# SA court rules cannabis can be used in home



## huffnpuff

http://m.news24.com/news24/SouthAfr...e-home-western-cape-high-court-rules-20170331

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## boxerulez

No matter how healthy the THC in it might be... the by product of burning it is still unsafe.

VapeOn

Reactions: Agree 2


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## RichJB

The international trend seems to be that it's silly to further burden an already overloaded criminal justice system with marijuana convictions. I wouldn't smoke weed regardless of the laws because it's combustion and I think the benefits are hyped while the harm is downplayed. But dragging thousands more people into the justice system for relatively meaningless pot convictions exacerbates rather than solves the problem.

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## herb1

Open all the weed bakeries!!!

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## huffnpuff

herb1 said:


> Open all the weed bakeries!!!


Nope, non-commercial home-use adults only


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## huffnpuff

Lol, the comments on combustion are amusing. Reminds me of vaping comments in the early days. Modern cannabis users have been moving away from combustion for ages now and there's quite a few non-combustion based methods available these days like ejuice, dry herb and concentrate vaporizing devices. But inhalation is isn't the only way cannabis is consumed. In the states alone, in just the few years in the states where it has been legalised, edibles account for almost 45% of sales. 

From a medicinal usage point of view, THC is not the only ingredient of use. All the other cannabanoids found in cannabis are more important, resulting in strains with lower or no THC and more of the rest. SA is predominantly saturated with THC -heavy sativa strains. With legalisation, better strains for medical use can be researched and made available.

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## blujeenz

Just spotted this between all the smoke over firing Gordhan on the news24 site.



> The Western Cape High Court made the landmark ruling, declaring that it is an infringement of constitutional rights to ban the use of dagga by adults in private homes.
> 
> In making the ruling on Friday, it has allowed for the possession, cultivation and use of dagga at home – for private use.
> 
> It has also ruled that Parliament must change sections of the Drug Trafficking Act, as well as the Medicines Control Act.



Might be prudent to have a separate area for all the "MJ vapes" questions that are bound to follow.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Raindance

I'm conflicted on this topic. Might just grow some to make up my mind... and because I can. No, seriously, if this is your kind of thing then good for you but I have enough sinful pleasures on my plate not to feel the need to add any.

Regards


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## Smoky Jordan

huffnpuff said:


> http://m.news24.com/news24/SouthAfr...e-home-western-cape-high-court-rules-20170331


isn't just in the Western cape?

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Kalashnikov

Is there any section on the forum where i can ask about dry herb vaporizers? asking for a friend...

Reactions: Like 1 | Funny 12


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## blujeenz

Kalashnikov said:


> Is there any section on the forum where i can ask about dry herb vaporizers? asking for a friend...


Not at this time, no.
You also have to be a Capetonian to legally ask such questions.

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## huffnpuff

Raindance said:


> I'm conflicted on this topic. Might just grow some to make up my mind... and because I can. No, seriously, if this is your kind of thing then good for you but I have enough sinful pleasures on my plate not to feel the need to add any.
> 
> Regards


I'm same. Single malt and vaping are my poisons of choice . I only got interested in this from a medicinal point of view after witnessing it's effective use as such and seeing the difficulties legitimate users are experiencing due to the legal status of the plant.

Reactions: Like 2 | Agree 2 | Thanks 1


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## foGGyrEader

I'm pleased with this ruling, not because I smoke weed but that as adult individuals it is our right to do with our bodies as we please. Hope this doesn't cause an increase in teenage use though, can't pass your exams when your high

Reactions: Agree 2


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## Anneries

Great, now we have to rewrite our drug and alcohol policies at work. I can see this potentially becoming an issue. Lets see how this plays out. 

This seems like the whole "cherry shrimp" saga in the tropical freshwater aquarium conundrum. It is legal to have and enjoy, but illegal to purchase/sell. SO how do you get it ... will you have to go through the medical route, obtaining permits etc. 

As an "adult at home" I am not to phased about this ruling. As a manager at work I am already thinking of all the policies that will have to be revised.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 1


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## Andre

Smoky Jordan said:


> isn't just in the Western cape?


No, countrywide. And it shall stand unless a higher court overturns the decision.

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## huffnpuff

...


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## Raindance

The immediate question is, would it be seen as part of the vaping culture in terms of dry herb vaporizer's? Would we include and accept it as part of this forum?

Reactions: Can relate 1 | Useful 1


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## Amir

Finally... Some good news considering all that's happened in the past 24 hours!!

On a serious note... Unless you've already been a weed smoker this law or ruling won't really make non-pot-heads go buy a bankie just because they can smoke at home. It just alleviates the workload of the justice system to an extent...

Reactions: Agree 2


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## blujeenz

I find it rather suspicious that it breaks the day before April Fools, almost like a large portion of the population will pass it off as a joke once it gets TV and newspaper coverage.

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## Amir

blujeenz said:


> I find it rather suspicious that it breaks the day before April Fools, almost like a large portion of the population will pass it off as a joke once it gets TV and newspaper coverage.



What's even more suspicious is weed gets legalized, then Zuma plays the fantasy wild card with his cabinet reshuffle... 

Hmmm food for thought... Well food for munchies too but I digress...

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## Chronix

So amped about this, been waiting years for this to happen..

Reactions: Like 1 | Can relate 2


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## craigb

Anneries said:


> Great, now we have to rewrite our drug and alcohol policies at work. I can see this potentially becoming an issue. Lets see how this plays out.
> 
> This seems like the whole "cherry shrimp" saga in the tropical freshwater aquarium conundrum. It is legal to have and enjoy, but illegal to purchase/sell. SO how do you get it ... will you have to go through the medical route, obtaining permits etc.
> 
> As an "adult at home" I am not to phased about this ruling. As a manager at work I am already thinking of all the policies that will have to be revised.


Having just read another article about this, what the judgement comes down to is only home use. The judgement does not extend to use outside of the privacy of your own home.


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## blujeenz

craigb said:


> Having just read another article about this, what the judgement comes down to is only home use. The judgement does not extend to use outside of the privacy of your own home.


I think @Anneries meant about drug testing in the workplace... would now be of dubious benefit.


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## craigb

blujeenz said:


> I think @Anneries meant about drug testing in the workplace... would now be of dubious benefit.


Fair point


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## Kuhlkatz

Anneries said:


> Great, now we have to rewrite our drug and alcohol policies at work. I can see this potentially becoming an issue. Lets see how this plays out.
> 
> This seems like the whole "cherry shrimp" saga in the tropical freshwater aquarium conundrum. It is legal to have and enjoy, but illegal to purchase/sell. SO how do you get it ... will you have to go through the medical route, obtaining permits etc.
> 
> As an "adult at home" I am not to phased about this ruling. As a manager at work I am already thinking of all the policies that will have to be revised.



I dont think that any policies would have to be revisited. I can already 'legally' drink myself into a coma at home, but my employer still has the right to kick my ass out and take disciplinary steps if I pitch up drunk at the workplace.

I think that trying to operate machinery or just being in an environment where your own or others' safety depends on your sobriety or ability to think clearly, there should be no need to change any rules of engagement. You are either fit, or not fit to do the job, and that is exactly why some industries have compulsory testing which is done.

I have no idea how long after use substances like cannabis remains detectable in the bloodstream or if there are specific 'limits' defined, but I sure as hell would not particularly want a pilot to fly me from Jhb to Dbn when his eyes are so red he has to wear shades to stop spattering blood everywhere when he blinks, no matter what substance he is on.

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## blujeenz

Kuhlkatz said:


> I have no idea how long after use substances like cannabis remains detectable in the bloodstream


I seem to recall that the adipose tissue holds onto the cannabinoids for 3 weeks.


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## Blu_Marlin

There's going to be a lot of disappointed Saffers when the SCA throws out the current ruling  . That's if it's appealed. On a serious note though, medical Mary Jane really works


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## Raindance

I think what this comes down to is not that much that cannabis has been legalized but rather that what you do in your own home is your business and nobody else's. If those activities overflow into your activities beyond those confines its business as usual. "Pappa wag nog altyd vir jou!"

Regards

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Viper_SA

Free da weed mon!

Reactions: Funny 4


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## RichJB

Raindance said:


> I think what this comes down to is not that much that cannabis has been legalized but rather that what you do in your own home is your business and nobody else's.



I get that this is partly a privacy issue but surely LSD should then also be legal? If this is about the right of adults to do what they like to their bodies in the privacy of their own homes, I can't see why the law would draw any distinction between marijuana and hard drugs.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 3 | Informative 1


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## Raindance

RichJB said:


> I get that this is partly a privacy issue but surely LSD should then also be legal? If this is about the right of adults to do what they like to their bodies in the privacy of their own homes, I can't see why the law would draw any distinction between marijuana and hard drugs.


Good Point @RichJB !


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## craigb

RichJB said:


> I get that this is partly a privacy issue but surely LSD should then also be legal? If this is about the right of adults to do what they like to their bodies in the privacy of their own homes, I can't see why the law would draw any distinction between marijuana and hard drugs.


I'm a pleb when it comes to legal matters, so take this with a spade full of salt.

This ruling goes to the growth, "manufacture" and consumption of Mary Jane. All relatively simple to do, even in a spare cupboard by means of hydroponics.

LSD and other such narcotics require a more complicated process, meaning Rich can't just whip up a batch for himself.

Dealing in MJ is not covered by the judgment and as such, would be seen in the same light as dealing in the harder chems.

That being said, if the social impact can be eliminated or at least reduced and clean and safe supply lines can be established, I don't give a damn what other adults do in the privacy of their own homes under fully informed consent.

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## SAVaper

And I just finished the floor for my new greenhouse....

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## RichJB

craigb said:


> This ruling goes to the growth, "manufacture" and consumption of Mary Jane. All relatively simple to do, even in a spare cupboard by means of hydroponics.



OK, you have my interest. Where do I get the seeds? 

Edit: wait, I found a place. Five seeds for R900. Jirre, are they made by Flavorah or something? There are hundreds of strains you can buy too. This sounds more complex than DIY. I will need percentages.

Reactions: Funny 4


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## Raindance

RichJB said:


> OK, you have my interest. Where do I get the seeds?
> 
> Edit: wait, I found a place. Five seeds for R900. Jirre, are they made by Flavorah or something? There are hundreds of strains you can buy too. This sounds more complex than DIY. I will need percentages.


Just stay away from the Malawi. Don't ask me why. Just trust me, I'm an en(not gonna say it)


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## blujeenz

RichJB said:


> OK, you have my interest. Where do I get the seeds?
> 
> Edit: wait, I found a place. Five seeds for R900. Jirre, are they made by Flavorah or something? There are hundreds of strains you can buy too. This sounds more complex than DIY. I will need percentages.


Therein lies the rub of the matter, you cant just waltz into Stodels and buy some cannabis seeds... goodluck trying to get them past customs or through postal if you're buying online.

I think the privacy concern was just a side note and a great bandwagon to the much larger "medical needs".
I've never yet heard of anyone using LSD to medicate cancer, mj does have medical benefits, other hard drugs have none.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## huffnpuff

RichJB said:


> I get that this is partly a privacy issue but surely LSD should then also be legal? If this is about the right of adults to do what they like to their bodies in the privacy of their own homes, I can't see why the law would draw any distinction between marijuana and hard drugs.



Erm Hell No! Seriously?

Didn't you get educated what the different drugs do? Hard drugs like LSD, Meth, Heroine and Crack/Cocaine cause serious damage, kill and/or are highly addictive. worldwide, there have been extremely few cases of deaths caused by cannabis, if even. Most deaths related to cannabis are people doing stupid sh*t like driving and playing with firearms/knives/etc while under the influence. Matter of fact, alcohol is way more dangerous and addictive than cannabis.

There is only one scenario, which is a major problem in SA, where cannabis is synonymous with hard drugs and that is when other drugs ( like Meth, Mandrax, Tik, Aids drugs, etc) are mixed with cannabis. This is either done intentionally by users or by some dodgy dealers lacing their product to make it more potent than their competition's normal product or the get user's hooked on the hard stuff. Home growing will should elliminate exposure to these criminals.

Reactions: Agree 5


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## RichJB

Raindance said:


> Just stay away from the Malawi.



I grew up in Swaziland so I should be a connoisseur. But it sorta passed me by. 



huffnpuff said:


> Didn't you get educated what the different drugs do?



Sure. But I was responding to the point that the govt shouldn't have the right to dictate what adults do with their own bodies in private.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## shabbar

huffnpuff said:


> Erm Hell No! Seriously?
> 
> Didn't you get educated what the different drugs do? Hard drugs like LSD, Meth, Heroine and Crack/Cocaine cause serious damage, kill and/or are highly addictive. worldwide, there have been extremely few cases of deaths caused by cannabis, if even. Most deaths related to cannabis are people doing stupid sh*t like driving and playing with firearms/knives/etc while under the influence. Matter of fact, alcohol is way more dangerous and addictive than cannabis.
> 
> There is only one scenario, which is a major problem in SA, where cannabis is synonymous with hard drugs and that is when other drugs ( like Meth, Mandrax, Tik, Aids drugs, etc) are mixed with cannabis. This is either done intentionally by users or by some dodgy dealers lacing their product to make it more potent than their competition's normal product or the get user's hooked on the hard stuff. Home growing will should elliminate exposure to these criminals.




The only side effects I know is hungry happy sleepy.......



PG
Very strong language


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## Scissorhands

blujeenz said:


> I seem to recall that the adipose tissue holds onto the cannabinoids for 3 weeks.


Body fat %, frequently & potency are also determining factors . . . A horse in a bar once told me


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## incredible_hullk

shabbar said:


> The only side effects I know is hungry happy sleepy.......
> 
> 
> 
> PG
> Very strong language




Amen brother @shabbar 

On a sad note gov still reviewing and may take it on appeal ... seriously dnt they get it zuma has made us unhappy and we need some happiness...


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## Effjh

blujeenz said:


> I've never yet heard of anyone using LSD to medicate cancer, mj does have medical benefits, other hard drugs have none.



Interestingly I saw a docu on hallucinogenics being the only thing to actually help people with cluster headaches. It was this old oomie growing his own shrooms and then making tablets.

He hated the high (can't imagine why), but it would mean he didn't get a single cluster headache attack for a year and then he'd 'medicate' again. It does something with the brain chem that seems to help these people. LSD and other similar drugs all have been reported to cure the people who suffer from CH.

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## Warlock

Here is a link to the judgment, if anyone wants to read it (about 60 pages): 

http://www.saflii.org.za/za/cases/ZAWCHC/2017/30.html

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## Monkey.D.Luffy

RichJB said:


> I get that this is partly a privacy issue but surely LSD should then also be legal? If this is about the right of adults to do what they like to their bodies in the privacy of their own homes, I can't see why the law would draw any distinction between marijuana and hard drugs.


Portugal took the view that all drugs are to be legalised 16 years ago and the capital spent on jailing and convicting addicts would be used for rehabilitation. And they have seen positive results with regards to drug related deaths usage rates etc. 

Sent from my GT-I9500 using Tapatalk

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## RichJB

Yeah, there are arguments both for and against the legalisation of drugs. I am of the view that laws don't solve problems, societal problems arise due to socio-economic and other stressors. Addressing those stressors, rather than banning the problem, is a much better approach imo.

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## Monkey.D.Luffy

Laws on drugs have become outdated, it has not stopped the drug related issues in the country, a different approach is need. 


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## Effjh

http://milled.co.za/2017/03/31/dont-light-dagga-yet/

Just read this before posting pics of your boompies on social media. We're not quite there yet.

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## Johnny2Puffs

My wife has recently been diagnosed with throat cancer even though she stopped smoking 6 years ago and we are more at the Oncology Hospital than at home these days. I would gladly give her cannabis oil to make her days more comfortable. 
I would also participate to make me better to accept her condition. Sad but we may feel better about it.
She also has a motor neuron problem that I see cannabis may help with as it also helps with Alzheimer Disease.
Problem is where to get it.

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## craigb

Johnny2Puffs said:


> My wife has recently been diagnosed with throat cancer even though she stopped smoking 6 years ago and we are more at the Oncology Hospital than at home these days. I would gladly give her cannabis oil to make her days more comfortable.
> I would also participate to make me better to accept her condition. Sad but we may feel better about it.
> She also has a motor neuron problem that I see cannabis may help with as it also helps with Alzheimer Disease.
> Problem is where to get it.



So sorry to hear this @Johnny2Puffs .

Not too sure, but I think you can arrange such through your doctor and/or clinic. I've heard of this through an unreliable third party during discussion about someone else but maybe it can set you on a path.

Best wishes for you and your wife.

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## William Vermaak

@Johnny2Puffs, there's a lot of doctors that can also refer you to a reputable place to purchase.

My dad passed away this week from Mesothelioma which they first found beginning 2014 and they gave him 3 months to live.

He totally refused chemo and used his drops religiously and gave us another 3 years with him. It is a very viable medicine for illnesses they have not even thought of administrating it. Look at Parkinsons for one. The results are astounding and I think now that everyone is able to do clinical trials with cannabis we'll see the massive impact it will have on the medical industry. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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## Warlock

@Johnny2Puffs search 'motor neuron and nicotine' and 'Alzheimer Disease and nicotine'

Also go read this http://discovermagazine.com/2014/march/13-nicotine-fix


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## Warlock

As I understand it the oil for medical purposes must come from the Cannabis indica strain. From the female plant and distilled from the flower at a given stage of development of the crystals on the flower.

Also a kilogram of flowers only yields about 15ml of oil.

The plant seeds can be imported (about R500.00 each) and are mailed under what they call a ‘stealth blanket’.

Once you have your first plants you can clone new plants from the leaves (not too impossible) to perpetuate your supply.

It’s very difficult to find local quality oils as most of the local stuff is ‘cut’ with coconut oil, and still very expensive.

This is a bit of a ramble, but if your life depends on it, it’s worth looking into.

This information has not been googled and it comes from speaking to people who are using Cannabis oil to treat their cancers.

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## Feliks Karp

huffnpuff said:


> Didn't you get educated what the different drugs do? Hard drugs like LSD



Disclaimer: I do not use any hallucinogens as I suffer from depression and an abnormal brain pattern.

I'm going to be that guy, LSD is classified as a soft drug as it has no physical addictive properties, the flashback phenomena are reported by less than 15% of users, all damage like supposed chromosomal changes have been debunked and any psychotic symptoms are due to a user already having mental illness or latent mental illness. In fact alcohol has a higher perceived potential for physical addiction and physical harm than LSD.

In fact there are many studies under way looking in to the medical uses of LSD, DMT, Psilocybin and other hallucinogenic compounds. 

You mentioned mandrax which was actually originally developed for the treatment of insomnia, and falls in to the same class of drugs as various brand name *legal* drugs such as stilnox, xanax, valium and rufilim, all of which are considered hard drugs. 

So @RichJB 's question is in fact still relevant outside of your interpretation of what constitutes a hard and soft drug.

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## Coldcat

Anneries said:


> This seems like the whole "cherry shrimp" saga in the tropical freshwater aquarium conundrum. It is legal to have and enjoy, but illegal to purchase/sell. SO how do you get it ...


 lol know that all too well..

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## Anneries

blujeenz said:


> I think @Anneries meant about drug testing in the workplace... would now be of dubious benefit.



This in part, and the fact that the policy state cannabis is an illiegal substance and any use will result in disciplinary hearing. We have very old policies, so it is probably "*high"* time that we review it.

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## SamuraiTheVapor

South African attorney answering some questions on Reddit;

Sauce

Questions:

This is country wide?


I can grow and trade? but not sell


I can smoke at home and then drive?


Can I host a chop-n-zol?


Can I posess outside my home? As in drive my bankie from my home to my friends home?


addon to 3. Is it illegal to be high outside the home?


Aside from the no smoking indoors rule, hoe does this possibly apply to university settings and residents?


Possible age limit?


Answers from the attorney:


Yes, country-wide.


You can grow, but not trade or sell.


Well, yes, you technically could, but it wouldn't be legal to do that because driving under the influence of any drug or mind-altering substance is illegal. It's one of the things I'm concerned about because there's no breathalyzer test for weed.


You can. Feel free.


This is difficult to answer because the law hasn't been properly amended yet. You should be careful with possession outside the home and the purchase of it is still illegal. You might be able to say in court that it was for personal home use, but the burden of proving that becomes slightly more difficult. Sorry I can't be more clear.


As long as you're not driving or doing something else that requires you to not be stoned, and as long as you got stoned in the privacy of your own home, you should be fine.


Well, it would depend on the university's policy on smoking. Most policies have definite rules regarding drug use on their property (some even mention alcohol as a no-no). Further, the judgment relates to private property, so it would also depend on whether you go to a private university and your university's rules. I would imagine that it wouldn't be something that would be allowed. Probably best to not push your luck in this regard.


Judgment relates only to adults, so only 18 and over. Sorry kiddies, no bedtime zol for you.

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