glow...



Finally decided on 2 strands of 29g wrapped, doubled over and wrapped again  (In essence 4x 29g twisted)



Seated and primed/dry burned with hot spots taken care of:



And finally dressed up, rearing to go...





Vaped on her for a full 2 days trying to get better performance....but sadly I couldn't shake a very "earthy" taste and ended up scrapping them.
Final product was +- .34 Ohms if I remember correctly.

Will do some more Frankenstein work over December and post again 
Hope this post is as entertaining as the experience was for me

Reactions: Like 2


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## TheLongTwitch (16/11/15)

Also, for interests sake; All builds (Except the very last one) came in between .12 and .16 Ohms 
Which is a bit too much for my mod 

@ .12 my mod's Ohm reading was constantly flashing during firing!
(This is a built in feature to tell you that the power setting is not "fit" for the resistance)
Poor little 80w Cloupor GT 

....She still did fire and gave it her all

Reactions: Like 1


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## Angilo (16/11/15)

i haven't used a Twisted coil in really long time, except for the last Helix i made

i personally find that it ruins the flavor, even with he Helix

i found that Chain Coils work better (you Twist 2 wires, then Twist
then together in opposite direction), their Ohm's are pretty high
yet their ramp-up is very low

i'm busy experimenting with small Ribbon wire coils, using a
2 Ply Fused with 38ga, all NiCr80, Dual 5 wrap around 2.5mm
at 0.28Ω, they're small, stupid good flavor and vapor production


i'll release a small vid soon showing Specs, Photo's and Clouds

Flavor Builds that really work are usually builds that Fused at least 2
things, like Fused Clapton's, Aliens, Staples and Multi-Strands

anything else is just practice lol, to get to the real builds


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