# This is REALLY REALLY REALLY!!!!!!!!!! Troublesome.



## Cor (22/2/18)

Hey all.

I build coilz some days at my local vapeshop for a bit of extra cash.And today something happend that really really made me loose it.

A lady came in age about 18 i think maybe 21.

She wanted a coil built she gave me the box and i saw its a vGod elite clone ok.I first asked if she knew what a mech mod was the reply 'no not at all' i then explained all the detailz to her like everything and built the coils as high as i could.

After they left i asked the vapeshop owner where i work to find out where this mod was purched.With some inspection we found out its like a 5rand shop.........owned by the same people who does not have a clue to make it worse the mod was a clone.

So these people are selling mech without eaven a bit of knowlage.With more investigative work i found out they sell clone juices and allot at that.

Is there any way to take legal action or stop these people from selling mech with no idea about what it is or how it works........they are going to do so so much damage to the vapeing world........

Ime disgusted, frustrated, and so so angry.

Please anyone that can help me i would apriciate it.

Best Regards 

Cor.

Reactions: Like 5 | Agree 1 | Winner 2


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## DoubleD (22/2/18)

Same thing here, we have a R5 store selling everything for next to nothing, fake juices like Jam Monster.. kinda fu@ked up

Reactions: Like 2


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## Carnival (22/2/18)

OH my gosh, that's absolutely terrible!! @Cor 

I seriously worry for others who, like the girl, are buying mechs from this place without a clue what to do (and what NOT to do!) with them! It actually gave me chills thinking about it. I do hope someone here is able to give you solid legal advice. I agree they will do huge damage to the vaping community! They need to be stopped.

Reactions: Like 3 | Agree 1


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## jm10 (22/2/18)

Its like shooting in the dark, i have tried contacting so many departments regarding so many fake goods, i even had a thing with Bidorbuy and sent them proof but they did nothing.

Its like everyone turns a blind eye to Chinese counterfeit shit. 

Ps: non of my complaints were vape related 




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## vicTor (22/2/18)

@Carnival agree there with you on the chills

it's only a matter of time that something bad happens, not good at all

Reactions: Like 3 | Agree 1


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## Cor (22/2/18)

My biggest concern are the mechs.They eaven sold her a fake batt

Reactions: Like 3


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## Faiyaz Cheulkar (22/2/18)

Few months back a shop in belville was raided for selling fake nike shoes. Don't know the law of south Africa but if it can be done for Nike products then it can be done for vape products too.

Reactions: Like 4


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## Mr. B (22/2/18)

The problem here is that this industry isn't regulated and there's no legislation for vaping like there are for cigarettes; tobacco products and alcohol products, etc.

Reactions: Like 4 | Agree 1


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## Faiyaz Cheulkar (22/2/18)

How can people be so stupid and buy a mech mod without knowing what it is.

Reactions: Like 2 | Agree 1


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## jm10 (22/2/18)

Faiyaz Cheulkar said:


> Few months back a shop in belville was raided for selling fake nike shoes. Don't know the law of south Africa but if it can be done for Nike products then it can be done for vape products too.



Do you notice they only catch shoes or cigarettes, Have you ever seen China Malls come up in the news or heard of raids at them. 


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## BATMAN (22/2/18)

Lets get together and beat them up

Reactions: Like 4 | Agree 2


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## Cor (22/2/18)

BATMAN said:


> Lets get together and beat them up


Ime in or get a cop and bribe them to raid the store?

Reactions: Like 3 | Agree 1


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## Faiyaz Cheulkar (22/2/18)

BATMAN said:


> Lets get together and beat them up



Let me find my cape, you get the bat-mobile ready

Reactions: Funny 4


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## BATMAN (22/2/18)

Cor said:


> Ime in or get a cop and bribe them to raid the store?


That could do,but what grounds would they get them for ?

Im not too clued up on the laws surrounding clone gear and juice.

Reactions: Like 2


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## Faiyaz Cheulkar (22/2/18)

BATMAN said:


> That could do,but what grounds would they get them for ?
> 
> Im not too clued up on the laws surrounding clone gear and juice.



Short circuit the mech on purpose (in a safe way) and sue them for damages may be.

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## jm10 (22/2/18)

BATMAN said:


> That could do,but what grounds would they get them for ?
> 
> Im not too clued up on the laws surrounding clone gear and juice.



Selling counterfeit goods they need to show documents/invoices to prove they are real. 


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## Jengz (22/2/18)

This peeves me off too! Hate the risk and infamous attention it can and will bring to the vaping community... 

The problem is without proof of them harming a person, these counterfeit goods are the same as the entire China mall.

The law struggles to restrict the trade of counterfeit goods as it struggles to deal with everything else in SA.

But I love my country

Reactions: Like 3


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## Anneries (22/2/18)

What scares me is that these shops will soon start selling counterfeit batteries for these mechs they sell. Then some noob will buy this mech and battery pair. Build what should be a safe build on authentic and become the next Andy and VAPING gets the bad rep again.

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## mavric69 (22/2/18)

as long as there is an industry that is booming (like vaping) or an industry that is well established (tobacco industry) there will be counterfeit, clone, knockoffs etc... even if the vaping industry gets proper regulated, there will still be clone devices and badly made cheap juice. As long as people are willing to buy a product for cheaper, even if its not original and as long as people are unwilling to research (for their own well being), clone devices will be sold...

Reactions: Like 2 | Agree 1


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## BumbleBee (22/2/18)

BATMAN said:


> Lets get together and beat them up


There are more of them than there are of us, and they're not particularly nice people either.

We see this crap all the time, not so much in my town but Polokwane is rife with this stuff, like 100ml Jam Monsters for R70, fake LG Chocs for R50 and the worst clone Pico kits I've ever seen. 

I think the only people that can take legal action are the original manufacturers or official importers, but it will cost a fortune and I can imagine it would be like klapping mosquitoes.

The best course of action right now is to educate users and explain the dangers of buying cheap, very often they will listen and were just completely unaware of the dangers.

@Cor, I feel your pain, this is so frustrating

Reactions: Like 6 | Thanks 1


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## Rob Fisher (22/2/18)

Interesting thread... the reason that cigarettes and clothing and shoes are targeted is because as an industry they pay and retain private investigators to track and prosecute intellectual property thieves.

The sooner the Vape Industry does the same the better... the big problem of course is that most of the real vape shops sell clones too. Yes selling fake mechs and fake juice is terrible but the only difference is selling fake mechs and batteries could be dangerous. Bottom line is people will pretty much do anything to make a buck whether it's unethical or not.

Reactions: Like 4 | Agree 2 | Thanks 1


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## Cor (22/2/18)

Thankx for evwryones input thus far.

Ile go and speak to the owner of the shop tommorw all smiles and just urge them to inform the people who buy the device of all the rules and safety that mechs carry.

Reactions: Like 5 | Winner 1


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## Hooked (22/2/18)

Faiyaz Cheulkar said:


> How can people be so stupid and buy a mech mod without knowing what it is.



It's more ignorance than stupidity. If you're a noobie and your friends don't vape, you would simply by anything based on price.

Reactions: Like 3 | Agree 1


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## Hooked (22/2/18)

Coincidentally, one of the builders saw me vaping yesterday and asked how much a mod costs and where to buy it, as we don't have any vape shops close by. His friend piped up and told him to go to the China shop. 

I'll probably see him again tomorrow and I'd like to warn him about mechs but I'm not sure what the danger is myself. Could someone give me a brief explanation, please?

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## jm10 (22/2/18)

Cor said:


> Thankx for evwryones input thus far.
> 
> Ile go and speak to the owner of the shop tommorw all smiles and just urge them to inform the people who buy the device of all the rules and safety that mechs carry.



I can see that going two ways

1: he gets angry and tells you to mind your own
2: he gets angry and swears at you to mind your own

People that sell counterfeit items as there main business are generally full of shit. They also make it seem like “they just trying to run a business....” and make it seem like you mean them personal harm.... the world these delusional people live in is something else. Dont get me started on these counterfeit/clone thats pawned of as original or whatever they wana call it cause i can go on for days

Be carful is my advice .


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## Cor (22/2/18)

jm10 said:


> I can see that going two ways
> 
> 1: he gets angry and tells you to mind your own
> 2: he gets angry and swears at you to mind your own
> ...


Ile be sure to take great care.

Reactions: Like 3


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## Scissorhands (22/2/18)

Cor said:


> My biggest concern are the mechs.They even sold her a fake batt



This^^ is ugly , he might as well give her this complimentary keychain too



Noob with a fake cell in a hybrid mech . . . This cant have a happy ending

Reactions: Like 3 | Agree 5


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## Halfdaft (22/2/18)

As someone who designs and produces mech mods, this is terrifying. What if that girl had slipped up and somehow created a hard short. I've seen my share of newbies with low to mid end mechs (like the coilart and the noisy v1) do serious harm to themselves and others because of this, people selling possibly dangerous vaping devices to people who REALLY don't know what they're doing, all just to make a quick buck. Its one of the greatest detriments to the industry and community.

Reactions: Like 5 | Agree 5


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## Raindance (22/2/18)

Hooked said:


> Coincidentally, one of the builders saw me vaping yesterday and asked how much a mod costs and where to buy it, as we don't have any vape shops close by. His friend piped up and told him to go to the China shop.
> 
> I'll probably see him again tomorrow and I'd like to warn him about mechs but I'm not sure what the danger is myself. Could someone give me a brief explanation, please?


A mechanical mod has no safety circuitry nor any form of power regulation. If you put on a coil with too little resistance or an atomizer that is not designed for use on a "hybrid" connection (Atomizer positive pin connects directly to battery positive) you can create a short circuit situation which can (read shall) cause the battery to overheat causing it to vent or even blow up.

These vaping cells contain a lot of energy and releasing it all at once is for all practical purposes an explosion. Even just not taking care how they are stored and transported can have bad consequences.

Selling this stuff to the uninformed without verifying their competence or informing them of the dangers is tantamount to gross recklessness.

Regards

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## Hooked (22/2/18)

Raindance said:


> A mechanical mod has no safety circuitry nor any form of power regulation. If you put on a coil with too little resistance or an atomizer that is not designed for use on a "hybrid" connection (Atomizer positive pin connects directly to battery positive) you can create a short circuit situation which can (read shall) cause the battery to overheat causing it to vent or even blow up.
> 
> These vaping cells contain a lot of energy and releasing it all at once is for all practical purposes an explosion. Even just not taking care how they are stored and transported can have bad consequences.
> 
> ...



Thanks @Raindance That was a clear explanation of the danger. I'll tell him when I see him.

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## Hooked (22/2/18)

Having read the excellent explanation of mech mods from @Raindance, I can just imagine the headlines, "Vaper blows himself up". We're on precarious ground re future legislation as it is!

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## Yas786 (23/2/18)

Raindance said:


> A mechanical mod has no safety circuitry nor any form of power regulation. If you put on a coil with too little resistance or an atomizer that is not designed for use on a "hybrid" connection (Atomizer positive pin connects directly to battery positive) you can create a short circuit situation which can (read shall) cause the battery to overheat causing it to vent or even blow up.
> 
> These vaping cells contain a lot of energy and releasing it all at once is for all practical purposes an explosion. Even just not taking care how they are stored and transported can have bad consequences.
> 
> ...


And that’s why I stay away from mech mods even though some of them are absolutely beautiful. 

Don’t get me wrong I know how to build at safe ohms etc and make sure I use batteries that are safe to use on mechs but honestly I prefer regulated because at least I know I’m protected much more than using a mech mod. 

It’s scary how clueless some people are and what make it worse is shops or so called pros selling to the unsuspecting public.

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## Hooked (23/2/18)

"Fake" is not dangerous; Mech is. 

I think this thread is dethreading by the focus that it's a fake mod. If we go back to @Cor's post which started this thread, he says, 
"Is there any way to take legal action or stop these people from selling mech *with no idea about what it is or how it works.*.......they are going to do so so much damage to the vapeing world........" [my emphasis].

"Fake" is not the issue in this case. The issue is the potential danger. I'm sure cheapy-shops don't know what they are selling, unless they're experienced vapers. They stock a mod, a customer (equally ignorant) wants a mod. Sale done.

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## Scissorhands (23/2/18)

Hooked said:


> "Fake" is not dangerous; Mech is.
> 
> I think this thread is dethreading by the focus that it's a fake mod. If we go back to @Cor's post which started this thread, he says,
> "Is there any way to take legal action or stop these people from selling mech *with no idea about what it is or how it works.*.......they are going to do so so much damage to the vapeing world........" [my emphasis].
> ...



Not to get into a clone vs auth war

I see your view and understand your thought process but no, mechs aren't dangerous, . . . They literally cant hurt you unless you hit yourself over the head

Cells/batteries are dangerous, the 12v in your car , the li-ion in your phone and of course the 18650 in your mod

They should be treated with respect, you can get unlucky but ignorance/negligence is the issue highlighted

Fake mods to a degree but specifically fake cells/batteries that are not at all suitable for vaping, regulated or mechanical

I worked in a hobby shop years ago, skip to 2:30, guy shorts a Li-po



Peace & love

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## Cor (23/2/18)

Ime a mech mod user myself (squonker)

But my whole issue is that these people give mechs to people who has no no no knowledge about bat safty, ohms law and so on so on.

The person will get home build what ever coil they want and then boom. And like @Scissorhands said the bat is the weakest link.

Or the user uses a hybrid tank on the mechmod and a deadshort happens again boom.

But ime waaiting for 8 and then i shall go and have a look see at this shop.

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## Cor (23/2/18)

Feed back time today a second person came for coil builds with yet another vgod mech purched from the same shop and no knowlage about mechs

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## vicTor (23/2/18)

Cor said:


> Feed back time today a second person came for coil builds with yet another vgod mech purched from the same shop and no knowlage about mechs



just refuse to build for them !

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## Cor (23/2/18)

vicTor said:


> just refuse to build for them !


That is the next step me and the vape shop owner agreed to i just hope when they build themselfs no one gets hurt

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## vicTor (23/2/18)

Cor said:


> That is the next step me and the vape shop owner agreed to i just hope when they build themselfs no one gets hurt



well that is the other side of the coin, maybe better you do "educate" them rather, not sure ?

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## Cor (23/2/18)

vicTor said:


> well that is the other side of the coin, maybe better you do "educate" them rather, not sure ?


Its a hard choice but the whole thing in sickning to me

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## Adephi (23/2/18)

At least most people buying from there doesnt know a thing about building coils. So they com to you. That at least gives you a chance to educate them.

But then again, as somebody that also works retail but in a different industry, people will always asume you are educating them in order to make a sale. So they tend to ignore your advice and carry on regardless.

This really needs to be stopped at the root. Regulating the sales might help but cigs are also regulated and look how the fake cig industry is booming. It really is a difficult situation.

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## RayDeny (24/2/18)

With out getting into the clone V Authentic debate as i feel that’s a whole different issue here.

It’s all about education, the end-user needs to educate themselves first as well as any vender who sells these products should take
A level of responsibility in the education.
This dose not mean the burden is fully on the vendor but there is definitely some there, they should have the knowledge and back bone not to sell cell’s that are incapable of running a mech when been sold with a mech or question the sale of the cell’s and what mod they will be used in.

This is more about battery safety then anything else. 90% of my mods are tube mechs and after a year of using them i still take time out of my vape oogling time to educate myself on batteries. These are the root of all our risk and need to be treated like that.

On the side of building coils for people on their mechs, you do know if something go’s wrong on that setup they will blame you directly? You will find for instance in the US, they are not allowed to build any mod for their customers for the same reason. If you are to build another atty it might be a good idea to draw up a quick sheet with as much battery and safety information you can and hand over a copy with every coil build. 

Come to think about it, i have not seen any battery warning or information at any of the vape shops I frequent. That might be a great place to start.

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## Cor (24/2/18)

RayDeny said:


> With out getting into the clone V Authentic debate as i feel that’s a whole different issue here.
> 
> It’s all about education, the end-user needs to educate themselves first as well as any vender who sells these products should take
> A level of responsibility in the education.
> ...


Myself and the vendor i help out decided to set up a test paper people have to wright if they want me to build on a mech for them.If they fail i wont build fir them we also working on a form they have to sighn saying myself and the vapeshop i help out are not liable for any venting bats or anything that goes wrong with the device.

The whole thing thts got me in a fear frenzy is that......the shop selling the devices dont know how they work or any bat safety and also no buyer has any idea what they really buying its a concoction for something really bad and its going to happen.

And then before any shops are to blame vapeing gets acused....while the whole time its human stupidity and greed thats at fault here.

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## Raindance (24/2/18)

I think AA batteries are to blame.

The average consumer, and shopkeeper/general merchant for that matter, has no clue that 18650's and the like are not just big Duracell batteries. They have little reason to suspect anything else as we all grew up with batteries and never had any reason to expect any danger from them.

For this reason, I believe that the vaping community and most importantly our vendors, should focus on battery safety awareness and even possibly start an active campaign in this regard. The displaying of battery safety posters, verifying consumer competence and education where required should be a standardized practice for all our retailers.

If we claim self regulation, these actions would show commitment to this intent. A competent government would possibly require licencing criteria to include compliance to such regulations were it to be sympathetic to the vaping scene. Unfortunately, just placing a blanket ban on the sale of all related products is just so much easier, especially if considered from a common perspective founded in ignorance. The latter approach of circumventing challenges rather than addressing their root causes is in fact standard practice for most governments, not just ours.

I do not know how well this would go down with the audience but I would propose our member vendors to get together and compile a code of conduct specific to forum member participating vendors. A code to be complied to as core criteria for being and remaining a participating vendor.

I am probably overplaying my hand here so I will leave it at that.

Regards

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## RayDeny (24/2/18)

Raindance said:


> I think AA batteries are to blame.
> 
> The average consumer, and shopkeeper/general merchant for that matter, has no clue that 18650's and the like are not just big Duracell batteries. They have little reason to suspect anything else as we all grew up with batteries and never had any reason to expect any danger from them.
> 
> ...



I agree fully with what you have said here, a campaign driven by the active venders on this forum and key people would definitely bring more awareness to the industry. This would show that we as the vaping community have our best interests at hart, this could also lay the foundation for things to come.

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## Adephi (3/4/18)

I never really realised how big this fake industry is until I popped into the Centurion Chinese Mall yesterday.

Now to describe the mall, If crap could crap then you still won't have enough crap to equal the amount you will find under that roof.

And there where all your international juices. Jam monsters, Nasty Juices, Liqua's and a lot more that I cannot recall. All 100ml for R50. (The Liqua's was less ml). A couple of Smok and E-leaf mods as well. And very good fakes. From the packaging to the sealing of the packaging. If it wasn't for the price I would have thought it as legit.

Was mainly laughing it off as a joke until I saw the batteries. Sold as rechargeable vape 18650 batteries for R25. The name I cannot remember, not that it matter anyway. And you can't even speak to the owner because his limited amount of understanding of english won't get that conversation far.

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## Stosta (3/4/18)

Adephi said:


> ...
> Now to describe the mall, If crap could crap then you still won't have enough crap to equal the amount you will find under that roof.
> ...



I know these stalls! I love shopping at them (not for vape gear though, for crappy crap)!

Reactions: Agree 3


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## Cor (3/4/18)

Adephi said:


> I never really realised how big this fake industry is until I popped into the Centurion Chinese Mall yesterday.
> 
> Now to describe the mall, If crap could crap then you still won't have enough crap to equal the amount you will find under that roof.
> 
> ...


I dont have a problem in the sence with clone gear that much just user and vendor info about certain items......but clone juices i think of as the black plague

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