# Mech queries (advanced)



## Scissorhands (28/6/17)

Good day ladies and gents!

This is a space for mech user's to question/discuss/answer anything mech related, from basic maintenance, pro tips to personal experiences, anything goes

I would like this thread to be more technical/educational as opposed to product/clone related if possible

Ill kick this off with 2 questions

1) Would i be correct to assume that a mods volt drop is due to the mods own resistance in the circuit

eg. If i know a mod is putting out 3.7v on a fresh battery (4.2v) with a 0.2 ohm coil, i will in fact pull a max 18.5 amps, not 21 amps . The mod will have a resistance of roughly 0.027 ohms (please correct me if my understanding is flawed)

2) what product/s do you use on your aluminium,gold, brass and copper contacts to avoid arching/pitting/carbon build up

I hope that made sense
Best regards

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## Cespian (28/6/17)

First of all, I think its necessary to define what a mech mod actually is. I see way too many people referring to their Noisy V2 Mech or Tesla Invader Mech. 

A mechanical mod has absolutely no circuitry. As in Nada. no protection, no control, nothing. These devices generally cleverly break (and close) the circuit by means of a switchable contact plate between the negative of the battery and chassis of the device. In saying that, the chassis forms the ground/negative portion of the circuit (in laymens terms), and the positive is delivered straight to the 510 pin of your atty (either direct AKA hybrid, or an intermediary pin between the battery and 510 pin on your atomiser. Voltage/Power/Current is controlled by ohms law (the coil build in your atomiser).

Once you start finding electronic components between your batteries, chassis and 510 connector, you are treading into the "Unregulated" or "Regulated" world. This is beyond the scope of this thread so I will defer from explaining this further. 

My attempt to answer your questions @Scissorhands :

1. Voltage drop in a mech is due to amount of material used. Simplify this a bit... consider using 2 PVC pipes, both connected to identical water taps, but the one is 1 meter long and the other is 10 meters long... you open the taps at the same time, which pipe does the water come out first? 

2. I generally stick to copper, for conductivity, durability and affordability. To keep clean, I use a fine grit sandpaper or a blade and gently scrape off any build up. I know that there are probably better methods, but this works for me.

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## GerritVisagie (28/6/17)

GREAT IDEA FOR A TREAD!Love it. my answers here would be as follows. 

Regarding voltage drop, the general consensus of my research points to this. 
The resistance of a tube mech, made of copper, is generally so low, it's almost nothing. The issue, is the internal resistance of the battery. 

And secondly, I found to keep contacts clean, an eraser works great, but to really clean it, a blade to scrape off build up, and the the old vinegar & hot water bath. 


Sent from my iPhone 7+ using Tapatalk

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## Scissorhands (28/6/17)

Thanks for your response @Cespian , I agree with your definition, and yes vendors market unregulated devices as mechs . . . Wich is misleading

1) i understand your analogy in terms of "a shorter path will generate less resistance" but more material could aid in conductivity between point A and B if the distance between A and b remain the same (eg. 20awg vs 32awg)

But still believe other factors are larger contributers like the surface area between contact poins in the switch/button as this would be a choke point

(Please know that none of this is fact, just my understanding, wich i hope someone would improve/correct, to better my understanding)

Regards

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## Andre (28/6/17)

I clean my contact with a white eraser, followed by an alcohol pad. Thereafter some Deoxit Gold gets applied. If the eraser and alcohol do not get it clean, I use those 4 step nail buffers, followed by alcohol pad and Deoxit Gold.

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## Scissorhands (28/6/17)

Thanks @Andre ! Thats the answer i was looking for, i assume deoxit gold would be something to look for in electronic/repair places?

@GerritVisagie i enjoy the presence and enthusiasm in your posts, glad to see you here

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## GerritVisagie (28/6/17)

Scissorhands said:


> Thanks @Andre ! Thats the answer i was looking for, i assume deoxit gold would be something to look for in electronic/repair places?
> 
> @GerritVisagie i enjoy the presence and enthusiasm in your posts, glad to see you here



Ha ha. 
Thanx. 
I love learning more and more about mechs. 


Sent from my iPhone 7+ using Tapatalk

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## CeeJay (28/6/17)

I'm relatively new to Mech Mods, being an electrician I understand the ins and outs, possibly what made me love them more than regulated mods. If possible could you guys add pics of your setups, Clone/Authentic and HE/LE it doesn't matter. Looking at getting myself a decent mod, something solid. Would like some of your opinions.

That aside, for cleaning and polishing purposes I've ordered myself https://m.fasttech.com/p/7462700 will review it once I receive it. 

Material wise I'm not fond of the copper odour so I will always choose SS over copper.

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## CeeJay (28/6/17)

It's quite long and not in HD but a cool real world experiment. On the copper vs brass and SS mod material. Does volt drop and power readings.

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## Andre (28/6/17)

Scissorhands said:


> Thanks @Andre ! Thats the answer i was looking for, i assume deoxit gold would be something to look for in electronic/repair places?
> 
> @GerritVisagie i enjoy the presence and enthusiasm in your posts, glad to see you here


Not sure if Deoxit Gold is available locally (mine was imported via the good graces of @Rob Fisher), but I am sure those shops should be able to point you to suitable alternatives. I know in the Reoville forum they mentioned some, but cannot remember the names.

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## Scissorhands (28/6/17)

CeeJay said:


> I'm relatively new to Mech Mods, being an electrician I understand the ins and outs, possibly what made me love them more than regulated mods. If possible could you guys add pics of your setups, Clone/Authentic and HE/LE it doesn't matter. Looking at getting myself a decent mod, something solid. Would like some of your opinions.
> 
> That aside, for cleaning and polishing purposes I've ordered myself https://m.fasttech.com/p/7462700 will review it once I receive it.
> 
> Material wise I'm not fond of the copper odour so I will always choose SS over copper.



Im also not too fond of copper, living on a coast line (salty humid air & sweaty hands) doesn't help

As requested , i know, terrible lighting




And as i mentioned in the OP i dont want this thread to be centered around products but i make a terrible policeman and i do like eye candy

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## Mr_Puffs (28/6/17)

Hey guys.

Regarding the whole voltage drop debate (in tube mechs that is), the material used in the tube of a mech doesn't matter at all to be honest. Where voltage drop plays the biggest role is in die button and threads of your mech. For example, let's say you have a mech which has a removeable button and 4 tubes which are all similiar but one which is SS, Ti, Copper and Brass. If all of them are identical in wall width and length overall each one would hit as hard as the next with a tiny bit more voltage drop on the SS tube, but not really enough to notice. Mooch did a very detailed bit on this subject and I have found it to be true. I always thought that I would only use copper mechs as they are the hardest hitters right? Except for a full silver mech. Yet I have used mechs now which have been all different metals and the ones that have hit the hardest are ones with proper copper buttons or brass buttons with copper pins, regardless of the tube material. I have a full brass able with a copper pin and brass button which hits extremely hard, yet a friend of mine has a titanium comp lyfe predator with a brass button which hits harder even though it is made of titanium which is less conductive. Reason being the quality of the button and thickness of the walls of the tube. Thus eliminating the need for a messy and extremely fast tarnishing copper tube. Hope that adds some insight to common beliefs centred around mechs..

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## spiv (28/6/17)

Re voltage drop. If the voltage drops between the battery and my coil, what is being drained from my battery? The 4.2v of the battery or the 4.0v that's reaching the coil (hypothetical numbers)?

If it's the 4.0v that's reaching the coil, would it also apply to the amps the battery is putting out? The formula says yes, but I ask stupid questions.

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## Bearshare (29/6/17)

guys can you see from the pics attached if this is original or not VTC 4 for R100(i know to get to be true......)


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## Scissorhands (29/6/17)

Bearshare said:


> guys can you see from the pics attached if this is original or not VTC 4 for R100(i know to get to be true......)
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Wich vendor/retailer?

That price would be competing with large American electronic retailers . . . Wich is impossible locally

And it can be virtually impossible to tell clone from authentic evin with an authentic side by side


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## Bearshare (29/6/17)

Scissorhands said:


> Wich vendor/retailer?
> 
> That price would be competing with large American electronic retailers . . . Wich is impossible locally
> 
> And it can be virtually impossible to tell clone from authentic evin with an authentic side by side



Its actually cheap http://www.illumn.com/batteries-cha...8650vtc4-2100mah-high-discharge-flat-top.html

getting it here is expensive

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## Bearshare (29/6/17)




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## Scissorhands (29/6/17)

Bearshare said:


> Its actually cheap http://www.illumn.com/batteries-cha...8650vtc4-2100mah-high-discharge-flat-top.html
> 
> getting it here is expensive



Trusted vendor, They legit bud

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## Kuhlkatz (30/6/17)

spiv said:


> Re voltage drop. If the voltage drops between the battery and my coil, what is being drained from my battery? The 4.2v of the battery or the 4.0v that's reaching the coil (hypothetical numbers)?
> 
> If it's the 4.0v that's reaching the coil, would it also apply to the amps the battery is putting out? The formula says yes, but I ask stupid questions.



Actually the 4.2v, but there are other factors to consider. Keep in mind that the complete circuit is made up of the battery and all of the parts that make up the load circuit. If there is a voltage drop, it is due to resistance in components between the battery and the coil - battery contacts, springs, connector pins, switches etc. They all form part of the total series circuit that 'loads' the battery. 
The actual load on the battery will depend on the overall resistance of your coil AND all of the components. If your coil is 0.25 ohm and all the components together adds up to another 0.01 ohms, the circuit will thus only deliver as if the coil is a 0.26 ohm build on a 4.2v battery. This is using your hypothetical values of 4.2v and 4.0v.
So, instead of a 70.56 Watt vape, you will effectively vape a 67.85 Watt build and the current draw would be 16.15A instead of 16.8A.

You can use a voltage divider calculator such as http://www.calculatoredge.com/electronics/voltage divide.htm and plug in our known values of Vin = 4.2v, Vout across the coil = 4.0v and the Coil itself is Rb @ 0.25 ohm. Ra calculated would then be the 0.01 ohm that is the sum of the rest of the 'whacky' mech and atty parts that refuse to play ball.

A hefty perceived voltage drop could also be due to ageing batteries and a sag in voltage due to higher internal resistance when the load increases - e.g. they might measure around 4.2v fresh off a charger, but as soon as they are loaded, the output actually drops to 4.0v ( also a hypothetical example )

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## Silver (30/6/17)

Hi @Scissorhands , great thread

I will also try answer your questions and add some further comments:

Regarding volt drop, the way I understand it is along the lines of what @Kuhlkatz so greatly explained above. Its not just the resistance of the mod itself but also the internal resistance of the battery AND the coil you put in. A much lower resistance coil will lead to a higher measured voltage drop under load at the posts than a higher resistance coil, all else being equal. 

I tested the volt drop of my Reos a while back under load and found that the volt drop tends to be around 0.2V with a 1 ohm coil. I.e. If the battery voltage was 4.1V, then the voltage at the posts while pressing the fire button was 3.9V. Not easy to do it with two hands because the probes need to be firm on the posts and then you need to fire it 

As for your second question about something to help with arcing and pitting, i am using dielectric grease. @Alex got it for us at a supplier somewhere in the East Rand I think. He got a whole tub/can of it. He thrn gave me a large syringe full about 2 years ago and i have only used about 1/10th of the syringe! I put a tiny tiny amount of it on the battery positive terminal and spread it out with the sharp point of a toothpick. And i do the same on the positive pin that makes contact with the battery. It stays on there for a long time, only needs more once in a while.

From time to time I also do what @Andre recommended above, using a white rubber eraser and also wipe with rubbing alcohol. 

I havent had any problems with major pitting (at least not that I can see with the naked eye) and my Reos are still firing very nicely 3 years on, so they must still be ok. But then again, i dont go very low on the resistance so am not overly stressing things. My lowest usable build on my Reos is about 0.4 to 0.5 ohms. So thats drawing only about 8-10 amps.

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## spiv (30/6/17)

Kuhlkatz said:


> Actually the 4.2v, but there are other factors to consider. Keep in mind that the complete circuit is made up of the battery and all of the parts that make up the load circuit. If there is a voltage drop, it is due to resistance in components between the battery and the coil - battery contacts, springs, connector pins, switches etc. They all form part of the total series circuit that 'loads' the battery.
> The actual load on the battery will depend on the overall resistance of your coil AND all of the components. If your coil is 0.25 ohm and all the components together adds up to another 0.01 ohms, the circuit will thus only deliver as if the coil is a 0.26 ohm build on a 4.2v battery. This is using your hypothetical values of 4.2v and 4.0v.
> So, instead of a 70.56 Watt vape, you will effectively vape a 67.85 Watt build and the current draw would be 16.15A instead of 16.8A.
> 
> ...



Thanks! This makes so much sense.


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## GerritVisagie (12/7/17)

So, I know the whole cleaning and polishing question has come up a couple of times. 
Just came across this
http://www.vandyvape.com/detail/Accessories/36

Hope the link works. 
I want one


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## Rob Fisher (12/7/17)

Mod Maker UK makes one as well.


http://www.modmaker.co.uk/MM-Polishing-Rig

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## stephen.johnson2 (12/7/17)

I have a Karma Mech Tube with Sony VT5 and placed 2 stapled coils in as below

It is coming out at .19ohm and not firing......should it fire?


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## Scissorhands (12/7/17)

stephen.johnson2 said:


> I have a Karma Mech Tube with Sony VT5 and placed 2 stapled coils in as below
> 
> It is coming out at .19ohm and not firing......should it fire?
> 
> View attachment 100971


A VTC5 is rated at 20 amp continuous, assuming you are getting 3.7V you will be drawing 19.4 amps, personally that is a little close for my comfort.

But to answer your question, a mech should fire anything you throw at it, there's no safety

Are you using the Karma RDTA?


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## stephen.johnson2 (12/7/17)

Scissorhands said:


> A VTC5 is rated at 20 amp continuous, assuming you are getting 3.7V you will be drawing 19.4 amps, personally that is a little close for my comfort.
> 
> But to answer your question, a mech should fire anything you throw at it, there's no safety
> 
> Are you using the Karma RDTA?



Thanks

Does this chart below look correct to what i am doing? (did i put the resistance in correctly?)

Appreciate the help


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## DoubleD (12/7/17)

stephen.johnson2 said:


> Thanks
> 
> Does this chart below look correct to what i am doing? (did i put the resistance in correctly?)
> 
> ...



Your coil is 0.19 and in the chart you put in 1.9.. 
You kinda want to be spot on when it comes to resistances and mech mods..;

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## RichJB (12/7/17)

Resistance should read 0.19Ω not 1.9Ω

Edit: what @DoubleD said ^^^.

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## stephen.johnson2 (12/7/17)

DoubleD said:


> Your coil is 0.19 and in the chart you put in 1.9..
> You kinda want to be spot on when it comes to resistances and mech mods..;



Thanks, appreciate it....now i gotta figure out why the firing is so erratic......1 in every 10-15 button presses


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## spiv (12/7/17)

Also, don't go by the amp limits preset there. 
Rather use Mooch's tests as safe amp limits here https://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/f...ngs-picking-a-safe-battery-to-vape-with.7447/

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## stephen.johnson2 (12/7/17)

wowser...now i


spiv said:


> Also, don't go by the amp limits preset there.
> Rather use Mooch's tests as safe amp limits here https://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/f...ngs-picking-a-safe-battery-to-vape-with.7447/



wowser now im confused as f&*K

The reputable Vape Store where i bought my VTC5 said that it can easily handle 0.1, they even said 0.08 should be fine...this calculation says it can barely go below 0.19....


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## DoubleD (12/7/17)

stephen.johnson2 said:


> Thanks, appreciate it....now i gotta figure out why the firing is so erratic......1 in every 10-15 button presses



1.Take the battery out the mod
2.Unscrew RDA/TA and test on ohm reader with cap on. Make sure the resistances is reading fine, no shorts.
3.Check the mods contacts, if they are not clean, you've got work to do lol Use a tiny bit of petroleum jelly on the contacts to help prevent arcing.



On a side note: You should try some simple builds using normal round wire, I like to refer to them as KISS coils, it may not be all fancy pants like framed staple rhinoceroses but it may surprise you, they vape fantastically and they are great for mech mods because they have less wire to heat up which means you save energy, which means you vape more on the same battery. win win

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## spiv (12/7/17)

stephen.johnson2 said:


> wowser...now i
> 
> 
> wowser now im confused as f&*K
> ...



Some guys push their batteries but the chance of it venting increases a lot when you go lower. 
Honestly, I've never gone below 0.22 on a mech. I'm sure there are guys here who can explain how you can go lower with an 18650 battery

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## Greyz (12/7/17)

stephen.johnson2 said:


> wowser...now i
> 
> 
> wowser now im confused as f&*K
> ...



I wouldn't run a 0.08ohm build on my VTC4's let alone VTC5's..... You received some very irresponsible advise from that store IMO

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## GerritVisagie (12/7/17)

stephen.johnson2 said:


> I have a Karma Mech Tube with Sony VT5 and placed 2 stapled coils in as below
> 
> It is coming out at .19ohm and not firing......should it fire?
> 
> View attachment 100971


anytime you get a mech not firing, press the button centre and harder, if that does not work, RED FLAG!!
Something is either shorting out, or not making contact (Hope for the latter here).

pull everything apart, and check everything, and remember ALWAYS put your atty on first, then the battery and then the button assembly, if you put the atty on last, you could dent your battery top.

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## 87hunter (14/11/17)

Loving this thread!
Thank you.

On an impulse I bought an Athena today. It will be my first mech mod - so a lot was learned in reading this thread.
I bought a 30Q battery with it, my other 30Q's are married in an alien and I have married LG chocs in my voopoo.
My main worry is how do I know when the battery should be charged?
Do you vape until it just turns off?

Cheers

@stephen.johnson2 where did you find that calculator?

Just to add, I feel I have a good grip of ohms law

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## Halfdaft (14/11/17)

87hunter said:


> Loving this thread!
> Thank you.
> 
> On an impulse I bought an Athena today. It will be my first mech mod - so a lot was learned in reading this thread.
> ...


Short answer: No
Long answer: Nooooooooooooooooo please don't do that.
When vaping you'll feel the mod will get a bit weaker, that's when you stop. Or as a rule of thumb, no chain vaping and use it for a maximum of about 30 minutes. This unfortunately is all build dependant. Another thing to remember is that mech mods have no safety features, so maybe do a bit of research before using it so that you're absolutely prepared, there is a wealth of information out there.

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## Stosta (14/11/17)

87hunter said:


> Loving this thread!
> Thank you.
> 
> On an impulse I bought an Athena today. It will be my first mech mod - so a lot was learned in reading this thread.
> ...


As @Halfdaft Customs said, you will notice when the quality (and quantity) of the vape drops.

When I started on Mechs I was terrified of over-discharging a battery, and would check often. However, after one or two batteries worth of vaping you definitely can notice. On the REO I pick it up at about 3.9 volts, but it is on a high build (around 0.9 ohms), but I'm sure you'll notice on a lower build too. I feel that as long as you're actively thinking about it the first couple of times and checking, you'll find out.

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## Halfdaft (14/11/17)

Rather exercise extra caution while you're still getting a feel for mech mods.

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## 87hunter (14/11/17)

Thanks guys!
Rather err on the side of caution.
I only really intend on using this mod at night when chilling.
looking forward to learning with it

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## Halfdaft (14/11/17)

87hunter said:


> Thanks guys!
> Rather err on the side of caution.
> I only really intend on using this mod at night when chilling.
> looking forward to learning with it


Hope you have many happy vapes with it bud

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## Scissorhands (14/11/17)

87hunter said:


> Loving this thread!
> Thank you.
> 
> On an impulse I bought an Athena today. It will be my first mech mod - so a lot was learned in reading this thread.
> ...



Yo bro, welcome to the fantastic world of mech squonking

Rule one: ask questions, especially dumb ones
Rule two: listen to advice
Rule three: respect mechs 

With mech squonkers I would advise 1 bottle per battery, you should feel the difference from start to finish, usually after 6 - 7ml the vape is less than desirable 

IMO 30Qs are best suited for single coil 0.27 - 0.30 ohm or higher

Oh and I wouldn't stress too much about over discharging, I have never been able to discharge a cell on a mech as low as my reg mods do

Kind regards

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## Halfdaft (14/11/17)

Scissorhands said:


> Yo bro, welcome to the fantastic world of mech squonking
> 
> Rule one: ask questions, especially dumb ones
> Rule two: listen to advice
> ...


The only problem is that you can discharge it lower if you keep using it

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## Scissorhands (14/11/17)

Halfdaft Customs said:


> The only problem is that you can discharge it lower if you keep using it



100% true , but in my experience its highly unlikely if you stick to 1 bottle per cell

With 3000 mah cells I run 0.2 ohm (Ijoy 20700) to 0.4 (LG turds) , after 7.5ml a reg mod reads the cells at roughly 60%+ (I forget the volt reading)

I wouldn't recommend trying to push another bottle as the vape will be anemic and run the risk of over discharging

I feel 99.9% of mech users remove there cells at a higher voltage than Reg users

Just my experience/opinion
Kind regars

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## antonherbst (14/11/17)

As @Scissorhands has said

Ask dumb qeustions. 

I have one and i get confused about it. 

Would i be correct to understand that 0,1 = high(higer resistance) ohm coil and 0,9 would be a low(low resistance) ohm coil?

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## antonherbst (14/11/17)

Oh and how do i measure mah on a multimeter? Is it possible or should i just pop the batteries into a charger to see?


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## Andre (14/11/17)

antonherbst said:


> As @Scissorhands has said
> 
> Ask dumb qeustions.
> 
> ...


No, the other way around.
And I agree with @Scissorhands - the vape will become anemic before the battery is discharged too low.

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## antonherbst (14/11/17)

Andre said:


> No, the other way around.
> And I agree with @Scissorhands - the vape will become anemic before the battery is discharged too low.



I have felt that in the vape and that is when i swop over to an other mod or battery.

Thanks Andre


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## antonherbst (14/11/17)

Andre said:


> No, the other way around.
> And I agree with @Scissorhands - the vape will become anemic before the battery is discharged too low.



Oh and on that the drop in vape is due to the mah being low and can not supply the amps reqiired and as a result the volts drop on the battery?


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## Scissorhands (14/11/17)

antonherbst said:


> Oh and on that the drop in vape is due to the mah being low and can not supply the amps reqiired and as a result the volts drop on the battery?



The drop in vape is due to the drop in voltage, mah is related to the physical capacity (the amount of goo in the cell) where amp limit is related to the gauge or thickness of the inner walls , they both take physical space , that's why one is sacrificed for the other

A higher mah cell usually has a higher internal resistance (compared to a high amp cell) due to the thinner internal walls giving you a higher volt drop from the start but should have a longer run time as the high amp cell will drop off before the high mah cell ( this all depends on the load (ohms)) 

Please forgive my terrible terminology but that's my understanding

I'm sure someone with a tech background could correct nd polish my understanding

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## Halfdaft (14/11/17)

Scissorhands said:


> Yo bro, welcome to the fantastic world of mech squonking
> 
> Rule one: ask questions, especially dumb ones
> Rule two: listen to advice
> ...


The only problem is that you can discharge it lower if you keep using it


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## Andre (14/11/17)

Halfdaft Customs said:


> The only problem is that you can discharge it lower if you keep using it


Some say 2.5V, some say 2.7V is a safe cut off point. Whichever applies, I do not think you will be getting any proper vape below 3V. For me, below 3.3V it feels like sucking air - and at 0.8 ohms that is.

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## Silver (14/11/17)

Andre said:


> Some say 2.5V, some say 2.7V is a safe cut off point. Whichever applies, I do not think you will be getting any proper vape below 3V. For me, below 3.3V it feels like sucking air - and at 0.8 ohms that is.



Agree with you @Andre 
Even at 3.5V the vape feels way too light.
When i take out my batts on the Reo they were almost always at 3.5 to 3.7V
Not easy on my setups to get it anywhere close to 2.5V

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## Clouds4Days (14/11/17)

Silver said:


> Agree with you @Andre
> Even at 3.5V the vape feels way too light.
> When i take out my batts on the Reo they were almost always at 3.5 to 3.7V
> Not easy on my setups to get it anywhere close to 2.5V



Im same as you @Silver between 3.6v and 3.7v there is a massive diffrence compared to a fresh charged battery.

Lowest i think ive ever run a battery down on a mech is 3.5v

Reactions: Like 3 | Agree 1


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## kev mac (15/11/17)

Scissorhands said:


> 100% true , but in my experience its highly unlikely if you stick to 1 bottle per cell
> 
> With 3000 mah cells I run 0.2 ohm (Ijoy 20700) to 0.4 (LG turds) , after 7.5ml a reg mod reads the cells at roughly 60%+ (I forget the volt reading)
> 
> ...


To reiterate what's been said, when your hit becomes unsatisfactory it's time to re up the cell.

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## Spyro (15/11/17)

Forgive me for posting this here if it's not the correct thread. And again apologies for the stupid question but as this is my first mech I'd like to be totally sure before I do anything and someone did point out to ask stupid questions. Here goes...

I wanted to know everyone's thoughts on running the OBS engine nano on a mech. I've seen it done on vape reviews and Reddit posts about it being done. I personally see no issue with this. The 510 protrudes (Not running a hybrid anyway) the post-coil connections are solid as anything so no fear of slipping coils and shorting. I run very low wattage builds 25-40w on a .4-.5 So I'm not worried about melting the insulator and that shorting out either.

I know there are guys who say don't run RTAs on mechs. I see the reasoning if you're running subohm tanks as those factory coils can short easily. But I can't come up with a reason why the RTAs of today would ever be a problem with regular safety checks.

Just wanted to make sure I'm holding a vape and not a grenade.

Thanks to everyone. If this isn't an advanced vape question then someone please point it out and I'll move/delete it.

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## Scissorhands (15/11/17)

Spyro said:


> Forgive me for posting this here if it's not the correct thread. And again apologies for the stupid question but as this is my first mech I'd like to be totally sure before I do anything and someone did point out to ask stupid questions. Here goes...
> 
> I wanted to know everyone's thoughts on running the OBS engine nano on a mech. I've seen it done on vape reviews and Reddit posts about it being done. I personally see no issue with this. The 510 protrudes (Not running a hybrid anyway) the post-coil connections are solid as anything so no fear of slipping coils and shorting. I run very low wattage builds 25-40w on a .4-.5 So I'm not worried about melting the insulator and that shorting out either.
> 
> ...



Yo bud, all questions are good questions when it comes to mechs, sometimes stupid questions can have complicated answers

So here's my attempt to answer your question through my experience

Short answer : yes iv done it but not ideal

Long answer : I'm not familiar with your set up but if the atties 510 pin is solid , non hybrid preferably and you are confident nothing can distort it will work 

Bare in mind your build and wick is key,generally RTAs are not as forgiving as RDAs (you can't saturate your wick manually or fine tune your power output nor keep it constant)

It might take a couple builds to get it perfect and even then expect poor battery life

As always be responsible and proceed with caution

Lastly I don't recommend RTAs on mechs , a genesis style RDTA like the wasp RDTA should be better suited for your application

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## Spyro (15/11/17)

Hey @Scissorhands thanks for the reply!


Scissorhands said:


> I'm not familiar with your set up but if the atties 510 pin is solid , non hybrid preferably and you are confident nothing can distort it will work


Ooooh
Running a relatively cheap Chinese Stabwood squonk box. The 510 is of adequate quality (IMO).

Still though, I don't understand why it's not ideal? It's a single coil so battery life should be better than a dual? Strangely and I do mean STRANGELY, I find that I can chain vape 6-8 hits on the engine with out dry hits. So that's no issue for me. With a single battery device 3 battery changes a day is relatively normal for me. But I'm yet to try the mech mod so maybe it'll be different?

Side note: Hadaly on the way. But for my application I'd rather ditch the mech than the RTA.


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## antonherbst (16/2/18)

I need help and guidance. I want to use the merlin mini rta on my tube mech mod. What would i have to take into consideration when i coil and wick the rta and when i setup the tube? 

No battery installed. Only for purpose of the photo. 

Any help and “uitkak” would be taken like a man as i a just curious if it will work.


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## GregF (16/2/18)

antonherbst said:


> I need help and guidance. I want to use the merlin mini rta on my tube mech mod. What would i have to take into consideration when i coil and wick the rta and when i setup the tube?
> 
> No battery installed. Only for purpose of the photo.
> 
> Any help and “uitkak” would be taken like a man as i a just curious if it will work.


I cannot see why it would not work, providing you build a suitable coil for the battery and the centre pin on the tank 510 sticks out enough not to short on the mech.

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## Hallucinated_ (16/2/18)

Agreed, as long as you have a protruding 510 pin then all should be good.
What i like to do when building like this for a mech, is after you have your coil installed. Dry burn it with the whole rta assembled on a reg mod to make sure there are no shorts against the chimney or what not

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## Carnival (19/2/18)

Hey guys. Haven't received my setup yet, but just working things out using the Sony VTC4 batts with a 0.3ohms coil from http://www.steam-engine.org/


If I'm not mistaken I could build at 0.2ohms using this battery, which would come out at 21A (well within the Amp limit of 30A) but for now I'd like to keep it at 0.3ohms. Now, it says that with the above settings, it will give me around 7 hours of battery life. I'd like to say 5 hours (just to be safe) and then change the battery. Will this be acceptable to do? Do I need to check the battery volts every now and again during those 5 hours, or can I safely vape for that amount of time before changing out the battery?


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## Stosta (19/2/18)

Carnival said:


> Hey guys. Haven't received my setup yet, but just working things out using the Sony VTC4 batts with a 0.3ohms coil from http://www.steam-engine.org/
> 
> View attachment 122897
> If I'm not mistaken I could build at 0.2ohms using this battery, which would come out at 21A (well within the Amp limit of 30A) but for now I'd like to keep it at 0.3ohms. Now, it says that with the above settings, it will give me around 7 hours of battery life. I'd like to say 5 hours (just to be safe) and then change the battery. Will this be acceptable to do? Do I need to check the battery volts every now and again during those 5 hours, or can I safely vape for that amount of time before changing out the battery?


To make sure I'm always safe I never build below a 20% Amp Headroom (shown under "Amp Limit" there).

You don't need to check the voltage all the time. By the time your battery gets to around 3.7 your vape will become so weak it will be very noticeable. I usually start noticing the need for a fresh battery around 3.9V. As long as you don't keep on trying to vape it when it's weak you'll be fine.

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## RayDeny (19/2/18)

Carnival said:


> Hey guys. Haven't received my setup yet, but just working things out using the Sony VTC4 batts with a 0.3ohms coil from http://www.steam-engine.org/
> 
> View attachment 122897
> If I'm not mistaken I could build at 0.2ohms using this battery, which would come out at 21A (well within the Amp limit of 30A) but for now I'd like to keep it at 0.3ohms. Now, it says that with the above settings, it will give me around 7 hours of battery life. I'd like to say 5 hours (just to be safe) and then change the battery. Will this be acceptable to do? Do I need to check the battery volts every now and again during those 5 hours, or can I safely vape for that amount of time before changing out the battery?



Definitely start off at 0.3 Ohms and work your way down if needed. You might just find that you like the vape at 0.3 more then lower.
I would not take the hour life to heart on steam engine, there are way to many factors ie. heat generated in the battery its self. With a Mech at 0.2 to 0.3 Ohms you will notice the drop in power as the battery sags, its clear as day. As soon as you notice the sag, swap out batteries with a fresh one and measure the one you pulled out. This will help for down the road as you can then through experience gestamate the V through the vape experience. 

I use VTC4’s in all my tubes and run a 0.2 coil, love the vape experience i get form it and have no need to lower the ohms. Saying that, i walk around with three spare batteries as they do not last.

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## Carnival (19/2/18)

Great feedback, thank you @Stosta and @RayDeny


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## Carnival (20/2/18)

Got another question:

Is it possible to overcharge your battery? (using a Nitecore charger) 

If so, what's the best way to bring down the voltage so one can safely use it in a mech?


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## Stosta (20/2/18)

Carnival said:


> Got another question:
> 
> Is it possible to overcharge your battery? (using a Nitecore charger)
> 
> If so, what's the best way to bring down the voltage so one can safely use it in a mech?


If something were to go terribly wrong with the electronics I suppose it could happen, but essentially the answer is no you don't need to worry about that.

I have read somewhere not to take a freshly charged battery and throw it into a mech, and you should rather leave it standing for a few minutes first. Not sure as to the accuracy on that, but once I read it I can't un-read it and follow that practice.

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## Smoke_A_Llama (20/2/18)

Stosta said:


> If something were to go terribly wrong with the electronics I suppose it could happen, but essentially the answer is no you don't need to worry about that.
> 
> I have read somewhere not to take a freshly charged battery and throw it into a mech, and you should rather leave it standing for a few minutes first. Not sure as to the accuracy on that, but once I read it I can't un-read it and follow that practice.



Theory should be that in case of over charge, leaving the battery for a while will give it time to naturally lose some of its charge dropping it down to safe levels ... how much it will lose in that time I actually have no idea, guess it's one of those tap a coke can on the top with your nail before opening it things

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## Carnival (20/2/18)

Stosta said:


> If something were to go terribly wrong with the electronics I suppose it could happen, but essentially the answer is no you don't need to worry about that.
> 
> I have read somewhere not to take a freshly charged battery and throw it into a mech, and you should rather leave it standing for a few minutes first. Not sure as to the accuracy on that, but once I read it I can't un-read it and follow that practice.



Thank you @Stosta 

Yes, I read the same thing. I first saw it in the "Scared to use my mech mod" thread and it definitely stuck with me as well. I believe Maxxis posted about letting the battery sit for 10 - 15mins before using it - https://www.ecigssa.co.za/scared-to-use-my-mech-mod.t34559/#post-502409
https://www.ecigssa.co.za/scared-to-use-my-mech-mod.t34559/#post-502409

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Stosta (20/2/18)

Carnival said:


> Thank you @Stosta
> 
> Yes, I read the same thing. I first saw it in the "Scared to use my mech mod" thread and it definitely stuck with me as well. I believe Maxxis posted about letting the battery sit for 10 - 15mins before using it - https://www.ecigssa.co.za/scared-to-use-my-mech-mod.t34559/#post-502409


That's the one!!

Reactions: Like 1


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## GerharddP (20/2/18)

Stosta said:


> If something were to go terribly wrong with the electronics I suppose it could happen, but essentially the answer is no you don't need to worry about that.
> 
> I have read somewhere not to take a freshly charged battery and throw it into a mech, and you should rather leave it standing for a few minutes first. Not sure as to the accuracy on that, but once I read it I can't un-read it and follow that practice.



Hi guys. Just some clarification here. A freshly charged battery has residual heat left over in its core from the charging process. Heat increases the electrical resistance of materials and the last thing you want in any mod, mech or reg is a high internal resistance of your battery. If the battery is hot and you drain it straight away it will get hotter and increase the resistance even further and so on. Leave your batts to cool down a bit before using them.

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## GerharddP (20/2/18)

Carnival said:


> Hey guys. Haven't received my setup yet, but just working things out using the Sony VTC4 batts with a 0.3ohms coil from http://www.steam-engine.org/
> 
> View attachment 122897
> If I'm not mistaken I could build at 0.2ohms using this battery, which would come out at 21A (well within the Amp limit of 30A) but for now I'd like to keep it at 0.3ohms. Now, it says that with the above settings, it will give me around 7 hours of battery life. I'd like to say 5 hours (just to be safe) and then change the battery. Will this be acceptable to do? Do I need to check the battery volts every now and again during those 5 hours, or can I safely vape for that amount of time before changing out the battery?



Never trust the "time limit" of a battery. These are man made things and are never the same unit for unit. No need to test the battery as Silver and Andre said you wont get any vape from the "normal" mech builds at the 2.5V kill switch voltage. In fact you more than likely will want to swap out at the cell at the 3.4V range as at that point it will feel very airy and weak.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Informative 2


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## Carnival (20/2/18)

Thank you for your replies here @GerharddP


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## GerharddP (20/2/18)

Carnival said:


> Thank you for your replies here @GerharddP


No worries mate. If you need help just give a shout and will help asap.

Reactions: Thanks 1


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## Raindance (20/2/18)

Just to illustrate the effect of voltage drop as a battery discharges.



Please calculate the amp draw of your build and do not rely on my calculations above, they only serve as a guide.

Regards

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## Scissorhands (20/2/18)

Raindance said:


> Just to illustrate the effect of voltage drop as a battery discharges.
> 
> View attachment 123229
> 
> ...


Thanks for this!

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## Hallucinated_ (21/2/18)

There is no need to let your batteries cool off after a fresh full charge imo. That was mayby the case back in the day where you did not have smart chargers. Same goes with your phone, they always say dont leave your phone in the charger over night. Have you had a phone explode in your face for leaving it on charge over night for 6-7 hours ? i dont think so.

im not saying leave your batteries in over night, all im saying is that the chargers out there today are much better. And you sure as hell dont need to leave your batteries to "cool" off after a fresh charge before you can use them, that is the most ridiculous things ive heard lol. except if the batteries is getting hot during a charge, that is the faulty charger then or faulty cell. not overcharging.

The most important thing is to not leave it unnatended, etc let it charge in your house while your away. something stupid like that. The same reason you wont leave an heating applience etc on unnatended, most likely it will be ok. But anything can happen.

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## Hallucinated_ (21/2/18)

Silver said:


> Agree with you @Andre
> Even at 3.5V the vape feels way too light.
> When i take out my batts on the Reo they were almost always at 3.5 to 3.7V
> Not easy on my setups to get it anywhere close to 2.5V



Agreed, even when running a 0.15 build on a mech. anything below 3.6/7v is unvapable for my taste.
I always have 2 batts in rotation, when mine hits below nominal voltage i swap it out and uses a fresh one.
When i remove the battery they are 57% drained each time.

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## GerharddP (21/2/18)

Hallucinated_ said:


> There is no need to let your batteries cool off after a fresh full charge imo. That was mayby the case back in the day where you did not have smart chargers. Same goes with your phone, they always say dont leave your phone in the charger over night. Have you had a phone explode in your face for leaving it on charge over night for 6-7 hours ? i dont think so.
> 
> im not saying leave your batteries in over night, all im saying is that the chargers out there today are much better. And you sure as hell dont need to leave your batteries to "cool" off after a fresh charge before you can use them, that is the most ridiculous things ive heard lol. except if the batteries is getting hot during a charge, that is the faulty charger then or faulty cell. not overcharging.
> 
> The most important thing is to not leave it unnatended, etc let it charge in your house while your away. something stupid like that. The same reason you wont leave an heating applience etc on unnatended, most likely it will be ok. But anything can happen.



Well have a read on this website : http://www.electronicdesign.com/boa...ng-li-ion-battery-charge-and-discharge-cycles

If you need more evidence ill post pics of temperature readings taken from cells while at rest and actively charging as well?

The point of the post was to assist a fellow vaper and to prevent a possible incident. There will ALWAYS be heat generated while electrochemical processes are happening regardless of "chargers out there today are much better" they still induce electron flow which WILL produce heat in any conductive element unless it is a superconductor.

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## Hallucinated_ (21/2/18)

GerharddP said:


> Well have a read on this website : http://www.electronicdesign.com/boa...ng-li-ion-battery-charge-and-discharge-cycles
> 
> If you need more evidence ill post pics of temperature readings taken from cells while at rest and actively charging as well?
> 
> The point of the post was to assist a fellow vaper and to prevent a possible incident. There will ALWAYS be heat generated while electrochemical processes are happening regardless of "chargers out there today are much better" they still induce electron flow which WILL produce heat in any conductive element unless it is a superconductor.



I apologise and withdraw my statement, i can see by your extraordinary google skills and the use of capital letters that you mean business. Keep on giving sound advise brother !

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## GerharddP (21/2/18)

Hallucinated_ said:


> I apologise and withdraw my statement, i can see by your extraordinary google skills and the use of capital letters that you mean business. Keep on giving sound advise brother !


Will do thanks mate.

By the way you forgot, its not just "google skills" its the 10+ years of working experience in the field of industrial electronics and heavy current electrical engineering.

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## Carnival (21/2/18)

GerharddP said:


> Will do thanks mate.
> 
> By the way you forgot, its not just "google skills" its the 10+ years of working experience in the field of industrial electronics and heavy current electrical engineering.



Glad that someone with your knowledge is part of the community here, thanks for the info in this thread it's appreciated!

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## Faiyaz Cheulkar (6/3/18)

Just read about vapesafe fuse for mech mods. Found a old thread about this too. I am not a mech user but was just curious to ask if anyone uses this ? 

https://www.ecigssa.co.za/how-to-insert-vapesafe-fuse-from-vapemob.t3629/


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## Spyro (29/3/18)

So I've been around the block and back with mech squonkers and they are not for me. Messy and I find they drain the battery very quickly and really don't give me a consistent vape. 

Just picked up my first hybrid tube and I'm very clued up with regards to safety now days. 

I watched a video of mooch where he said chances are 99-100% of mechs blow up due to user error and usually a battery short of sorts. He said that although he doesn't condone it at all, a 0.02ohm build probably wouldn't be the cause of a detonation. 

So I'm currently rocking Samsung 30s in my hybrid and building at 0.15ohms. 

That's around a 28amp draw on full charge according to the vape tools. In reality my regulated mod (firing at the alleged wattage that the mech is firing at due to the same calculations only pulls 24amps on the same settup. 

The max discharge rate of these bats are 20 continuous and 25 max pulse rate. 

I've been vaping steadily with this 0.15 on 30Qs and although the draw is higher Amp wise I am getting zero "side effects" my batteries get a tiny bit warm if I chain - only for 5-6 drags before I do a 1 minute break while I redrip. 

So the battery is slightly warm but by no means at all is it hot. Am I playing with fire over here? Yes I understand that there are safety guidelines in place but I know guys pulling 40A off of 30A batteries. 

Am I safe with the slight (allegedly 5-8A) overdraw of my batteries? I'm not chain vaping. And again, no hot batteries. 

It's a hybrid but I've covered all the usual safety checks... 510 pin, battery wraps, never leaving the mod in pocket or able to fire alone. 

Do we have any serious mech users here that can tell me from actual experience.

Because as it stands I feel like I have no reason to buy safer batteries other than the batteries having a shorter life cycle.

Thanks in advance 
S

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## Spyro (29/3/18)

Ps I'm not looking for " better safe than sorry" comments. I'm looking more for: that's way too dangerous stop now, monitor your batteries and you'll be good, actual real live experience. Because at this rate I feel like I'm safe and I have no desire to get new batteries unless totally mandatory. The mod is slightly warm but not hot by any means. Just want to know from actual real experience.

Again I've seen guess rocking 0.07 ohm builds on 25Rs for years without issues.

I don't really chain vape and my atty only allows for a few drags before a redrip


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## Clouds4Days (29/3/18)

Spyro said:


> Ps I'm not looking for " better safe than sorry" comments. I'm looking more for: that's way too dangerous stop now, monitor your batteries and you'll be good, actual real live experience. Because at this rate I feel like I'm safe and I have no desire to get new batteries unless totally mandatory. The mod is slightly warm but not hot by any means. Just want to know from actual real experience.
> 
> Again I've seen guess rocking 0.07 ohm builds on 25Rs for years without issues.
> 
> I don't really chain vape and my atty only allows for a few drags before a redrip



My personal opinion is use 25R and you will be fine. With 30Q i would say build up to about 0.2 and you should find your batteries will be cooler.

Also try stick to pulsing so short bursts of 2 to 3 second drags.

I dont want to say too much as after all we here to look out for one another and prevent as much as possible accidents from happening.

Just my lil disclaimer i usually leave so one day no one points fingers and says but clouds4days said it was fine.

@Spyro please also note the above stament are my personal views as stated above and by no means am i promoting my above statment but merely stating how i chose to vape on my tube mechs.

Battery safety should always come first and sticking to the manufacturer battery specs is the safest way to vape.

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## Scissorhands (30/3/18)

Spyro said:


> So I've been around the block and back with mech squonkers and they are not for me. Messy and I find they drain the battery very quickly and really don't give me a consistent vape.
> 
> Just picked up my first hybrid tube and I'm very clued up with regards to safety now days.
> 
> ...



Yo bud, I came to the conclusion that I COULD vape "on the fence" but the overall experience wasn't as satisfying as a well "tuned" set up

When I got into mechs @GerritVisagie told me not to skimp on high amp batteries, 110% true

This is my view and welcome anyone to correct me

A higher amp limit yields a lower "total circuit resistance" = less sag/harder hit (your cell's internal resistance and contact's resistance will effectively add to you coils resistance)

I hope that makes sense? I was pleasantly surprised when I switched from 18A 3000mah 18650 + aluminium to 30A 3000mah 20700 + silver

chain vape on a 0.2 , I feel no warmth on my cell

So, I have no motive to vape on the fence, rather fine tune

Peace

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## Hallucinated_ (30/3/18)

Spyro said:


> So I've been around the block and back with mech squonkers and they are not for me. Messy and I find they drain the battery very quickly and really don't give me a consistent vape.
> 
> Just picked up my first hybrid tube and I'm very clued up with regards to safety now days.
> 
> ...


Hey man, the discharge rate of 30's are 15 amps, not 20 amps.

Rather use 25r's much better internal ressitares imo. Just keep it mind when things ate heating up, rather let it cool down.

I have no problem using 25r's with 0.13 builds. After voltage drop and battery drain after the first hit, not much amps getting pulled.

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## Silver (30/3/18)

@Spyro it's probably ok at home in a controlled environment 

But the problem is if it gets stuck in an autofire position in your pocket for example while out and about. 

That's why the continuous max discharge rating is so important. To me at least.

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## Spyro (30/3/18)

@Silver @Hallucinated_ @Scissorhands @Clouds4Days

Thank you very much guys. I really appreciate all the detailed feedback!

Battery sag is one particular topic that I haven't done complete research in.
I only vape this thing at home or while in a relaxed sitting environment.

I never ever put any mod in my pocket under any circumstances.

Based on all of the lovely information you have supplied I'm going to continue using it as is until I get pass a shop to pick up some higher drain batteries.

My drags are never more than 2 seconds. 3 would be pushing it and I most certainly do not chain vape at these wattages. The vapour production provides no need to do so.

As stated before - the batteries never get much warmer than they do after being freshly pulled from the charger.

I'll pick up some 25Rs.

Thank you all very much again. I really can't explain how much your information means to me. It was all very informative and not the usual "you have to dumb****, because I say so" type info that I would have been given at the local BnM.

Much appreciated guys!

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## Tarquinj (30/3/18)

Hi guys and girls 

I'm new to the site so please have a bit of patiences with me

Okay so I was reading what @Spyro said about his batts, he uses 30q's and like he said he has been using 25r's on a 0.07 build.

What I would like to know isn't using vtc4's just the best option for a mech because I mean the batts were made for mechs? 

Personally I only use vtc4's because I get great hits off them and I know I can do a very low build on them and be safe (obviously making sure that my battery wraps are in great condition and doing any other safety precautions), I use to have a 0.1 build on my noisy v1 with a OG goon 22.

I'm honeslty not too clued up on my ohms law but at the same time I do know how to sort of do it if that makes sense , I sort of know how to build and stay were I am safe in regards to battery amps.

Another question of mine is what is the lowest I can build on a Ijoy 20700 for a broadside?, and I have a fused alien build in already which is reading at 0.1 ohms is that safe or should I just keep using my vtc4 for that?


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## Raindance (30/3/18)

Spyro said:


> So I've been around the block and back with mech squonkers and they are not for me. Messy and I find they drain the battery very quickly and really don't give me a consistent vape.
> 
> Just picked up my first hybrid tube and I'm very clued up with regards to safety now days.
> 
> ...


It was nice knowing you @Spyro, hope you get well soon.

Sarcasm aside, by the time a cell feels hot to the touch externally the insides are boiling already, so battery temperature as a means of determining safety levels is a bit risky.

Pulse ratings are also not a good indicator of limits. It usually means you can draw the stated amps for a split second only, not the time we pulse while vaping, these time frames are seen as continuous discharges.

The above was taken from Mooch's videos.

When we have VTC5A and H2's (and probably a whole bunch more) readily available, I see no need to run the risks you are doing. 

The need to build that low is also questionable. But that is subjective and depends on personal preference, I would only advise you try some less bulky builds at higher ohms as well and see if your happy place may not in fact be there as well. We aim to heat juice, not metal, after all.

Regards

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## Spyro (30/3/18)

Tarquinj said:


> Hi guys and girls
> 
> I'm new to the site so please have a bit of patiences with me
> 
> ...




Hey dude. I have been vaping 1.5ohm on 30Qs. I have only heard and seen people - usually the blokes behind the counter at BnM stores building low 0.08-0.07 on 25R batteries and vtc4s. I usually vaped at 0.3-0.4 on single coil squonkers. This is my first tube mech.

@Raindance thanks for the input friend. I as stated above those are my perameters. 0.15 with dual coil twisted Ka1 x4 wraps. A tiny little build.

As mentioned in my first post the batteries do get warm but nowhere near hot enough to not be able to hold. That's ludicrous and I would never let it get to that.

However, heeding all warnings I will pick some new batts up soonest.

Thanks for the guidance 

I remember visiting a BnM and the store clerk wouldn't let me touch his Tesla bitturbo mech as he was running 0.07 ohms on a series? Perhaps parallel build. Said he understands the risks but wouldn't let me try it - while he happily puffed on my engine.

Another time I spoke to a different BnM clerk who told me that he runs 0.08 regularly as his go to on his tube. I can only assume he was using the correct batteries. So I know for a fact there are plenty of people pushing the limits. I just wanted to check that my limit pushing wasn't all too dangerous.

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## Raindance (30/3/18)

Spyro said:


> Hey dude. I have been vaping 1.5ohm on 30Qs. I have only heard and seen people - usually the blokes behind the counter at BnM stores building low 0.08-0.07 on 25R batteries and vtc4s. I usually vaped at 0.3-0.4 on single coil squonkers. This is my first tube mech.
> 
> @Raindance thanks for the input friend. I as stated above those are my perameters. 0.15 with dual coil twisted Ka1 x4 wraps. A tiny little build.
> 
> ...


Just thought I could leave this here: (Remember not to just trust my figures, do your own calculations to verify.)


0.07 Ohm mech builds do seem a bit scary in all respects and I can not imagine why one would want to dabble in this territory, but then again...

As for a point to ponder, using TC wire like SS will result in an initial high amp draw but as the coil heats up, the Ohm's will increase thereby dropping the Amp draw. Something worth considering the full implications of. On big metal volume builds most energy is used to heat up the coil but once hot does one need all that energy to heat juice? There may be some advantages in this theory of using SS if it holds up in real world use where once the coil is hot less energy is needed to heat juice only.

Regards

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## Tarquinj (30/3/18)

Spyro said:


> Hey dude. I have been vaping 1.5ohm on 30Qs. I have only heard and seen people - usually the blokes behind the counter at BnM stores building low 0.08-0.07 on 25R batteries and vtc4s. I usually vaped at 0.3-0.4 on single coil squonkers. This is my first tube mech.
> 
> @Raindance thanks for the input friend. I as stated above those are my perameters. 0.15 with dual coil twisted Ka1 x4 wraps. A tiny little build.
> 
> ...



1.5 i could never sir XD I'm use to my low builds love it too bit, I chase those clouds like crazy my batts might not last forever but I can't live without my clouds


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## Tarquinj (30/3/18)

I


Raindance said:


> Just thought I could leave this here: (Remember not to just trust my figures, do your own calculations to verify.)
> View attachment 127532
> 
> 0.07 Ohm mech builds do seem a bit scary in all respects and I can not imagine why one would want to dabble in this territory, but then again...
> ...


If I may ask what is SS? I'm not really clued up to wire.

From my point of view why people would do a 0.07 build is for the ramp up. What I've noticed (living in Cape Town) is that a lot of us loves low builds. Quick ramp up + shorter time of pulling = bigger clouds
I mean look of you have a higher build yes your batts last longer but that's means you have to set your watts higher if regulated. That's why I stick to my unrelated, again that's just my opinion boet. I hope this sort of helps

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## Spyro (30/3/18)

^^^ this, see what I mean. Guys build "too low" for even vtc4s yes it's common place here in the Cape anyway. No reports of blow ups from what I can see.

So is over drawing really that much of an issue if you have your safety perameters in check. And you don't chain vape it past a warm battery?


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## Spyro (30/3/18)

Again, mooch said, if you aren't chain vaping the chances of venting are low even on a 0.02ohm build. He doesn't condone those builds but the cause of detonation would be a dead short, not a low build.

Just finding out here. Not justifying low builds.


In fact. I just saw a competition in Cape Town for a new store opening. Which has a mech Ohm limit of minimum 0.1 ohm. Which is way over the Amp draw limit of ANY battery. So what's going on here. I don't understand!!!

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## Hallucinated_ (30/3/18)

Spyro said:


> Again, mooch said, if you aren't chain vaping the chances of venting are low even on a 0.02ohm build. He doesn't condone those builds but the cause of detonation would be a dead short, not a low build.
> 
> Just finding out here. Not justifying low builds.
> 
> ...



Remember that the calculators are worst case scenario, they are not 100% acurate because of the internal resistance of your mechanical device, the voltage drop after a fresh charge aswell as the resistance between your 510 connection on your positive battery terminal. You will be suprised how quickly your battery drops to its nominal voltage after a hit or two 3.7v instead of 4.2v after a fresh charge.

For example,

I have an regulated mod(DNA Chip) and a mechanicle,
One atomizer to test on both, build is 0.12 ohm. 

According to the calculator i am pulling 32 amps and pushing 135 watts when i take my first hit on the mech, in fact it feels like i am pushing 60-70 watts when im hitting.

because on my regulated i can set it to 135 watts and i feel what is 135 watts.

I am not saying it is safe to build 0.12 on a mech, just my opinion

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## Raindance (30/3/18)

Tarquinj said:


> I
> 
> If I may ask what is SS? I'm not really clued up to wire.
> 
> ...


Stainless Steel ( SS316, 304 ...) - one of the resistance wire types we use, The others are NI (Ni200) which is pure Nickel The Nichrome (NI80), Kanthal (K) and the rarely heard of Titanium (Ti).

SS, NI and Ti all have a marked increase in resistance as they heat up and are therefore used for Temperature control but can be used otherwise as well.

Ramp up speed is dependent on how much energy needs to be absorbed by the metal in the coil in order for the whole thing to reach a certain temperature. I get incredible ramp up on my 0.6 Ohm SS 28AWG coils because they contain so little metal. Surface area in contact with juice laden wick is however not as much as would be the case of a complex coil, so there is a trade off.

It is a complex issue which one day I hope to do some proper research on but for now I am totally happy with coils that give me more than 50% headroom on my 30Q's.

I apologize if I seem a bit opposed to pushing the envelope in terms of low builds but, guys, I do not want any of you to become part of the statistics related to vaping accidents. Rather play it safe.

Regards

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## Raindance (30/3/18)

SO all this talk of low Ohm vaping got me curious.



2.2 Ohm cold for 80 Watt's at 4.2 Volts pulling 19 Ampere's. Vaping on a battery drained to 4.0 Volt. (2x24 + 32 SS Fused Clapton by Geegvape) Vaping Ice Lollies - Boom by Sanctuary E-Liquid.

For all that is sane and virtuous in this life and the next, who can possibly enjoy this! The vape is hot as hell and although the flavor is certainly there from what I can tell with the piece of my tongue that is still functioning, I taste less due to only having partial use of it.
There is not enough Koolada and Menthol in the world to cool this lot down.

On a serious note, I am a flavor chaser that likes a good cloud as well. I get the same amount of cloud and a heck of a lot better taste from a simple dual 28AWG build as I get from this. And that with a lot less battery strain and risk as well.

Out with that build and back to sanity:



0.43 Ohms for 41 Watt's at 9.77 Amps. Ramps like crazy and pushing no limits at all.

Regards

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## Hallucinated_ (31/3/18)

Raindance said:


> SO all this talk of low Ohm vaping got me curious.
> 
> View attachment 127568
> 
> ...


You need some proper coils mate, chinese mass produced coils in a mech is not what i would call a good vape.

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## Puff the Magic Dragon (31/3/18)

"...Thanks to Geekvape for bringing awesome coils to the market..." DJLsp Vapes

""...provide some of the best premade coils out there in the market..." Rip Trippers

"...every coil is pristine and perfect..." Suck My Mod

"...these are good coils. I really really like them..." Heathen

"...no brainer...awesome..." Mike Vapes
Views on Chinese coils by the top YouTube reviewers

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## Spyro (31/3/18)

0.1ohm coil

On my mech it's a little disappointing, I have to close an airhole. On my regulated I can open up the airflow and crank it to 120W and it's fanflippentastic.

So I can definitely see why people build lower because as you can see with the chart that was kindly posted above, power output goes up exponentially with each 0.01 ohm you drop with your build.

I am currently still running my Samsung 30Q with absolutely no overheating at all. Pulsing at 1-2 seconds.

But don't worry, I'm literally on my way to fetch some VTC4s as I type. Misses just making me some coffee before the drive.

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## Spyro (31/3/18)

CeeJay said:


> It's quite long and not in HD but a cool real world experiment. On the copper vs brass and SS mod material. Does volt drop and power readings.






It's quite long and not I'm not sober enough to catch the jist. but basically in this real world experiment. Do the copper vs brass and SS mod material make that much difference to volt drop and power readings....
but he's basically showing that the resistance of mechs /voltage drop is negligible with regards to what type of metal your mod is made from. All other variables remaining equal.

Or have I missed the point entirely.

Because I hear a lot of silver is better for hard hitting / brass is better, etc etc.

Did he just basically say it makes minimal difference?


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## Raindance (31/3/18)

Spyro said:


> It's quite long and not I'm not sober enough to catch the jist. but basically in this real world experiment. Do the copper vs brass and SS mod material make that much difference to volt drop and power readings....
> Tad bit too intoxicated for this right now, but he's basically showing that the resistance of mechs /voltage drop is negligible with regards to what type of metal your mod is made from. Ceterus paribus (all other variables remaining equally)
> 
> Or have I missed the point entirely.
> ...


If your mod uses its "body" as conductor (not a couple of plates inside a plastic body) the cross section of the resulting conductor is so large that the materials resistance becomes negligible.

Regards

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## Spyro (31/3/18)

Got it bro, thanks. This is great news.


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## Tarquinj (11/4/18)

Hi guys and girls 

So I have a very big problem, at the moment my simplicity isn't in working order because my L shape mechanism broke. It's a solid silver contact and it broke at the middle point of the L. It's costs way to much to import new solid silver contact (I basically buy a brand new simplicity with that money ￼￼) so what I want to know is how can I fix it ?? 
Can I get it silver welded?? Because that shouldn't case anything to go wrong or am I wrong??


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## Andre (11/4/18)

Tarquinj said:


> Hi guys and girls
> 
> So I have a very big problem, at the moment my simplicity isn't in working order because my L shape mechanism broke. It's a solid silver contact and it broke at the middle point of the L. It's costs way to much to import new solid silver contact (I basically buy a brand new simplicity with that money ￼￼) so what I want to know is how can I fix it ??
> Can I get it silver welded?? Because that shouldn't case anything to go wrong or am I wrong??


Any manufacturing jeweller should be able to "weld" it for you.

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## Tarquinj (11/4/18)

Andre said:


> Any manufacturing jeweller should be able to "weld" it for you.


 I meant solder sorry bud I went to watch a bit of videos now about it XD but I really appreciate the information bud

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## Resistance (28/5/18)

Any advice on wismecs rx machina or should I look at something else. Im not going out to get one tomorrow, but before year end and advice and ideas could help please

Sent from my X30 using Tapatalk


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## Huffapuff (25/6/18)

A couple of questions for the mech fundis:

What's the best way to clean up these black marks on the 510? I've tried using acetone, and an eraser and it produces temporary relief. Also the firing button gets worryingly hot quite quickly. 



Is this caused by arcing? What do I use to prevent it from happening?
TIA.


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## Silver (25/6/18)

Huffapuff said:


> A couple of questions for the mech fundis:
> 
> What's the best way to clean up these black marks on the 510? I've tried using acetone, and an eraser and it produces temporary relief. Also the firing button gets worryingly hot quite quickly.
> View attachment 136608
> ...



Hi @Huffapuff 
For the Reos, to prevent arcing, we use Noalox or dielectric grease
@Alex, what was the name of that dielectric grease you got for me? Was it Fuchs?

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## Raindance (25/6/18)

Huffapuff said:


> A couple of questions for the mech fundis:
> 
> What's the best way to clean up these black marks on the 510? I've tried using acetone, and an eraser and it produces temporary relief. Also the firing button gets worryingly hot quite quickly.
> View attachment 136608
> ...


After cleaning put some Maelox (Spelling?) or similar electrical contact lubricant on there. Seals the contact points from air and thus prevents oxidation.

The heating issue can indicate a too small contact area as well. Try to ensure as much of the strike plate touches the 510 contact point as possible.

Hope this helps.

Regards

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## GerharddP (25/6/18)

Huffapuff said:


> A couple of questions for the mech fundis:
> 
> What's the best way to clean up these black marks on the 510? I've tried using acetone, and an eraser and it produces temporary relief. Also the firing button gets worryingly hot quite quickly.
> View attachment 136608
> ...



Its caused by arcing yes. For a fraction of a second those arcs can reach the temperature of the surface of the sun.

That looks like silver wether solid or plated the result is the same. The color comes from carbon and silver oxide which is black in color. Like @Silver said the best thing to do is electrical grease to prevent it from happening as quickly.

In the industry we use specialized electrical cleaners to remove arc deposits. What I would do if I were you is to use a micro fibre cloth with some micron polishing compound and get at it.

The heat build up is more than likely caused by insufficient contact area and the increased resistance of the arc damage.

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## Huffapuff (25/6/18)

Thanks so much guys, really appreciate the input. Will have to get myself sorted tomorrow.

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## Huffapuff (25/6/18)

GerharddP said:


> The heat build up is more than likely caused by insufficient contact area and the increased resistance of the arc damage.


Yeah, the contact point is small. I'm not very impressed with the Furyan's button. But I'm keen to find a solution.


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## GregF (25/6/18)

Here you go @Huffapuff

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## Alex (25/6/18)

Silver said:


> Hi @Huffapuff
> For the Reos, to prevent arcing, we use Noalox or dielectric grease
> @Alex, what was the name of that dielectric grease you got for me? Was it Fuchs?



Can't find it on their site, they probably changed the name.

https://www.fuchs.com/za/en/


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## Raindance (25/6/18)

Alex said:


> Can't find it on their site, they probably changed the name.
> 
> https://www.fuchs.com/za/en/





Maybe?


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## Alex (25/6/18)

Raindance said:


> View attachment 136619
> 
> Maybe?



Used to be called

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## Raindance (25/6/18)

Silver said:


> Hi @Huffapuff
> For the Reos, to prevent arcing, we use Noalox or dielectric grease
> @Alex, what was the name of that dielectric grease you got for me? Was it Fuchs?


There's also:


https://www.ubuy.za.com/catalog/pro...OxuqaUXS0mMAeEqc6ntLyDopWjhLfrfAaAlVvEALw_wcB

Regards

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## Raindance (25/6/18)

Found it:
https://www.fuchs.com/za/en/brands/l-r/renolit/
Regards

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## Alex (25/6/18)

Raindance said:


> Found it:
> https://www.fuchs.com/za/en/brands/l-r/renolit/
> Regards



It's really cheap, 

1 litre tin cost about R35.00 a few years ago. Enough for 10 life times.

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## Andre (25/6/18)

These work perfectly to clean it@Huffapuff. Thereafter apply Noalox or the like.

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## Huffapuff (25/6/18)

Thanks everybody - it's awesome to be able to tap into this knowledge reservoir.

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## Silver (26/6/18)

Huffapuff said:


> knowledge reservoir



So apprpriately described @Huffapuff !

Let's just add a picture to that  !!

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## Hazard (14/12/19)

Hi Guys. hoping for some help here. 
I just picked up the Bonza Mech Tube. I am currently running two RDAs on it. 
the Bonza with a 0.18ohm build and a Drop Dead with a 0.24 build. with both these builds I am using the 40T batteries. Couldn’t get 30Ts. 
but the issue I have is I am getting Hot Button issues with both builds I have calculated that I am in the Amp range of the batteries. I have cleaned the thread and the contacts. But still keep getting a hot button. Any advice as to why. 
I have the stainless Bonza. 
And advise will be helpful to resolve the hot button issue. thanks in advance to the great community.

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## Jengz (14/12/19)

Hazard said:


> Hi Guys. hoping for some help here.
> I just picked up the Bonza Mech Tube. I am currently running two RDAs on it.
> the Bonza with a 0.18ohm build and a Drop Dead with a 0.24 build. with both these builds I am using the 40T batteries. Couldn’t get 30Ts.
> but the issue I have is I am getting Hot Button issues with both builds I have calculated that I am in the Amp range of the batteries. I have cleaned the thread and the contacts. But still keep getting a hot button. Any advice as to why.
> ...


Howsit bud, ive noticed stainless steel mechs with stainless steel buttons get hot, why i have no idea, i currently run a 0.11 ohm build in my coil art mage v2 using a 30T and 40T and my batteries stay cool and so does my button. 

Just make sure your battery isnt heating up. Also, what coils are you using?Sometimes coils that have a long ramp uo time tend to make buttons on mechs hot.

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## Hazard (14/12/19)

Jengz said:


> Howsit bud, ive noticed stainless steel mechs with stainless steel buttons get hot, why i have no idea, i currently run a 0.11 ohm build in my coil art mage v2 using a 30T and 40T and my batteries stay cool and so does my button.
> 
> Just make sure your battery isnt heating up. Also, what coils are you using?Sometimes coils that have a long ramp uo time tend to make buttons on mechs hot.



hi. Thanks. 
the mod has a copper button. but I tried the mod with the Positive up and the problem went away now. Was running with the positive down as most of the venting on the mod is on the button. But also has some venting at the top. 
not sure why this made a difference but the mod is firing better too and is much cooler. I suspect it has something to do with the switch making contact on the top cap on the battery with arching etc. 
as I think with the switch making contact on the bottom of the battery is a lot better and produces less arching.

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## Jengz (14/12/19)

Hazard said:


> hi. Thanks.
> the mod has a copper button. but I tried the mod with the Positive up and the problem went away now. Was running with the positive down as most of the venting on the mod is on the button. But also has some venting at the top.
> not sure why this made a difference but the mod is firing better too and is much cooler. I suspect it has something to do with the switch making contact on the top cap on the battery with arching etc.
> as I think with the switch making contact on the bottom of the battery is a lot better and produces less arching.


Definitely arcing, glad you came right

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## Resistance (14/12/19)

If you have a multimeter also check the mod resistance. The switch to positive up might have reduced the distance the current had to travel (through material) to the coil/(resistor) like the bottleneck effect.everything before the coil heats up. Read up on anode and cathodes too, it will help understand it better.
(I stand to be corrected)

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## Resistance (14/12/19)

Silver said:


> So apprpriately described @Huffapuff !
> 
> Let's just add a picture to that  !!
> 
> View attachment 136655


This is an Awesome pic @Silver

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## Silver (15/12/19)

Resistance said:


> This is an Awesome pic @Silver



Thank you @Resistance 
Saw it now again after a long time thanks to your comment. Lovely picture indeed!

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