# Being Judged



## Braki (19/3/18)

So I made a post on Facebook telling everyone I am a Vaper. Now family members are posting links to articles about how much more canceres vaping is. Or old friends telling me it's just as dangerous.

I am now kinda p... off.  I need a link or article I can send to them explaining how this works (one for dummies) and silently to go fly a kite close to a edge.

I actually wish there were statistics that I can show them how many vapers in relation to smokers there are. Google is going to be busy tomorrow. 

Venting over... Still p... off

Reactions: Like 6 | Agree 1


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## Slick (19/3/18)

Braki said:


> So I made a post on Facebook telling everyone I am a Vaper. Now family members are posting links to articles about how much more canceres vaping is. Or old friends telling me it's just as dangerous.
> 
> I am now kinda p... off.  I need a link or article I can send to them explaining how this works (one for dummies) and silently to go fly a kite close to a edge.
> 
> ...


Oooh I have no time for that,my friend was smoking a cigarette and I was vaping next to him when he said 'that thing is bad for you',I just looked at him and started laughing,another smoker told me he had just heard vaping causes cancer so I shouldn't vape,I told him cigarette boxes have been telling you that for so many years but you didnt quit yet.I dont get into those arguments anymore,I just let them be,it keeps my blood pressure steady

Reactions: Like 4 | Agree 2 | Funny 2 | Thanks 1 | Can relate 7


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## Alex (19/3/18)

Braki said:


> So I made a post on Facebook telling everyone I am a Vaper. Now family members are posting links to articles about how much more canceres vaping is. Or old friends telling me it's just as dangerous.
> 
> I am now kinda p... off.  I need a link or article I can send to them explaining how this works (one for dummies) and silently to go fly a kite close to a edge.
> 
> ...



Start here https://www.ecigssa.co.za/forums/electronic-cigarette-studies-and-news/

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## Adephi (19/3/18)

I have a similar experience. Have learnt to just be discreet about it and not blabber out. If people want to judge they will judge. No matter what you show them.

My mom is extremely judgmental. Anything they say on RSG or Huisgenoot is always correct. So when she got the news that I stopped smoking and started vaping she began the speech of how bad it is and worse and and and....

So I explained to her that these studies that claim its so bad is all linked or funded by the tobacco industry or government departments with links to the tobacco industry. If we are going to take nicotine we have to take the way they say we must (or how they will benefit the most).

And then I told her about my 2 kids. Both had chronic asthma when I was smoking. 2 asthma pumps a month at least. Since I stopped smoking and started vaping no a single puff from those pumps where needed. Even our nebuliser is gathering dust in the garage.

That's no research or statics by some sensational blog or magazine. That was something she could see. And even though she is still on the fence about vaping she is leaning more to the side for it.

Still won't push it and vape in front of my folks. (Yeah I'm 39 and still scared of smoking/vaping in front of my parents). But at least they know I'm making effort getting off the nicotine.

Reactions: Like 7 | Winner 5 | Can relate 1


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## Raindance (19/3/18)

It is a known and accepted fact that 80% of the population will be incorrectly informed 80% of the time. The other 20% are most probably members of this forum.

Smile and wave guys, smile and wave!

Regards

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## RichJB (19/3/18)

@Braki, you can start with this article. Seeing as it's from gov.uk, specifically Public Health England, your friends and family may be more inclined to believe it.

Reactions: Like 3 | Thanks 1


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## Rob Fisher (19/3/18)

I feel for you @Braki... I have been vaping for over four years now and I have been through this many many many times... when I first started vaping I was unsure as to the real benefits but now there is absolutely no doubt in my mind (or my doctor's mind) that vaping is way better for me. I was in a terrible state of health and without being too dramatic vaping saved my life.

Only yesterday I bumped into an old friend and she couldn't wait to tell me about popcorn lung... having had this kind of ignorant crap so many times before I normally shrug it off or tell them to F'Off... but this time I explained the whole story to her and she went off a lot wiser about vaping.

The guys have given you some links to read and to pass on but take my advice and simply let the ignorant know just how different you feel already!

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## Faiyaz Cheulkar (19/3/18)

Raindance said:


> It is a known and accepted fact that 80% of the population will be incorrectly informed 80% of the time. The other 20% are most probably members of this forum.
> 
> Smile and wave guys, smile and wave!
> 
> Regards



Aah the Pareto principle, applies almost anywhere. 
Couldn't agree more. My brother-in-law and my sister-in-law's husband are big time smokers, I am talking about 25-30 cigarettes in a day. When my wife suggested vaping to them they said it causes cough . And to support them my sister-in-law who happens to be a medical practitioner claimed that vaping causes fluid buildup in the chest !!
I just gave up and dint care to argue.

Reactions: Like 4 | Agree 2 | Can relate 1


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## SinnerG (20/3/18)

Braki said:


> So I made a post on Facebook telling everyone I am a Vaper. Now family members are posting links to articles about how much more canceres vaping is. Or old friends telling me it's just as dangerous.
> 
> I am now kinda p... off.  I need a link or article I can send to them explaining how this works (one for dummies) and silently to go fly a kite close to a edge.
> 
> ...



Vent away.
I keep to myself with this stuff.
Many years ago my wife wanted me to switch to this thing called "Twisp" that her friend was bringing into the country. I said no.
Couple of month's back I switched to vaping.
Off she goes, comes back after a 2 minute Google: "I think you should stick to smoking."

It took me 6 months of reading and looking around to see what vaping is about before I finally decided I should at least try.
How people can find definitive information on this within a single search is beyond me.

People live by the first page of Google.
The big problem with Google is that people will usually find what they're looking for.

Reactions: Like 5 | Agree 5


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## Adephi (20/3/18)

Some of my smoker buddies love making chirps about it. Last time I just told them "Its fine, make fun of me while you still have the breath in you to do it." Sortoff put an end to the conversation right there.

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## HPBotha (20/3/18)

Some people revell in their ability to consume spoon fed information. They flock to big media and the opinions that support their own ignorance. The only way to educate that type of person is with time. And really, if it is a chance encounter with a long lost acquaintance... then why bother putting energy into a potential argument. Consistently keeping your vape candle burning (by being a considerate and responsable vaper) and educating yourself for that moment when your audience are actually receptive... that is your goal. 

What swung me to the vape scene 4 years ago was a very simple statement.... "why do i smoke analogues when we are in the digital age?" The very simple fact that you are burning a substance and inhaling the smoke vs digitally controlling the vaporizing of a liquid and thereby getting a cleaner nicotine delivery system?? A real light bulb moment. Add to this advancements in Temp control, and now replay from DNA 250C / 75C boards.... wow

@Braki go to the VPASA website and look at their blog section, lots of information there.

_Just a friendly warning, do not try to win any vaping argument. If someone is not willing to learn and you continue to push the envelope you will be expected to wear a tin foil hat and be labeled a conspiracy nut. _

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## Hooked (20/3/18)

Braki said:


> So I made a post on Facebook telling everyone I am a Vaper. Now family members are posting links to articles about how much more canceres vaping is. Or old friends telling me it's just as dangerous.
> 
> I am now kinda p... off.  I need a link or article I can send to them explaining how this works (one for dummies) and silently to go fly a kite close to a edge.
> 
> ...



@Braki I also get p... off at what some people say. Over the past few days I've had two judgements: first a friend telling me that my vision has deteriorated since my last eye-test because of vaping, then someone saying, "But surely that stuff can't be good for you." - and of course both these people are non-vapers (also non-smokers) and know nothing whatsoever about vaping - and THAT is what really angers me!!! It doesn't help to explain and inform - people have their own mindset and whatever you say will just go right over their heads. 

Keep calm and vape on!!

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## Braki (20/3/18)

Wow guys. Thank you for all the links and how you handle this. 

My sister-in-law was also a smoker and started vaping. I did not know this. On Sunday when we had the family together she came out where I was standing with her Twisp and I was like YES I have a vaping friend. So then my uncle came and stood by us and he is a big time smoker and asked what is going on. So we started telling him about it. And he used her Twisp and my hubby's Twisp (two flavors) and he was surprised at how it works. So we converted another smoker to the healthier alternative. Then she tried my Captain and now she is upgrading to a bigger mod. 

My biggest mission now is to try and educate people in my immediate environment and get them off this stupid cigarettes. Living in a small town people tend to stare and when I stand outside the mall with the captain they move away. I mean I'm standing where you are smoking. I'm not blowing toxic gas out of my mouth. Yours is more toxic. I am going to get these people to READ and I will proof them wrong. But alas some you lose and some you win. Like I told them all. If you don't like what I'm posting about Vaping.... There's the door.

I mean to say. Since I started vaping I havent touched cake or sweets or chocolate. And I used to eat a slab of chocolate at once. (Bad for a type 1 diabetic I know) Getting my sweets fix with the Vaping 
Anyways. I will try to shrug the non believers off and tell them to go educate themselves and then come talk to me until then if try to tell me !!cancer!!... ignore you will be. (Saying this in my Yoda voice which sounds better in my head)

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## Cornelius (20/3/18)

Yip I shall succumb to popcorn lung or exploding lips! I have given up on arguing with these people.
Let them be, let them talk and the most satisfying of all let them stink.

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## Anvil (20/3/18)

I've had this argument with many people many times, and what I've found while arguing with this sort of person is that it's like repeatedly sticking your finger in a plug socket. It's only becomes satisfying when you stop.

On the plus side however, every now and then someone with an open mind will stop and listen. These are the people (like so many of us here) that will eventually tell everyone how quitting the cigs and picking up a vape improved their lives.

Reactions: Like 4


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## rogue zombie (20/3/18)

Also, follow Innokin on Facebook. They regularly put up articles on science that debunks rubbish etc.

Reactions: Like 2 | Thanks 1


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## RainstormZA (20/3/18)

Arrrrgh @Braki - I get the same thing.... I'd like to find articles that aren't misleading

Sent from the Netherealms of Hell

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## Silver (20/3/18)

Braki said:


> So I made a post on Facebook telling everyone I am a Vaper. Now family members are posting links to articles about how much more canceres vaping is. Or old friends telling me it's just as dangerous.
> 
> I am now kinda p... off.  I need a link or article I can send to them explaining how this works (one for dummies) and silently to go fly a kite close to a edge.
> 
> ...



Sorry to hear @Braki

I think there are a lot of smokers that just dont want to switch to vaping so they take comfort in articles saying vaping is bad for you. And of course non-smokers / non-vapers that just dont like any form of smoking or vaping. Those people will always exist.

But the thing is that if you have switched from smoking to vaping and its working for you - then that is great. This is a personal journey. As long as you are happy and feel the benefits then you are winning.

I have long ago stopped trying to convince "negative-on-vaping" friends and acquaintances that vaping is not very harmful. Based on the research so far I choose to believe that vaping is significantly better than smoking and I can feel it. So that works for me. I think changing the mindset of other people (especially those that are stubborn) is another story altogether.

I like what @Rob Fisher said about telling people how you feel instead of getting into an argument on the science.

Reactions: Like 6 | Winner 1


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## Andre (20/3/18)

I'm at the age where I no longer feel the need to relieve people of their ignorance.

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## Clarissa (20/3/18)

I had a similar experience with some close friends! One of my good friends is a smoker that is visibly experiencing the side effects of smoking (healthy guy otherwise, but cannot run for long at all). I asked him, why not just switch to vaping, already? Our other friend, who uses Snus (Swedish chewing tobacco that destroys your teeth), pipes up saying, "WHAT?! But Vaping is SO MUCH WORSE!" Can you imagine saying that to someone who's actually researched the topic?

Reactions: Like 3


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## RichJB (20/3/18)

The sobering thought in all of this is that, while we have read up on vaping and thus don't fall for media headlines, there are probably many other subjects where we are similarly misinformed and where those who have done their homework would just shake their heads at our comments on the matter. One likes to believe that one is reasonably well informed and have at least got the basics right on most subjects but it probably isn't the case.

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## RainstormZA (20/3/18)

I was lucky with my dentist yesterday. She saw my pico on the table with my sunglasses and cellphone. 

She said it's good that I quitted smoking and went over to vaping. It's better for my teeth too. She's young - probably younger than me. This dental practice only employs women as well. 

Sent from the Netherealms of Hell

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## Braki (20/3/18)

RainstormZA said:


> I was lucky with my dentist yesterday. She saw my pico on the table with my sunglasses and cellphone.
> 
> She said it's good that I quitted smoking and went over to vaping. It's better for my teeth too. She's young - probably younger than me. This dental practice only employs women as well.
> 
> Sent from the Netherealms of Hell


Thats one thing I have also noticed. My gums are not as sensitive anymore. Another reason for the non informed to stop being non informed.

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## RainstormZA (20/3/18)

Braki said:


> Thats one thing I have also noticed. My gums are not as sensitive anymore. Another reason for the non informed to stop being non informed.


Yeah I also noticed my teeth are no longer being stained by cigarette smoke as it's the tar that's difficult to remove. I had a whole pile of fillings and fixed teeth - she even agreed two hours was too long.

Plus side on vaping is I no longer smell like an ashtray. A guy at the office I wok in said my one juice deffo smells like peppermint crisp. He said it's good that I quitted smoking - said that others need to switch to vaping. Hahahahahaha. 

Sent from the Netherealms of Hell

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## SinnerG (20/3/18)

Braki said:


> Wow guys. Thank you for all the links and how you handle this.
> 
> My sister-in-law was also a smoker and started vaping. I did not know this. On Sunday when we had the family together she came out where I was standing with her Twisp and I was like YES I have a vaping friend. So then my uncle came and stood by us and he is a big time smoker and asked what is going on. So we started telling him about it. And he used her Twisp and my hubby's Twisp (two flavors) and he was surprised at how it works. So we converted another smoker to the healthier alternative. Then she tried my Captain and now she is upgrading to a bigger mod.
> 
> ...



Difficult thing I find here is that I'm the only "smoker" in the entire extended family (I don't see my own bloodline family much) and they're all judgemental about everything. Note I said "smoker"; it's going to be a long time before the general public see vaping and smoking as different, IMHO. It's good that you find like-minded members in your family.

However, don't force choices onto smokers. Let them get off the cigs themselves. Remember the old line: the worst smoker is an ex-smoker.  I'm not going to complain about someone's choice for smoking cigs. I was there for 18 years and I was irritated by people lecturing me about it, and ex-smokers giving me grief. It took me to make the decision myself.

Reactions: Like 2 | Agree 2


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## Vino1718 (20/3/18)

This video might also help: https://www.ecigssa.co.za/formaldehyde-in-electronic-cigarettes-vs-combustible-tobacco.t48297/

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## Steyn777 (20/3/18)

With me I had to deal with stuff like : Do you carry your Vape in your purse, be a real man etc etc.
Just started with replying with this: Jip, women just love the whole ashtray smell and lung failure thing. Kinda worked

Reactions: Agree 1 | Winner 1 | Funny 3


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## Steyn777 (20/3/18)

With me I had to deal with stuff like : Do you carry your Vape in your purse, be a real man etc etc.
Just started with replying with this: Jip, women just love the whole ashtray smell and lung failure thing. Kinda worked

Reactions: Funny 2


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## TheV (20/3/18)

For me it is very easy... people that are curious, want to discuss, want to debate or have any sort of decent conversation, I will happily engage.
On the other hand... people that just want to spout nonsense and say their say, say it and move along, I have no time for you.
^ this applies to more than just vaping.
My time is precious, I refuse to waste it on idiots

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## Zia (20/3/18)

Alex said:


> Start here https://www.ecigssa.co.za/forums/electronic-cigarette-studies-and-news/


Alex, the God himself, back at it again. Ready to mess up some misinformed tards with facts!

Reactions: Funny 4


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## DaveH (20/3/18)

Braki said:


> So I made a post on Facebook telling everyone I am a Vaper. Now family members are posting links to articles about how much more canceres vaping is. Or old friends telling me it's just as dangerous.



Come on who gives a ****. 

Old friends ........... get some new ones.
Family .............. bit more tricky but any eat or drink too much? Over weight? Have ago back.

I have to say I've not encounted much negativity regarding my vaping. 

Dave

Reactions: Like 2 | Funny 1


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## RenaldoRheeder (20/3/18)

It is a lot easier for me to quote my own health improvement, than to try and remember the facts from an article: chest pains gone, chronic cough gone, suspect tissue on my lip gone, chronic headaches gone, etc, etc. 


Sent by iDad's iPhone

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## rogue zombie (21/3/18)

My ma in law keeps posting crap about ecigs.

I have to restrain myself from saying I will go back to smoking then. I COULD NOT STOP SMOKING. I tried and tried. I would've been smoking till buried.

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## rogue zombie (21/3/18)

Which reminds me of a joke:

"I saw this young girl texting away on her phone while driving...
"I got so angry, I rolled down my window and threw my beer at her."

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## Captain Chaos (21/3/18)

I couldn't give a flying rats ass when people start their BS about vaping being bad for you.
I know how I feel now since I started vaping 4 months ago. It is nice not donating a lung or two to the ashtray every morning. I can smell my aftershave throughout the day. I don't stink of smoke anymore.
The best part? Walking into a nice fresh house every day.
Whenever a smoker starts feeding me some BS about vaping, I just move away and tell him that he stinks, and have no desire to die prematurely. That normally shuts them up.

I love it when I get back into my car after doing some shopping and getting that fresh odor of whatever I am vaping coming from my mod patiently waiting in the cupholder.

Get you some of that, smokers!

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## Adephi (21/3/18)

Captain Chaos said:


> I couldn't give a flying rats ass when people start their BS about vaping being bad for you.
> I know how I feel now since I started vaping 4 months ago. It is nice not donating a lung or two to the ashtray every morning. I can smell my aftershave throughout the day. I don't stink of smoke anymore.
> The best part? Walking into a nice fresh house every day.
> Whenever a smoker starts feeding me some BS about vaping, I just move away and tell him that he stinks, and have no desire to die prematurely. That normally shuts them up.
> ...



Or getting into the hot car in the middle of a scorching day and having toot of a refreshing fruity menthol.

A few weeks back I had a bit of a cold. Lasted 4 days from sniffs to scratchy throat to end of coughing. While i was smoking I would have been coughing for at least 3 weeks after.

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## Hooked (22/3/18)

@Braki

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## Braki (22/3/18)

Hooked said:


> @Braki
> 
> View attachment 126638


For me that is very difficult. Got another tag to how vaping is more canceres. I nearly unfriended the person. But I posted a article about findings how its not. So lets see if she gets the message now. Next tag is a going out the door.

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## Humbolt (22/3/18)

In the beginning, I used to get annoyed by these folk and engage. But these days, I don't give a damn. I usually just nip the conversation with a line like, "to each his own." Or, "you do you, I do me."
I don't have time to get into debates with people who have already made their minds up due to mainstream media.

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## rogue zombie (23/3/18)

Humbolt said:


> In the beginning, I used to get annoyed by these folk and engage. But these days, I don't give a damn. I usually just nip the conversation with a line like, "to each his own." Or, "you do you, I do me."



Yip, or I explain how much healthier I feel. When I'm in a caring mood.

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## Jengz (23/3/18)

I get these negative comments almost everyday from many people. My response is always simple 

‘I feel a lot healthier, I feel happier, I feel that I can make the call on what helps and what does not help my wellbeing. Vaping is enjoyable and whilst being that it’s made a huge difference in my health at an early stage in my life. So let me be’

It’s always going to be a fight like many other arguments. But I don’t go around telling people not to ride motorcycles or not to over eat etc, live the life you love, and if people can’t take that, blow a cloud and walk away.

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## Braki (23/3/18)

Jengz said:


> live the life you love, and if people can’t take that, blow a cloud and walk away.


This is now my attitude. I don't care anymore. If people are to ignorant to facts then they need to go fly a kite. I will even blow clouds to help them along.

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## RichJB (23/3/18)

I must have a very tolerant family and social circle because I've mostly had encouragement or interested enquiries. Most people ask me how it works, what are the benefits, how does it compare to smoking tobacco, and so on. I had one who said "it's still nicotine so you're still addicted, you haven't kicked your dependence on it". Which is a fair point, I guess.

I don't think the negative mindset comes totally from the media because most media coverage these days is positive. I think people have been so indoctrinated, by fifty years of anti-smoking campaigns, that any chemical you inhale must be cancerous and will kill you the day after tomorrow. If it looks like smoking, it must be as bad as smoking, in their view. It's a conclusion they reach independently without even consulting the media.

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## Anvil (23/3/18)

RichJB said:


> "it's still nicotine so you're still addicted, you haven't kicked your dependence on it"


This is very true as well, and I agree completely that a huge part of the problem is that the vast majority of people still see nicotine = cigarettes = deadly. They don't realise or know better that it's the other rubbish thrown into cigs that is the real danger, and that's exactly what we get rid of by vaping.

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## RichJB (23/3/18)

There is that angle but the other angle, especially from those who have quit altogether, is "I don't need nicotine anymore, you still do". Seven of the nine smokers in my direct family quit everything, I vape, one still smokes. So the seven claim to be better off. They don't think about nic now, they don't spend anything on it, they don't get edgy if they can't get it. So it's a valid point and one that I don't argue against. Quitting everything is the gold medal, switching to a less harmful form of nic is the silver, continuing smoking is the booby prize and wooden spoon combined.

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