# Code of Conduct Ideas



## Raindance (8/12/16)

A number of recent posts addressed concern about the behavior of some Vapers impacting negatively on our ability to defend our right to Vape. The need for a "Vapers code of conduct" has been expressed and supported by a number of forum members but we need to take a bit more decisive action to actually make this code a reality.

In order to develop such a code, the first principles (or rules) of freedom of choice (aka Democracy) need to be explored a bit. I have spent a considerable time reflecting on the true nature of freedom of choice and in my contemplation's the following rules have come to the fore:

The four cornerstones of freedom of choice.

Rule one:
An individual has the right not to participate or be affected by any activity or action he wishes not to participate in or be affected by.

Rule two:
An individual has the right to engage in or participate in any activity or action he wishes to participate or engage in as long as said participation or engagement does not impede or deny the rights of other individuals as set out in rule one.

Rule three:
An individual has the duty of sole responsibility and accountability for any and all consequences resulting from decisions made under the rights outlined in rules one and two. 

Rule four:
Any person choosing to act contradictory to any of the provisions laid down in rules one to three looses the right to protection of his own rights as provided for in rules one to three. 

Application to of the above in a Vapers code of conduct:

The rights of individuals whom do not wish partake or experience the side effects of Vaping should be respected at all times unless those that do not vape have by their own choice entered an area recognized as, or dedicated to, the activity of vaping.

The decision to Vape or not to Vape is a personal one and no person or body has the right to act in any way that restricts any individuals ability to make this choice for themselves.

With the freedom to make this choice, an individual choosing to Vape must accept responsibility for their choice and can not blame any other person or body for any consequences of this choice irrespective of the consequences being known or unknown at the time of making that choice.

A persons right to Vape can only be justified and upheld as long as said person respects and upholds the rights of those whom choose not to. Freedom of choice can not be demanded by those that wish to restrict the freedoms of others.

Of course the above can be elaborated on and are more an expression of the goals to be underwritten by a code of conduct than being a code of conduct in itself. 

I was hoping this would serve to set the wheels turning by getting forum members to share their ideas and views thereby building a comprehensive COC as a group effort. We could then choose to adopt this code of conduct as forum members thereby strengthening our demands in terms of our own rights as Vapers.

So, How about it?

Reactions: Like 2 | Agree 2 | Winner 3


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## Huffapuff (9/12/16)

Thank you @Raindance for this, it's an important topic for all vapers to consider. Because of the association of vaping with smoking and all the misleading media attention vaping and the vape community finds itself with a negative public image. This isn't good for us and we need to do all we can to avoid adding to this negative perception of something that is actually very positive and beneficial. 

There is an ancient expression that sums up your ideas of freedom that I believe applies here: "And harm ye none, do as ye will"

Reactions: Like 2


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## Anneries (9/12/16)

This is really a great initiative. But my only concern is that most of the people on this thread is here because they are passionate about the vaping lifestyle/hobby. As such they do apply common sense, at least 99% of the time. As per Rule one: If individuals do not want to take the COC to heart, we cannot force them. And these are the people we are actually writing this for. 

There are a lot of people I know, that do vape that is surprised when I tell them there is actually a forum and community online. So unless we ask vendors to provide a copy with each first time purchase, getting this COC out to the public will be a major task. I for one will print it and give it out to anyone I know that is vaping.


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## Lord Vetinari (9/12/16)

You lost me at 'Rules' unfortunately. If I was handed a code of conduct with my first device, I would probably have asked for a refund and just got more cigs. 

It is great that people want to see vaping grow and want it more broadly accepted, but reality is to me it is a personal and private pleasure. My struggles with addiction, first cigarettes and then the excessive vape gear purchases, is fragile and intense enough to not have to be subjected to a form or structure decided upon by a web forum's members. 

It IS a subculture. Its funny how many vapers find this hard to accept. But it really truly is a weird and wonderful thing, like rock n roll or massive raves or fast motorcycles. You will find a small part of society intensely passionate about it but for the most part people will frown at it. Go have a vape at the Twisp stall in your local mall. Use a subtank. Watch the looks you get from Twispers for your cloudy cloud. Want to freak them all out chuck a real cloud. Trust me I have tested this many times. 

Just accept it as a sub culture and that you are part of it. And as a general rule with these things, happiness lies in relaxing about your decisions, and keeping it out of society's face. Dont bug them and they dont bug you.

Reactions: Like 3 | Agree 3 | Winner 1 | Thanks 1


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## Andre (9/12/16)

Mustrum Ridcully said:


> Just accept it as a sub culture and that you are part of it. And as a general rule with these things, happiness lies in relaxing about your decisions, and keeping it out of society's face. Dont bug them and they dont bug you.


This last sentence of yours sounds like an excellent summary of @Raindance's "rules".

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 8


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## Lord Vetinari (9/12/16)

Andre said:


> This last sentence of yours sounds like an excellent summary of @Raindance's "rules".


Indeed... I do hope common sense rules the day and we dont need to lay down normal decent behaviour as 'rules'. 

Also got to just leave the younger vapers that like to be a bit more loud about it to do their thing. We all have our loud phase.


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## Waine (9/12/16)

Gosh, this is all such a mouthful and confusing....


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## Raindance (9/12/16)

If my daughter would read the initial post above i know she would also claim i am having an OCD attack (Again). Truth be told, i probably am. The facts are however that if we do not regulate our own behaviour, someone else will.

My biggest fear is to be restricted to vaping in a space shared with smokers.

Also, freedom is an illusion and real freedom is nothing more than being allowed to regulate ones own behavior, but alas, there are always the one or two induviduals whom spoil it for everyone.
I know most of us believe we act considerately and would not purposely violate the wishes of others. Events at the beginning of this week made me rethink how considerate my vaping behaviour truly is and i had to admit that there is room for improvement.
What i found was that i did indirectly place my freedom to vape above the wishes of others because i never really put myself in the shoes of the non vapers out there.
If anything, i hope the existence of a code would at least assist us to really consider the wishes of others and at least help us grow as people. I really do not want to be just another @hole living in blind ignorance of the negative effect i have on others and my surroundings.
I think there are many here that share that sentiment and would love to hear their views.

Reactions: Like 1 | Winner 1


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## Andre (9/12/16)

Mustrum Ridcully said:


> Indeed... I do hope common sense rules the day and we dont need to lay down normal decent behaviour as 'rules'.
> 
> Also got to just leave the younger vapers that like to be a bit more loud about it to do their thing. We all have our loud phase.


For some people you have to word common sense, unfortunately. As simple as possible.

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## mavric69 (9/12/16)

I must admit, when i was on the stinkies, not even 2 shits were given about being considerate w.r.t my smoke annoying or affecting a non smoker... I dont know why i was like that...Ignorance is bliss i suppose... But since i have been vaping a few years, I've become very considerate... I do think its a good idea to regulate our own behavior, before its regulated FOR US... not only behavior, but also being responsible, e.g Not selling mech's to n00bs etc and properly educating the n00b and the inexperienced.. But a code of conduct might be damn near impossible to impose or to get out or even in a awareness program kinda way... unfortunately, there are and always will be ignorant vapers with no consideration and because of that, people in general judge a group by the bad, not the good.. for the most part anyway... as long as some politicians local and abroad, Big Tobacco and the advertising agencies regurgitate false information and fear mongering regarding vaping, there will be a large number of people that.... fear what they dont understand... lets hope there wont be a need for governance... mainly because i have a massive issue with authority

Reactions: Like 3


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## Lord Vetinari (9/12/16)

Andre said:


> For some people you have to word common sense, unfortunately. As simple as possible.


Touche. But you might as well speak to them in Sanskrit...

Reactions: Like 1


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## RichJB (9/12/16)

Raindance said:


> The facts are however that if we do not regulate our own behaviour, someone else will.



I think that will happen anyway. There is one faction of the vaping community that is very considerate of non-smokers/vapers, another that feels that confronting and antagonising the rest of society is the way to go. Skiddlz related the anecdote on one of Wayne's podcasts about a bunch of vapers who pitched up to a Congressional hearing on vaping regulations and blew clouds at the Senators as they entered the venue. These guys probably think that they're fighting the good fight. But as long as they persist, it is certain that officialdom and the non-smoking public will take a dim view of vaping.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 1 | Can relate 1


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## jpzx12rturbo (10/12/16)

Andre said:


> For some people you have to word common sense, unfortunately. As simple as possible.



THIS....is unfortunately the sad truth!
Common sense these days are as scarce as an honest politician.

Reactions: Funny 2 | Can relate 1


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## Raindance (11/12/16)

jpzx12rturbo said:


> THIS....is unfortunately the sad truth!
> Common sense these days are as scarce as an honest politician.
> 
> View attachment 78224



I have a friend whom on the name plate on his door had "CS" added after his name. If anyone enquired as to what kind of qualification that was, he would reply "Common sense". With what is happening in our universities lately it seems they no longer offer that course.

Regards

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Christos (22/12/16)

I was just shopping at a mall a few moments ago getting lego for my kid when some arrogant chop was vaping outside the toy store in a closed shop.

Being a vaper I understand it's not a terrible thing etc etc but I personally think it was rude and highly irresponsible. 

Outside a toy store full of kids in open view is being a plain turd.

Guys like this are going to ruin it for vapers at large.

Reactions: Agree 3


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## Lukeness (22/12/16)

The rules: 
Don't be a doos.
The end.

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## Lukeness (22/12/16)

Christos said:


> I was just shopping at a mall a few moments ago getting lego for my kid when some arrogant chop was vaping outside the toy store in a closed shop.
> 
> Being a vaper I understand it's not a terrible thing etc etc but I personally think it was rude and highly irresponsible.
> 
> ...



I don't think he was being a chop. You can't blame him for other people's lack of knowledge. He probably thought he was being considerate by doing it outside the shop.


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## mavric69 (22/12/16)

Lukeness said:


> I don't think he was being a chop. You can't blame him for other people's lack of knowledge. He probably thought he was being considerate by doing it outside the shop.



Lack of knowledge has nothing to do with consideration though. I know vaping is MUCH safer than smoking cigs, esp near and around kids, but i still wont sit in the car with my kids and vape.. and i wouldn't vape around other kids as well. Less negative impressions surrounding 'our culture' is always a good thing, regardless of the ignorance of non vapers

Reactions: Agree 2


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## foGGyrEader (22/12/16)



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## RichJB (22/12/16)

Suddenly I'm not that lus for FW Eggnog anymore.

Reactions: Like 1 | Funny 2


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## Raindance (22/12/16)

foGGyrEader said:


>




Think I made that juice once...

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## Waine (23/12/16)

So here is the irony for me. In my Shopping mall it's ok for people to test out their new Twisps at the famous Twisp kiosk, which is in the middle of the closed mall. Management and customers are fully aware of this. I am waiting for the first person to challenge me in our mall about vaping inside. I will tell him or her to please accompany me to the Twisp kiosk and ask why are they not challenging that?

Secondly, in the "olden days,"everyone smoked everywhere. But even back then you had the etiquette to not blow your smoke in someone's face, or suck a cigar so that the whole shop got blurry. Same rules apply with vaping now. Have manners if you vape inside a building.

I vape inside shops, and restaurants but discreetly and considerately.


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Reactions: Like 2 | Winner 1


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