# Carnival’s DIY Journey



## Carnival (6/2/19)

I thought I’d make a thread for my DIY juice journey. 

I’m brand new to mixing, but so far I am loving every part of it.

These are the fruit recipes I’ve mixed thus far:

Recipe 1 -
Ruby Red Grapefruit (FW)
Sweet Lychee (CAP)
Fresh Cream (FA)

Recipe 2 -
Harvest Berry (CAP)
Raspberry (LA)
Fig (FA)
Cranberry (CAP)

Recipe 3 -
Kiwi Double (TFA)
Pineapple (INW)
Cantaloupe (CAP)

Recipe 4 -
Ripe Banana (FA)
Mango (FM)
Custard (INW

Recipe 5 -
Juicy Peach (TFA)
Shisha Orange (INW)
Pineapple (INW)

So far I’ve tested these recipes a bit, but during the course of next week I’ll spend more time vaping each of them to decide if I’m happy with them or if they need some tweaking. Which is why I left out the percentages for now.

Recipe 1, I was happy with the grapefruit in it (I am a BIG fan of grapefruit!) but couldn’t taste the lychee, so I’m hoping a few more days of steeping will maybe correct that. Fingers crossed...

There is a recipe #6  but that’s my secret recipe! Lol. Stumbled on to something with (for me) a lot of potential, so I’m thinking about how I can “perfect” it. 

I did also mix a recipe I found on All The Flavors. It’s called “Deep Passion”. The recipe was Passion Fruit, Fig Fresh and Carmel (Caramel). Took two puffs off it and binned it! I’m not sure if it was the passion fruit that put me off, or the whole combo of ingredients that just didn’t work for me (that was my first time trying passion fruit).

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## Carnival (6/2/19)

OH yes! Almost forgot to mention this...

I’ve decided to dip a toe into chocolate territory. I’ve put together a very slightly layered dark chocolate recipe to try at some stage! Looking at the ingredients and percentages, I’m very excited about it.. I left room (slightly lower percent) for adding a bit more of a couple flavours if need be (including the dark chocolate) - I figured it’s easier to add more next time I mix, as oppose to adding too much and risk ruining the whole recipe!

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## Silver (6/2/19)

Great to see @Carnival 

Am looking forward to following your DIY journey and maybe it can uncover a few gems...

My DIY journey needs to be resurrected so hopefully yours can inspire me to get going again...

Reactions: Like 4 | Funny 1 | Thanks 1


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## Christos (6/2/19)

Silver said:


> Great to see @Carnival
> 
> Am looking forward to following your DIY journey and maybe it can uncover a few gems...
> 
> My DIY journey needs to be resurrected so hopefully yours can inspire me to get going again...


I see a "Silver's DIY Experience" thread in the near future... 
Also keen to follow this thread as I've just resurrected my DIY practice from a few years back.

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## CTRiaan (6/2/19)

Try adding some coolant like WS23 or Polar Blast to recipe 1 to bring out the Lychee.

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## Carnival (6/2/19)

CTRiaan said:


> Try adding some coolant like WS23 or Polar Blast to recipe 1 to bring out the Lychee.



Oh awesome! I will try that, thank you! @CTRiaan 

I’ve seen WS23 mentioned a few times on the forum, so it’s probably worth giving a try.

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## Carnival (6/2/19)

CTRiaan said:


> Try adding some coolant like WS23 or Polar Blast to recipe 1 to bring out the Lychee.



Just to make sure, is it this one? (Pic attached)

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## Hooked (6/2/19)

Carnival said:


> OH yes! Almost forgot to mention this...
> 
> I’ve decided to dip a toe into chocolate territory. I’ve put together a very slightly layered dark chocolate recipe to try at some stage! Looking at the ingredients and percentages, I’m very excited about it.. I left room (slightly lower percent) for adding a bit more of a couple flavours if need be (including the dark chocolate) - I figured it’s easier to add more next time I mix, as oppose to adding too much and risk ruining the whole recipe!



Oooooohhhhhh sounds yummy @Carnival!

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## vicTor (6/2/19)

Carnival said:


> Just to make sure, is it this one? (Pic attached)



hi yes I use this one, it is WS23 20% though, you do get a WS23 30% also, I think from valley vapour

black ice does the job for me, remember, don't go large at first with coolant

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## Carnival (6/2/19)

vicTor said:


> hi yes I use this one, it is WS23 20% though, you do get a WS23 30% also, I think from valley vapour
> 
> black ice does the job for me, remember, don't go large at first with coolant



Thank you @vicTor ! I only like a touch of coolant anyway, so I will definitely only use a small percentage.

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## Christos (6/2/19)

Carnival said:


> Thank you @vicTor ! I only like a touch of coolant anyway, so I will definitely only use a small percentage.


Start with 0.5% or less first.
I like my coolants at 1% but i generally add 1% koolada with 1%creme de menthol and 1%WS23 so 3%total coolants

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## Carnival (6/2/19)

Christos said:


> Start with 0.5% or less first.
> I like my coolants at 1% but i generally add 1% koolada with 1%creme de menthol and 1%WS23 so 3%total coolants



Thank you for the tips @Christos !

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## Carnival (7/2/19)

Could someone please recommend a good butterscotch concentrate? Had a look on BLCK Vapour but not sure which one I should get.

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## RainstormZA (7/2/19)

Carnival said:


> Could someone please recommend a good butterscotch concentrate? Had a look on BLCK Vapour but not sure which one I should get.


Butterscotch Ripple is a good one to use, I absolutely love it.

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## Andre (7/2/19)

RainstormZA said:


> Butterscotch Ripple is a good one to use, I absolutely love it.


Yip, FW Butterscotch Ripple is the go to one.

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## Carnival (7/2/19)

RainstormZA said:


> Butterscotch Ripple is a good one to use, I absolutely love it.



Awesome, thanks!

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## Carnival (9/2/19)

Hey guys, looking for a nice strong, crisp green apple concentrate and a good lychee concentrate.

Recommendations please?

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## RichJB (9/2/19)

There aren't many good green apples. Instead, the apple sector is dominated by Fuji apples. Probably the closest you could get is a mixed green/red apple like Inw Two Apples. If you're looking for Granny Smith, you will just get funky chemical grassiness from most green apple flavours. It's a very difficult profile. Most mixers go for the Fujis as they offer a sweet crispness that is a good compromise between the more sour crunchy Granny Smith and the sweeter but softer/more floury texture of the red Star King or yellow Golden Delicious. All three of the main ones - FA, Cap and Jungle Flavors - are good. FA is by far the most popular.

For lychee, Cap Sweet is the most popular followed by FA.

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## Carnival (9/2/19)

RichJB said:


> There aren't many good green apples. Instead, the apple sector is dominated by Fuji apples. Probably the closest you could get is a mixed green/red apple like Inw Two Apples. If you're looking for Granny Smith, you will just get funky chemical grassiness from most green apple flavours. It's a very difficult profile. Most mixers go for the Fujis as they offer a sweet crispness that is a good compromise between the more sour crunchy Granny Smith and the sweeter but softer/more floury texture of the red Star King or yellow Golden Delicious. All three of the main ones - FA, Cap and Jungle Flavors - are good. FA is by far the most popular.
> 
> For lychee, Cap Sweet is the most popular followed by FA.



Thanks for your advice! Much appreciated. @RichJB

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## Silver (9/2/19)

RichJB said:


> There aren't many good green apples. Instead, the apple sector is dominated by Fuji apples. Probably the closest you could get is a mixed green/red apple like Inw Two Apples. If you're looking for Granny Smith, you will just get funky chemical grassiness from most green apple flavours. It's a very difficult profile. Most mixers go for the Fujis as they offer a sweet crispness that is a good compromise between the more sour crunchy Granny Smith and the sweeter but softer/more floury texture of the red Star King or yellow Golden Delicious. All three of the main ones - FA, Cap and Jungle Flavors - are good. FA is by far the most popular.
> 
> For lychee, Cap Sweet is the most popular followed by FA.



Jeepers @RichJB that was informative!
Thanks!

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## Adephi (9/2/19)

Carnival said:


> good lychee concentrate



Icee Lychee is pretty much the only lychee recipe you will ever need.

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## Carnival (13/2/19)

Okay, so I’ve been vaping Recipe #4:

Ripe Banana (FA)
Mango (FM)
Custard (INW)

I love banana flavours, but I have to admit the Ripe Banana isn’t working out here. Also, I put too little mango in so I can’t taste it. I found what looks like a good recipe by CheebaSteeba on All The Flavors, will give it a go!

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## Carnival (16/2/19)

Just wondering, is there a concentrate/additive that adds ‘crispness’ to fruity flavours?

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## RichJB (16/2/19)

Probably the most noticeable example I've found of it was in WF Soursop, which is magnificently clean, juicy, sharp and, yes, crisp off the shake. The nub being that it fades and fades hard. I'm guessing a small addition of it would help to crisp up a fruit. It might be hard to achieve that without the soursop flavour detracting, though.

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## Carnival (16/2/19)

RichJB said:


> Probably the most noticeable example I've found of it was in WF Soursop, which is magnificently clean, juicy, sharp and, yes, crisp off the shake. The nub being that it fades and fades hard. I'm guessing a small addition of it would help to crisp up a fruit. It might be hard to achieve that without the soursop flavour detracting, though.



Very interesting! Thank you! @RichJB

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## lesvaches (16/2/19)

Carnival said:


> Just wondering, is there a concentrate/additive that adds ‘crispness’ to fruity flavours?


have you tried adding (INW) Cactus?

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## Carnival (16/2/19)

lesvaches said:


> have you tried adding (INW) Cactus?



I actually have that on my list of concentrates to get next time I order! Keen to try it. Thank you! @lesvaches

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## Carnival (18/2/19)

What caramel concentrate would you guys recommend? And what toffee concentrate?

Also, for a buttery flavour what should I go for?

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## RichJB (18/2/19)

FA is the most popular caramel in terms of number of recipes, although a lot of mixers like FW Salted Caramel too. It's heavy on coils, though.

For butter, TFA Butter is the most popular. Cap Golden Butter is also used a lot. I'd go with FA because Deejay_Mills rates it the best and he's the bakery guy. I don't think you can really go wrong with butter flavours, there aren't any bad ones and they usually sub well for each other.

Toffee isn't used much, mixers tend to go with caramel or butterscotch. I suppose Flv Toffee and HS Caramel Toffee would be the safest. I have the HS, it's OK but not something I'd miss in my stash.

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## Silver (18/2/19)

RichJB said:


> FA is the most popular caramel in terms of number of recipes, although a lot of mixers like FW Salted Caramel too. It's heavy on coils, though.
> 
> For butter, TFA Butter is the most popular. Cap Golden Butter is also used a lot. I'd go with FA because Deejay_Mills rates it the best and he's the bakery guy. I don't think you can really go wrong with butter flavours, there aren't any bad ones and they usually sub well for each other.
> 
> Toffee isn't used much, mixers tend to go with caramel or butterscotch. I suppose Flv Toffee and HS Caramel Toffee would be the safest. I have the HS, it's OK but not something I'd miss in my stash.



Thanks for the insights @RichJB 
Very informative

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## Carnival (18/2/19)

RichJB said:


> FA is the most popular caramel in terms of number of recipes, although a lot of mixers like FW Salted Caramel too. It's heavy on coils, though.
> 
> For butter, TFA Butter is the most popular. Cap Golden Butter is also used a lot. I'd go with FA because Deejay_Mills rates it the best and he's the bakery guy. I don't think you can really go wrong with butter flavours, there aren't any bad ones and they usually sub well for each other.
> 
> Toffee isn't used much, mixers tend to go with caramel or butterscotch. I suppose Flv Toffee and HS Caramel Toffee would be the safest. I have the HS, it's OK but not something I'd miss in my stash.



I always appreciate your advice, thanks once again! @RichJB

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## Paul33 (10/3/19)

RichJB said:


> FA is the most popular caramel



What % would you recommend as a starting point to add some sweetness and not take over in an Ry4/custard/cream kind of mix @RichJB?


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## Paul33 (10/3/19)

Paul33 said:


> What % would you recommend as a starting point to add some sweetness and not take over in an Ry4/custard/cream kind of mix @RichJB?


Is FA Carmel the same thing?


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## stevie g (10/3/19)

Paul33 said:


> Is FA Carmel the same thing?


FA carmel = FA caramel

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## RichJB (10/3/19)

Paul33 said:


> What % would you recommend as a starting point to add some sweetness and not take over in an Ry4/custard/cream kind of mix @RichJB?



You'll get caramel anyway from the RY4. If you just want to boost the caramel note while adding some brown sugar style sweetness, I think 0.75-1% is a good zone for FA Caramel. If you don't have a caramel note already and want to impart a distinct caramel flavour with sweetness, I'd go around 1.5-2%. It's not really a smooth creamy caramel, though. It's a bit dry and brown sugary. But in a custard or cream, that's not a problem.

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## Carnival (11/3/19)

Today I tested the coconut based recipe I made. It has been steeping for 4 days. Problem is, I can’t taste any coconut whatsoever! Also, the lemon lime CAP was too weak for my taste. Here is the recipe I put together:

Sweet Coconut (FLV) - 4%
Sweet Lychee (CAP) - 4%
Lemon Lime (CAP) - 2%
Vanilla Bean Ice Cream (TFA) - 3%
Sweet Cream (CAP) - 3%

Now, I might be wrong but I have noticed in the past that some cream/creamy concentrates I add tend to tone down the other flavours, so I started off adding 4% of both sweet coconut and sweet lychee. Alas, neither of those flavours are coming through. I can let go of the lychee not showing up, but I really wanted a coconut flavour.

To try and fix this, I then added 1% of Coconut (FA) hoping that might be a bit of a stronger coconut concentrate, and 1.5% more Lemon Lime. I then gave it a good shake and tested it.. still no coconut, and the lemon lime was still not at the right level for me. 

Maybe it’s unnecessary, but I’m cautious of adding too much lemon lime and then ruining the recipe. In my head, I’m thinking you can easily go overboard with this concentrate? Then again it may not actually be as strong of a concentrate as I thought thus why I’m not getting the right level of flavour. So I’m really not sure how much more I should be adding? Any ideas for that? And as far as getting the coconut to come through, which coconut concentrate should I add more of?

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## Carnival (11/3/19)

To add, I know the overall percentage in the recipe is quite high (I normally mix quite a bit less in total) so perhaps I mixed in too much Vanilla Bean Ice Cream?

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## Carnival (14/3/19)

No ideas for help here?


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## Puff the Magic Dragon (14/3/19)

Is this your own recipe ? 

I have been doing DIY juice for almost four years and still use other people's recipes. I tweak and sub a little but don't trust my own abilities. I am not a very good "taster" but I know what I like when I try it. I still might not be able to identify e.g. peach in a recipe but if I like the overall taste I am happy to vape it.

Good luck with your journey. Sorry that I can't help.

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## Carnival (14/3/19)

Puff the Magic Dragon said:


> Is this your own recipe ?
> 
> I have been doing DIY juice for almost four years and still use other people's recipes. I tweak and sub a little but don't trust my own abilities. I am not a very good "taster" but I know what I like when I try it. I still might not be able to identify e.g. peach in a recipe but if I like the overall taste I am happy to vape it.
> 
> Good luck with your journey. Sorry that I can't help.



Yep, it’s my own recipe. Would just appreciate some advise for getting the coconut to come through.


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## Puff the Magic Dragon (14/3/19)

Why don't you tag @Dietz of @RichJB . Oops, I did it for you.

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## Carnival (14/3/19)

Puff the Magic Dragon said:


> Why don't you tag @Dietz of @RichJB . Oops, I did it for you.



Lol, thank you kindly @Puff the Magic Dragon

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## Paul33 (14/3/19)

I would make a single flavour coconut test with the FLV sweet coconut so you can see exactly what you getting from it then build it from there. 

I haven’t used it before but 4% on a FLV concentrate seems high to me but try it as a stand-alone and go from there.

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## Dela Rey Steyn (14/3/19)

@Rude Rudi should also be able to assist

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## Andre (14/3/19)

Carnival said:


> Today I tested the coconut based recipe I made. It has been steeping for 4 days. Problem is, I can’t taste any coconut whatsoever! Also, the lemon lime CAP was too weak for my taste. Here is the recipe I put together:
> 
> Sweet Coconut (FLV) - 4%
> Sweet Lychee (CAP) - 4%
> ...


I have an idea both the FLV Sweet Coconut and the CAP Sweet Lychee might be too high - maybe 2% each. I would have started the CAP Sweet Cream at 1% as well. To save it, maybe add 0.5% of TFA Coconut Extra (higher and it becomes suntan lotion). Do not be afraid to add more of the CAP Lemon Lime or INW Juicy Lemon if you have.

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## Carnival (14/3/19)

Andre said:


> I have an idea both the FLV Sweet Coconut and the CAP Sweet Lychee might be too high - maybe 2% each. I would have started the CAP Sweet Cream at 1% as well. To save it, maybe add 0.5% of TFA Coconut Extra (higher and it becomes suntan lotion). Do not be afraid to add more of the CAP Lemon Lime or INW Juicy Lemon if you have.



Thanks so much @Andre , I will adjust accordingly.

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## Dietz (14/3/19)

The Original recipe has a few things that I think might be muting or over powering each other. The Lemon lime can definitely over power something like the Lychee and Coconut as these concentrates lack a bit of 'depth' when put up against other more vibrant concentrates Like a Lime. Thats not to say it wont work though.

I think the problem here is balancing this combination of flavors. What is the Main note that you are going for? If its Coconut then I would say start with the coconut profile and build the other concentrates around that.

A good combination that adds some definition to a Coconut for me is FLV Cream @ 0.5% with Sweet coconut @ 1%-2% (you might need to use a combination of coconuts to get a more in your face coconut).
The lychee and Lemon lime are very different spectrum of flav in comparison with the 'Neutral' type of coconut flav, for that reason I would say they need to be added in this recipe while keeping in mind how much more vibrant they are than the coconut, especially when it comes to the Lemon lime.

I would use the Sweet lychee as a sweetner in the mix so somewhere between 1.5-3% with the 3% being the case where you want a balance on Coconut and Lychee as the main profile.

I would use the Lemon lime somewhere around 0.5-1% to boost some zest into the mix, but this is what I think is altering the profile away from your Coconut.

Then finally the Ice cream, I prefer LB Vanilla Ice Cream or HS French Vanilla Ice Cream as its just a Fuller Ice cream or Cream in general.

SO I would try something like this:
Sweet Coconut (FLV) - 1.8%-2.5%
Sweet Lychee (CAP) - 1.5% (or up to 3 if you want it as part of the flavor notes in the main profile)
Lemon Lime (CAP) - 0.5% - 1%
Vanilla Ice Cream (LB) - 1.5%
Cream (FLV) - 0.5% (to emulsify and blend everything)

for me the easiest way to decide how these flavors will work together or in what ratios to mix them is if you test them individually to get a feel for where each concentrate shines or where it starts to get too strong.
Dont be scared to mix a few different batched with different ratios as experimentation, you will soon notice what you like and dislike in each batch.

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## Silver (14/3/19)

Amazing and insightful feedback @Dietz !
Wow

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## Rude Rudi (14/3/19)

Paul33 said:


> I would make a single flavour coconut test with the FLV sweet coconut so you can see exactly what you getting from it then build it from there.
> 
> I haven’t used it before but 4% on a FLV concentrate seems high to me but try it as a stand-alone and go from there.



Correct, 4% is far too high. The average mixing percentage as a main profile is 1.75% and 0.5% as an accent.
For single flavour testing, I would recommend 0.5, 1, 1.5 and 2 to give you the full spectrum.

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