# This is a good place to start?



## Jonas Napo (30/5/17)

Hi guys, I've looked around the forum and still cannot decide on my first device. This is what I have found https://www.phantomvape.co.za/collections/starter-kits/products/wismec-predator-228 . I really like this one because it can be used as a power bank also. Can somebody please give me some insight I feel lost.


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## Huffapuff (30/5/17)

I wouldn't worry about the power bank side of things. You're going to want all the battery power for vaping.

Reactions: Agree 9


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## aktorsyl (30/5/17)

While I have a Predator myself and very happy with it, I would actually caution against buying one. They are known for their 510 connectors popping out, unfortunately. Having said that, I've never had issues on mine - but then again, I don't put RDA's on it.

But Wismec themselves have admitted to screwing up the 510, so I'd be careful of spending money on one now.

Reactions: Informative 1


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## Christos (30/5/17)

Jonas Napo said:


> Hi guys, I've looked around the forum and still cannot decide on my first device. This is what I have found https://www.phantomvape.co.za/collections/starter-kits/products/wismec-predator-228 . I really like this one because it can be used as a power bank also. Can somebody please give me some insight I feel lost.


Perhaps some more info. 
What is your planned budget?
Do you like a restricted draw like a cigarette or perhaps a direct lung inhale.
Are you after flavour or clouds? 
Are you comfortable building your own coils etc.
Try budget for some decent batteries as spares and a decent external charger.

Reactions: Like 2 | Agree 2


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## Jonas Napo (30/5/17)

What would you guys suggest as a start? Also has anybody bought from Phantom Vape https://www.phantomvape.co.za/ . I found them on my way home on a vehicle in traffic and their prices seem pretty good.


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## Jonas Napo (30/5/17)

Christos said:


> Perhaps some more info.
> What is your planned budget?
> Do you like a restricted draw like a cigarette or perhaps a direct lung inhale.
> Are you after flavour or clouds?
> ...


Budget is around R3000. I don't think I will be into making coils and stuff. Just more into clouds and flavour.


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## Christos (30/5/17)

Jonas Napo said:


> Budget is around R3000. I don't think I will be into making coils and stuff. Just more into clouds and flavour.


I am a bit biased but the crown v3 seems like a great tank and a minikin boost is a decent mod. 
I have not used phantom vapes. So can't comment there. 

A pico with the melo tank is also a good starting combo.
I think the alien kits are also rated highly at about R1100. 
Consider that whatever mod you will be getting you will "want" a backup device in a month or 2.


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## TheV (30/5/17)

I recently picked up a Smok Alien to replace my starter mod.
I'm really happy with it.
I did replace the tank (Baby Beast) with the bigger version (Big Baby Beast) and later added an RDA.

I know quite a few people that picked up the Alien as one of their first kits and they all seem very happy with it.


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## RichJB (30/5/17)

Jonas Napo said:


> I don't think I will be into making coils and stuff.



That is a common approach among new vapers and I think it's very limiting. If I had to rely on stock coils and commercial juice, I suspect I'd have stopped vaping. It may seem like a hassle and a daunting proposition to learn about DIY. But almost everybody ends up making at least their own coils. For sure, try commercial stock coils when you're starting out and still learning how everything works. They're plug and play and allow you to worry about other things on the learning curve first. But I think you should leave yourself open to making your own coils. It's where almost everybody ends up - and usually sooner rather than later. So I'd buy my initial gear with an eye towards making my own coils. It's always a lot more effective to grow into gear than to grow out of it.

Reactions: Agree 4


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## Jonas Napo (30/5/17)

What I take from this is the Smok Alien Kit would be a good device to go with?

Reactions: Like 1


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## Jonas Napo (30/5/17)

RichJB said:


> That is a common approach among new vapers and I think it's very limiting. If I had to rely on stock coils and commercial juice, I suspect I'd have stopped vaping. It may seem like a hassle and a daunting proposition to learn about DIY. But almost everybody ends up making at least their own coils. For sure, try commercial stock coils when you're starting out and still learning how everything works. They're plug and play and allow you to worry about other things on the learning curve first. But I think you should leave yourself open to making your own coils. It's where almost everybody ends up - and usually sooner rather than later. So I'd buy my initial gear with an eye towards making my own coils. It's always a lot more effective to grow into gear than to grow out of it.


I guess I won't totally disregard DIY so yeah for now while I familiarise myself with vaping I will stick to store bought.


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## TheV (30/5/17)

Jonas Napo said:


> I guess I won't totally disregard DIY so yeah for now while I familiarise myself with vaping I will stick to store bought.


I bought my Smok Alien kit with the intention of just using prebuilt coils. I added a Peerless RDA to my setup a while back and I couldn't be happier.
I still love the Smok tank and prebuilt coils for mobility and lazy days and the RDA for when I want to play around and really get the most flavor out of what I'm vaping.

The only thing I don't like about the Alien is the fact that it has no button lock. You can only lock the entire device, not just the buttons and keep the fire bar active. I would have liked that feature as I've bumped the wattage up very high by accident more than once :|


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## BubiSparks (30/5/17)

I'd rather go with a vendor listed on our home page.... Your vendor has Sony VTC5's listed at R100 each - RED FLAG imo...

Reactions: Agree 2


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## aktorsyl (30/5/17)

With that budget, I'd actually suggest not getting anything super-premium, but rather go for variety (because you absolutely will want to start rebuilding once the bug bites.. and bite it will).

I'd suggest a decent VW/TC mod with something simple like an iJust S atty - but then also get an RTA and an RDA, and some wire&cotton for later. As far as "simple" goes, you can't really go wrong with the iJust S. It's convenient, the coils are cheap, and the atty itself is cheap. Flavour is on point for a commercial coil. Even when you're exclusively into RTA/RDA's, the iJust will become a solid backup device.

For example. I started with a Twisp, a year ago. Shortly after that I got another MTL all-in-one kit (the VAP3 V8). Then I thought I want to try subohm direct-lung, so I got the iJust. Over time, things kinda spiraled from there to the point where I have 2 MTL setups, an RTA, 2 RDA's, 3 mods.. and still the iJust as backup. And the ironic thing is, I never intended to get any of those. Do I regret it? Hell no.

Now don't get me wrong. No one's going to force you into getting craploads of gear if you really don't want it. Which is why I suggest getting a simple mod and an iJust or something, and keep your options open in case you do change your mind later. Get a feel for it, see how you like it, and then decide as time goes on.

Reactions: Like 3


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## Jonas Napo (30/5/17)

BubiSparks said:


> I'd rather go with a vendor listed on our home page.... Your vendor has Sony VTC5's listed at R100 each - RED FLAG imo...


Noted. I will contact them tomorrow to make sure they are legit.


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## Jonas Napo (30/5/17)

aktorsyl said:


> With that budget, I'd actually suggest not getting anything super-premium, but rather go for variety (because you absolutely will want to start rebuilding once the bug bites.. and bite it will).
> 
> I'd suggest a decent VW/TC mod with something simple like an iJust S atty - but then also get an RTA and an RDA, and some wire&cotton for later. As far as "simple" goes, you can't really go wrong with the iJust S. It's convenient, the coils are cheap, and the atty itself is cheap. Flavour is on point for a commercial coil. Even when you're exclusively into RTA/RDA's, the iJust will become a solid backup device.
> 
> ...


Thank you. That was pretty insightful. I was thinking about getting a smaller device that would be convenient at times and the ijustS seems to be the way to go. I guess I will go with the Smok Alien kit and the ijustS .

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Jonas Napo (31/5/17)

BubiSparks said:


> I'd rather go with a vendor listed on our home page.... Your vendor has Sony VTC5's listed at R100 each - RED FLAG imo...


This is the reply I have received from Phantom Vape this morning. I will go through with my purchase and let you know how it goes.


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## aktorsyl (31/5/17)

Jonas Napo said:


> This is the reply I have received from Phantom Vape this morning. I will go through with my purchase and let you know how it goes.


Wait wait wait. R100 for a VTC5? Something isn't right here. They would literally be the only shop to sell it for approx. half the price of the other shops.

Remember, it's not just the possibility that the battery won't work as expected. It can also be very dangerous. I'm not saying they ARE fake/reject/rewrap batteries. I'm just saying I wouldn't take a chance on batteries.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Jonas Napo (31/5/17)

aktorsyl said:


> Wait wait wait. R100 for a VTC5? Something isn't right here. They would literally be the only shop to sell it for approx. half the price of the other shops.
> 
> Remember, it's not just the possibility that the battery won't work as expected. It can also be very dangerous. I'm not saying they ARE fake/reject/rewrap batteries. I'm just saying I wouldn't take a chance on batteries.


Let's say they are original what would I look for? And what if others are just pricing there's high?


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## RichJB (31/5/17)

It would be highly unusual for every vendor to price every battery high by around the same amount. Almost all vendors charge R160-R200 for the Sony, Samsung and LG 18650s which are popular in vaping. If it was R150, you could maybe believe it was a special. But R100 sounds way too low. There are also other vendors (i.e. not vaping) who sell 18650s and their prices are quite similar. You can get a bit cheaper but only if you buy in bulk.

Unfortunately there is no easy way to tell if a battery is fake. Even at R180, a battery can be fake. So you pays yer money and you takes yer chances. Let's just say that your chances are better when you pay R180-R200 for a battery than when you pay R100. Although, as I say, there are no guarantees that the more expensive ones are genuine, nor even that the cheaper ones are fake. But I'd at least want to hear an explanation from the vendor as to why he can retail batteries so cheaply.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Jonas Napo (31/5/17)

RichJB said:


> It would be highly unusual for every vendor to price every battery high by around the same amount. Almost all vendors charge R160-R200 for the Sony, Samsung and LG 18650s which are popular in vaping. If it was R150, you could maybe believe it was a special. But R100 sounds way too low. There are also other vendors (i.e. not vaping) who sell 18650s and their prices are quite similar. You can get a bit cheaper but only if you buy in bulk.
> 
> Unfortunately there is no easy way to tell if a battery is fake. Even at R180, a battery can be fake. So you pays yer money and you takes yer chances. Let's just say that your chances are better when you pay R180-R200 for a battery than when you pay R100. Although, as I say, there are no guarantees that the more expensive ones are genuine, nor even that the cheaper ones are fake. But I'd at least want to hear an explanation from the vendor as to why he can retail batteries so cheaply.


Could you possibly drop them a mail? Seeing as you probably know more about this than i do and let me know the outcome.


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## spiv (31/5/17)

Jonas Napo said:


> Could you possibly drop them a mail? Seeing as you probably know more about this than i do and let me know the outcome.



I would suggest going into a vape store and getting some advice. What part of Joburg are you in? Perhaps we can direct you to a good store nearby?


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## Strontium (31/5/17)

R3k budget?
It's a no brainer, Therion 75, 133 or 166, Big baby beast, 2x batteries and you'll have change for some coils juice.
Not to mention it looks sexy AF.

Reactions: Winner 1


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## Jonas Napo (31/5/17)

I have placed an order for a Smok Alien Kit and 2 batteries. Now just have to wait and see i guess.


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## spiv (31/5/17)

Jonas Napo said:


> I have placed an order for a Smok Alien Kit and 2 batteries. Now just have to wait and see i guess.



That's a good place to start


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## RichJB (31/5/17)

Jonas Napo said:


> I have placed an order for a Smok Alien Kit and 2 batteries.



Will you be charging the batteries in the mod? I read a Reddit post on Alien charging and it wasn't very complimentary about Smok's system. Iirc Mooch was also skeptical about charging in the mod, and horrified that the Alien uses "floating charging", whatever that is. I'm not sure if the Smok has bypass charging but, if not, will you simply not vape while the batteries are charging?

I'm a big fan of getting two setups to start with, along with an external charger. It means you have a backup if one setup fails, and also that you can vape one setup while charging the other. If buying a second setup is too much, I'd at least get a second set of batteries so that you can vape one set while charging the other. 

Buying two setups does cut your budget per setup in half. But having a really fancy mod and tank is no good if the mod's 510 or circuit board packs up, or you break a post or the PEEK insulator in the tank, or you drop your setup in the bath or have it stolen at a party, etc. That's the shortest and surest way to get back on the cigarettes. Even if it meant buying two Picos and two clone drippers, I'd rather have two rigs from the get-go.

That said, I don't think you'll go wrong with the Alien. Enjoy and welcome to the start of a long and wondrous journey!

Reactions: Thanks 1


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## Jonas Napo (31/5/17)

RichJB said:


> Will you be charging the batteries in the mod? I read a Reddit post on Alien charging and it wasn't very complimentary about Smok's system. Iirc Mooch was also skeptical about charging in the mod, and horrified that the Alien uses "floating charging", whatever that is. I'm not sure if the Smok has bypass charging but, if not, will you simply not vape while the batteries are charging?
> 
> I'm a big fan of getting two setups to start with, along with an external charger. It means you have a backup if one setup fails, and also that you can vape one setup while charging the other. If buying a second setup is too much, I'd at least get a second set of batteries so that you can vape one set while charging the other.
> 
> ...


I'm most probably going to get a second set of batteries and a charger for now. A second setup will come a little while later as i have seen a few i like.

Reactions: Like 1


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## BubiSparks (31/5/17)

@Jonas Napo - There have been reputable vendors that are members on this site that have been duped with fake batteries. They recalled them when they became aware of the issue. Phoenix Vapes may believe that his Sony's are genuine as it's so hard to tell, but at that price it's almost guaranteed that they are fake and as a vendor, the price he paid for them should have raised questions for him if he knows the industry - "There Ain't No Such Thing As A Free Lunch".

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 3


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## Jonas Napo (1/6/17)

BubiSparks said:


> @Jonas Napo - There have been reputable vendors that are members on this site that have been duped with fake batteries. They recalled them when they became aware of the issue. Phoenix Vapes may believe that his Sony's are genuine as it's so hard to tell, but at that price it's almost guaranteed that they are fake and as a vendor, the price he paid for them should have raised questions for him if he knows the industry - "There Ain't No Such Thing As A Free Lunch".


My order is waiting for me at home. Would you be able to tell me what are the main things i should look for?


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## RichJB (1/6/17)

Maybe try reading this article to start with. There is quite a lot of info on the net about fakes. Although even with that, it's often hard to tell a fake from an authentic.


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## MrDeedz (1/6/17)

SMOANT Battlestar. almost indestructible


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## aktorsyl (1/6/17)

RichJB said:


> Maybe try reading this article to start with. There is quite a lot of info on the net about fakes. Although even with that, it's often hard to tell a fake from an authentic.


Unfortunately that's true. It's often only noticed when you try to draw 18A from a battery that's "apparently" rated at 20A but is actually closer to 12A. Boom.


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## Mida Khan (1/6/17)

RichJB said:


> It would be highly unusual for every vendor to price every battery high by around the same amount. Almost all vendors charge R160-R200 for the Sony, Samsung and LG 18650s which are popular in vaping. If it was R150, you could maybe believe it was a special. But R100 sounds way too low. There are also other vendors (i.e. not vaping) who sell 18650s and their prices are quite similar. You can get a bit cheaper but only if you buy in bulk.
> 
> Unfortunately there is no easy way to tell if a battery is fake. Even at R180, a battery can be fake. So you pays yer money and you takes yer chances. Let's just say that your chances are better when you pay R180-R200 for a battery than when you pay R100. Although, as I say, there are no guarantees that the more expensive ones are genuine, nor even that the cheaper ones are fake. But I'd at least want to hear an explanation from the vendor as to why he can retail batteries so cheaply.




Totally agree!


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## Mida Khan (1/6/17)

with your budget I suggest getting 2 modz  one of which should be a tarot nano from vaporesso


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## Mida Khan (1/6/17)

http://vaping360.com/vaporesso-tarot-mini-kit/


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## Jonas Napo (1/6/17)

BubiSparks said:


> @Jonas Napo - There have been reputable vendors that are members on this site that have been duped with fake batteries. They recalled them when they became aware of the issue. Phoenix Vapes may believe that his Sony's are genuine as it's so hard to tell, but at that price it's almost guaranteed that they are fake and as a vendor, the price he paid for them should have raised questions for him if he knows the industry - "There Ain't No Such Thing As A Free Lunch".


These are the batteries I have received


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## BubiSparks (1/6/17)

Hey @Jonas Napo , I'm no expert telling genuine batteries from fakes. LG turd fakes had a glossy finish to the positive insulator/ washer while the genuine ones where matte and a little rough. Genuine 18650's weigh over 42g - weigh yours and if under 40g, that could indicate a fake.

All I can say is that I can't recall any Sony Li-Ion 18650 selling for under R200 on local vendor sites. Did you follow the link provided by @RichJB above?

There are only a few manufacturers of these cells and they resell units that don't pass their QC tests. These cells are generally still good, but not as good as the ones they put their name on. The cells are then rewrapped by third party companies (eg. EFEST) often with pretty wild specs. Then you also have Chinese companies that hide a smaller cell inside an 18650 casing and wrap the thing with any brand they want....

Useful link: https://www.ecigssa.co.za/bad-news-on-lg-hg2s.t22653/

Reactions: Like 1


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## Jonas Napo (1/6/17)

BubiSparks said:


> Hey @Jonas Napo , I'm no expert telling genuine batteries from fakes. LG turd fakes had a glossy finish to the positive insulator/ washer while the genuine ones where matte and a little rough. Genuine 18650's weigh over 42g - weigh yours and if under 40g, that could indicate a fake.
> 
> All I can say is that I can't recall any Sony Li-Ion 18650 selling for under R200 on local vendor sites. Did you follow the link provided by @RichJB above?
> 
> ...


Thank you that was very insightful. I weighed them and they come up at 44.5g and 44.7g.


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## Jonas Napo (5/6/17)

BubiSparks said:


> Hey @Jonas Napo , I'm no expert telling genuine batteries from fakes. LG turd fakes had a glossy finish to the positive insulator/ washer while the genuine ones where matte and a little rough. Genuine 18650's weigh over 42g - weigh yours and if under 40g, that could indicate a fake.
> 
> All I can say is that I can't recall any Sony Li-Ion 18650 selling for under R200 on local vendor sites. Did you follow the link provided by @RichJB above?
> 
> ...


Everything seems to be working well. Batteries last me atleast two days.

Reactions: Like 2


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