# Scammer alert - What was the outcome?



## Ohmen (19/11/15)

It seems like this story has just disappeared. If I remember correctly @ShaneW was going to investigate the alleged email from Patric West at Absa and provide some feedback with regards to it's validity. Admins please give the rest of us some feedback. 

"*Hi everyone,

I just want to give my side of the story with regards to the post that was made, as I feel it is fair to hear both sides of a story.

I am in no means or intended to be named a 'scammer' or am trying to be one, I placed some orders at various vendors, not trying to scam anyone by any means. I have been having issues with my bank, ABSA - where they were doing an online migration for a better looking and new system that works more efficient, but for me the website was not working the way it should be.

I had no issues in the past with any vendors, everything was perfect and working - Notice this all happened in the relatively same time period while the migration was taken place.

I would get notifications with payments that are going through, but they didn't actually pull through, I contacted my bank recently after getting numerous emails from vendors asking me whats going on - here is the reponse and I quote;

'Dear Matthew

Thank you for your email.

Please note I have received feedback from our system engineers.

Please accept our sincere apology for the inconvenience caused regarding the online banking.

Our system engineers are currently attending to the problem; we unfortunately do not have a stipulated time as to how long it will take them for resolution of the problem. I do appreciate your patience while we resolve the problem.

Please note you can also try using a different browser eg. Internet Explorer 8 or 9 or Mozilla Firefox.

Should you require further assistance, please feel free to contact me via email attechnical@absa.co.za or do not hesitate to contact the call centre again on 08600 08600 (+27 11 501 5110).

Regards

Patric West
Email Administrator
Absa Internet Banking
www.absa.co.za"


After the vendors emailed me, asking what's going on, i immediately went to my bank and that's the response I got.

With no hesitation I paid everyone the outstanding amount that was owed and I apologized to everyone involved. And I would like to do so again;

I would like to apologize to everyone that got affected by this, I tried to resolve it as soon as all of this starting arising, I apologize to the community as a whole and I ask that you accept this apology as it was by no means on purpose, and I did not mean to hurt anyone, If you were affected by this, please send me a PM or an email and I will try and resolve it ASAP.

Thanks for taking the time to read this, i would just like to give my side of the story."*


----------



## blujeenz (19/11/15)

You know how the crowd goes quiet when someone bellyflops from the top board at Sea Point Pavilion...

Reactions: Like 1 | Funny 4


----------



## Eequinox (19/11/15)

blujeenz said:


> You know how the crowd goes quiet when someone bellyflops from the top board at Sea Point Pavilion...


i agree some feedback would be nice the guy was crucified ob here and i will not lie i also participated in that crucifixion

Reactions: Can relate 2


----------



## blujeenz (19/11/15)

Eequinox said:


> i agree some feedback would be nice the guy was crucified ob here and i will not lie i also participated in that crucifixion



I wouldn't feel bad at all about bringing the nails and hammer, he seemed to be trending to be vaping's first _zama zama (chancer/trying of luck), _ie many incidents over a period of time.


----------



## Ohmen (19/11/15)

I'm sure the Mods have some info.

Please show yourself.

@BumbleBee @Rob Fisher @Alex @Marzuq @Gizmo @Yiannaki


----------



## Eequinox (19/11/15)

Ohmen said:


> I'm sure the Mods have some info.
> 
> Please show yourself.
> 
> @BumbleBee @Rob Fisher @Alex @Marzuq @Gizmo @Yiannaki


lol i'm sure someone will reply when they get a chance


----------



## Marzuq (19/11/15)

Ohmen said:


> I'm sure the Mods have some info.
> 
> Please show yourself.
> 
> @BumbleBee @Rob Fisher @Alex @Marzuq @Gizmo @Yiannaki



Thanks for the tag bud. The only ones who are able to shed some light on this matter is the ones that were affected. Hopefully they have all been sorted out with payment of outstanding balances. Lets wait on the vendors to respond to this thread and take it from there.
For now lets assume that the original thread has died down as a result of all issues and differences being resolved.
@ShaneW

Reactions: Agree 1


----------



## Ohmen (19/11/15)

Marzuq said:


> Thanks for the tag bud. The only ones who are able to shed some light on this matter is the ones that were affected. Hopefully they have all been sorted out with payment of outstanding balances. Lets wait on the vendors to respond to this thread and take it from there.
> For now lets assume that the original thread has died down as a result of all issues and differences being resolved.
> @ShaneW



Thanks @Marzuq.

Agreed, lets wait for the affected parties to respond.


----------



## Oupa (19/11/15)

I assume all vendors were paid in full. Not sure how other vendors will treat orders from this individual in the future... And not only orders from this individual, but all orders going forward unfortunately. Either we get a PoP directly from the bank or we wait until funds clear before sending any merchandise.

Reactions: Agree 4


----------



## Ohmen (19/11/15)

Oupa said:


> I assume all vendors were paid in full. Not sure how other vendors will treat orders from this individual in the future... And not only orders from this individual, but all orders going forward unfortunately. Either we get a PoP directly from the bank or we wait until funds clear before sending any merchandise.



It's sad that one rotten apple spoils the whole bunch but nevertheless it's the best option going forward. 

That dude however, he is not to be trusted!

Reactions: Creative 1


----------



## andro (19/11/15)

personally i will leave this story where it is. Affected party hopefully been sorted and all. 
For us as a community is no real interest ( unless close to gossips IMO), and the way that we deal with others here will be the same . Most of us know each other and if not do a deal face to face . 

Just my 2cents

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 7


----------



## Rob Fisher (19/11/15)

Same story as @Marzuq. I wasn't affected.


----------



## Eequinox (19/11/15)

andro said:


> personally i will leave this story where it is. Affected party hopefully been sorted and all.
> For us as a community is no real interest ( unless close to gossips IMO), and the way that we deal with others here will be the same . Most of us know each other and if not do a deal face to face .
> 
> Just my 2cents


i am interested to be honest i just want to know if he was brought to book


----------



## Ashley A (19/11/15)

Eequinox said:


> i am interested to be honest i just want to know if he was brought to book


...or if he was innocent?

Reactions: Like 1


----------



## Eequinox (19/11/15)

Ashley A said:


> ...or if he was innocent?


nope i just wanted to know if the sleeze bag paid all he owed


----------



## Jakey (19/11/15)

Eequinox said:


> nope i just wanted to know if the sleeze bag paid all he owed


@Eequinox you seem 100% sure that he is guilty. im not saying hes innocent. But you seem to know something we dont. I dont think those comments arr fair, especially since the affected parties (which I dont think you were part of) have not responded. 

I really think that all threads opened regarding this matter should be closed immediately if it is not from the accused or the vendors involved. 

Seems like we all like a bit of drama, but im not enjoying this particular saga.

Reactions: Agree 6


----------



## Eequinox (19/11/15)

Jakey said:


> @Eequinox you seem 100% sure that he is guilty. im not saying hes innocent. But you seem to know something we dont. I dont think those comments arr fair, especially since the affected parties (which I dont think you were part of) have not responded.
> 
> I really think that all threads opened regarding this matter should be closed immediately if it is not from the accused or the vendors involved.
> 
> Seems like we all like a bit of drama, but im not enjoying this particular saga.


maybe you know something we don't defending a scammer innocent or not i only know what has been posted on both forums and make my own choices.I just find it peculiar that everything went dead quiet maybe he has been proved innocent and he have no idea i know it goes both ways and i am open to that and i would like to know for all we know this guy is trading here under another name

Reactions: Like 3 | Dislike 2


----------



## stevie g (19/11/15)

Who cares about being kind or being mean. We want to know if the mod team has banned him or not.

Reactions: Like 1


----------



## Eequinox (19/11/15)

Eequinox said:


> maybe you know something we don't defending a scammer innocent or not i only know what has been posted on both forums and make my own choices.I just find it peculiar that everything went dead quiet maybe he has been proved innocent and he have no idea i know it goes both ways and i am open to that and i would like to know for all we know this guy is trading here under another name


looks like i touched a nerve there.Can you honestly say that the outcome of the saga is not of interest to the vaping community ?

Reactions: Agree 1


----------



## Jakey (19/11/15)

Im not defending him. Just not flat out attacking him either. But calling the guy a sleeze bag when you dont even know if he is innocent or not doesn't seem fair to me. Why wait for the vendors response when youve clearly made your mind up.

Anyways, you are entitled to your oen opinion, no matter how harsh they come across.

Reactions: Agree 2


----------



## Eequinox (19/11/15)

Sprint said:


> Who cares about being kind or being mean. We want to know if the mod team has banned him or not.


agreed


----------



## stevie g (19/11/15)

Listen where there is smoke there is fire. I want to know that I can rely on the mods to make tough decisions for the good of the community.


----------



## Eequinox (19/11/15)

Jakey said:


> Im not defending him. Just not flat out attacking him either. But calling the guy a sleeze bag when you dont even know if he is innocent or not doesn't seem fair to me. Why wait for the vendors response when youve clearly made your mind up.
> 
> Anyways, you are entitled to your oen opinion, no matter how harsh they come across.


at least we can agree to disagree .I call things as i see them of im wrong im wrong if im right im right but not gonna be all mambi pampie about it i don't have to walk on eggshells for anyone.The world is not sunshine and roses

Reactions: Like 1


----------



## Ohmen (19/11/15)

Jakey said:


> Im not defending him. Just not flat out attacking him either. But calling the guy a sleeze bag when you dont even know if he is innocent or not doesn't seem fair to me. Why wait for the vendors response when youve clearly made your mind up.
> 
> Anyways, you are entitled to your oen opinion, no matter how harsh they come across.



That is why this thread was created. So that everyone else who was wondering(like me) can know what the outcome of this story was.

I said he can't be trusted and I have my reason for that.

Believe me my intention was not to start more $h#t.


----------



## Christos (19/11/15)

This guy went out and faked proof of payments. 
I'm with said bank and I know when money leaves my account. This bank story is bullshit and we all know it. 

You don't spend 15k on goods and claim you didn't know money left your account. 

After said person paid off debts we went and hit other vendors for a similar amount. 
Why do you buy stuff you can't afford and wait till pay day to settle accounts? 

This guy hit vendors a second time after accounts were settled. 

I think we all know con artists are a common occurrence these days. 
That being said I wish everyone happiness. 
/done with this thread and scammed.


----------



## Dr Phil (19/11/15)

Damn this is heavy stuff here


----------



## Eequinox (19/11/15)

eina ! at least i won't to have to eat a slice of humble pie

Reactions: Funny 1


----------



## method1 (19/11/15)

I wasn't going to get sucked into this again so this is my final word - as far as I know all vendors were paid, but it took some threatening.
In light of this no-one took the matter any further. Vendors don't want to get sucked into this drama again hence the general silence.

A couple of us looked into his last excuse about the banking and it just didn't add up - strange that this so-called "absa migration" affected only one person - him.

To me everything he said and the way he acted is classic con-man tactics, keeping people confused and off guard with half truths. 
The truth is seldom confusing.

Personally I don't trust him, and won't ever deal with him again, I think if you do deal with him, be cautious. 

That's all I have to say on this and won't be commenting on the situation again if I can help it.

Reactions: Like 3 | Agree 1 | Winner 2 | Thanks 1


----------



## Jakey (19/11/15)

@Eequinox whatever the outcome of this is, it was never a beef between you and I. So if you going to be at the meet next week, we can still have a coffee and a vape together

Reactions: Winner 3


----------



## Eequinox (19/11/15)

Jakey said:


> @Eequinox whatever the outcome of this is, it was never a beef between you and I. So if you going to be at the meet next week, we can still have a coffee and a vape together


hey bud all good lol.I look forward to seeing you there as you get to know me you will see i don't do subtle but i do enjoy a good debate and like to stir things up a bit it's way better than seeing only stuff for sale lol and this also made some people think about being cautious ...hopefully

Reactions: Like 1


----------



## Ohmen (19/11/15)

So clearly there are some people who are pissed off about what happened. And that is to be expected. What I didn't expect was for the mods to have a 'laissez faire' attitude towards this.

Before this thread is locked can we just wait for @ShaneW to tell us what the verdict was with Absa Bank.


----------



## Rob Fisher (19/11/15)

Ohmen said:


> So clearly there are some people who are pissed off about what happened. And that is to be expected. What I didn't expect was for the mods to have a 'laissez faire' attitude towards this.



@Ohmen please don't speculate. You have no idea what went down and as much as everyone loves action and aggravation from time to time we are not about to be drawn into this cesspool. But one thing you can be sure of is that the Vendors interests were of top most priority at all times. End of story.

Reactions: Like 2 | Agree 1 | Thanks 1


----------



## Ashley A (19/11/15)

Just Googled "eft problems absa Hellopeter". Page of similar complaints came up so maybe he isn't the 1st or only one, just the only vaper that paid by EFT to our vendors.

Anyway don't care to hear outbursts and opinions, just wanted to know the facts of the outcome of the last point in the original thread where 1 of the vendors was going to verify the ABSA response. That should have confirmed without a doubt if he was a scammer or not.

If he did scam, then he got what he deserved (hopefully karma will do a good job) and at least the AFFECTED vendors got paid from what I read. If not, well I am so very disappointed at some of the things I read

Reactions: Like 1


----------



## Ohmen (19/11/15)

Rob Fisher said:


> @Ohmen please don't speculate. You have no idea what went down and as much as everyone loves action and aggravation from time to time we are not about to be drawn into this cesspool. But one thing you can be sure of is that the Vendors interests were of top most priority at all times. End of story.



Now that's a much better response @Rob Fisher. You right I have no idea what went down but your response earlier was "Same story as @Marzuq. I wasn't affected." 

Any way I am not here to fight with you. 

All I want to know is whether that man's story checks out.


----------



## Rob Fisher (19/11/15)

Ohmen said:


> Now that's a much better response @Rob Fisher. You right I have no idea what went down but your response earlier was "Same story as @Marzuq. I wasn't affected."
> 
> Any way I am not here to fight with you.
> 
> All I want to know is whether that man's story checks out.



Only those Vendors directly affected can give you the facts. Anyone else telling the story would just be hearsay. My guess is that the Vendors have had a guts full of this and there is no doubt that they are a lot wiser and it's unlikely they will be caught in the same situation. I also guess is the chap involved will find it quite difficult to buy online again.

Reactions: Winner 1


----------



## Rob Fisher (19/11/15)

Ohmen said:


> Now that's a much better response @Rob Fisher. You right I have no idea what went down but your response earlier was "Same story as @Marzuq. I wasn't affected."



My response was probably misinterpreted...

@Marzuq said this "Thanks for the tag bud. The only ones who are able to shed some light on this matter is the ones that were affected. Hopefully they have all been sorted out with payment of outstanding balances. Lets wait on the vendors to respond to this thread and take it from there."

And my response was short and if I wasn't rushing out and had time to sit and type out a longer response it would have said "I feel the same as Marzuq and as I wasn't affected I can't give you any real info on what went down other than what people told me".


----------



## Ashley A (19/11/15)

Eequinox said:


> ...The world is not sunshine and roses



Neither is it pitchforks and torches my man


----------



## Eequinox (19/11/15)

Ashley A said:


> Neither is it pitchforks and torches my man


i personally prefer a baseball bat

Reactions: Funny 2


----------



## Lim (20/11/15)

looks like I missed out on some big shit~

Reactions: Can relate 1


----------



## blujeenz (20/11/15)

Lim said:


> looks like I missed out on some big shit~



I saw it all, a guy bellyflopped off the top board(10m) at Sea Point Pavilion pool, the crowd went quiet, some couldnt bear to look and turned away, he tried a feeble recovery... uh uh, it didnt work. 
The sound of the impact should reach you guys in Jo'burg sometime later this week.

Reactions: Funny 4


----------



## BhavZ (20/11/15)

IMO

The only thing that matters right now is the impact this incident has on the vaping community.

What I would like to know is as a vaper how does this affect me from a vendor stand point and from a forum stand point.


----------



## Marzuq (20/11/15)

BhavZ said:


> IMO
> 
> The only thing that matters right now is the impact this incident has on the vaping community.
> 
> What I would like to know is as a vaper how does this affect me from a vendor stand point and from a forum stand point.



Heres my 2c on this topic. 
If you buy goods online, your goods will not be sent off until payment has cleared on the vendors end. This is fair. Some of us may have built a trust relationship with vendors and im sure they will accommodate where they see fit.
I dont think this is an unfair solution and to be honest i actually promote the idea that vendors should protect themselves by confirming proof of payment and clearing of funds before dispatching goods.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 8 | Winner 1


----------



## stevie g (20/11/15)

I want to hear clear communication from the mods they need one of them to take on the role of spokesperson so when people are asking questions they can answer or quash it.

Not having this symbolic figure opens them up to pincer attacks and they get flanked.

I would have liked to have seen this situation handled a bit better. Decisions have to be communicated to the members so mods aren't putting out brush fires instead the mod team could have come out and said "these are our reasons for the current course of action....., we will update you as the situation develops". 

To the mods: We want to know that we can trust you this is a new forum that has just started to pick up but it will need a strict hand on disciplining societal wraiths.

Something I'm not sure about is the decision not to ban this particular user the argument that he is easier to keep tabs on is neither here nor there all he needs to do is decide to go pro so to say and he will figure out how to evade multiple account detection or at least prolong the con until he is caught out. He will just setup a new identity and we are back to square one. 

I know this guy is young and his brain hasn't fully settled yet so he might grow out of this behaviour or he might not BUT I do not like rubbing shoulders with this user and don't think it fair he is allowed the freedom of movement he has on the forum.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Winner 2


----------



## Marzuq (20/11/15)

Sprint said:


> I want to hear clear communication from the mods they need one of them to take on the role of spokesperson so when people are asking questions they can answer or quash it.
> 
> Not having this symbolic figure opens them up to pincer attacks and they get flanked.
> 
> ...



@Sprint thank you for expressing your concerns and views. This specific case involves the vendors directly and as such they are/have dealt with it. The choice is up to them whether or not they want to provide feedback about the resolution. On the topic of stricter discipline. Im for that but it does create a concern. If we become stricter i believe in my opinion it needs to be overall and not just toward a single case. This however may not sit well with many. These are just my personal views but i will bring it up with the Admins and Mods.

It is unfortunate that amongst a great group of people there will always be one or two sour apples.so always be cautious when doing business with anyone. even your best mate. We also need to realise that before we persecute an individual we need to have all the facts. There might have been a legitimate issue with his banking account or he might have likely been a scammer. Until you have proof to show either you cannot take action. that is just good morals.

please note i do not speak for the admins and mods here but i do speak for myself and express my own views.

Reactions: Like 2


----------



## Silver (20/11/15)

Sprint said:


> I want to hear clear communication from the mods they need one of them to take on the role of spokesperson so when people are asking questions they can answer or quash it.
> 
> Not having this symbolic figure opens them up to pincer attacks and they get flanked.
> 
> ...



Hi @Sprint 

Thanks for your post and for your concern.

Just to let all members know. We are a good team of Admins and Mods. We have the forum's best interests at heart. That includes members and the vendors. 

I can assure you that on this matter we have put in a fair amount of effort behind the scenes considering it and the way forward. 

With regard to the impact of this on the general members of the community, here is my advice:

*When you deal with other members in the Classifieds, please exercise caution.* We have said it a few times before. Anyone can join this forum and anyone can start selling gear on the Classifieds. Try deal with members that have an established record. Also, if you are unsure about something, feel free to check with other longer-standing members or members of the Admin & Mod team. 
With regard to the vendors - I will assume they are up to speed with this and this forum has helped many of them to be more in the loop on such matters. They may adjust their operating procedures accordingly. And if that happens, then that is a good thing.

If you have any further issues on this matter, you are more than welcome to send me a PM and we can arrange a chat over the phone. Alternatively, please come say hi at the upcoming vape meet on Sat 28 Nov if you can make it. Am more than happy to chat to you further with the team over a coffee and a vape

Reactions: Like 2 | Thanks 1


----------



## stevie g (20/11/15)

@Silver

Hey man  really wish I could come to the meet but I'll be at the next one.

Reactions: Like 1


----------



## Ohmen (20/11/15)

Rob Fisher said:


> My response was probably misinterpreted...
> 
> @Marzuq said this "Thanks for the tag bud. The only ones who are able to shed some light on this matter is the ones that were affected. Hopefully they have all been sorted out with payment of outstanding balances. Lets wait on the vendors to respond to this thread and take it from there."
> 
> And my response was short and if I wasn't rushing out and had time to sit and type out a longer response it would have said "I feel the same as Marzuq and as I wasn't affected I can't give you any real info on what went down other than what people told me".



Thank you for the clarification @Rob Fisher 



Sprint said:


> I want to hear clear communication from the mods they need one of them to take on the role of spokesperson so when people are asking questions they can answer or quash it.



I agree with the above @Sprint just didn't want to say anything.

In this kind of situation (possible scammer) it would be great if the rest of the forum members would also be informed on what's going on. I know you guys said that there's a lot of hearsay and a lot happening behind the scenes and that only the vendors can provide the truth but someone needs to take that role of public protector. Even if you just tell us "Hey guys, there's no news yet but will keep everyone updated." That would definitely eliminate all the speculation.

I haven't been around for long but I've really enjoyed it here thus far. It's a great community and I have met a lot of great people and I'm sure it won't end now.

@Silver I wish there was a meet in Cape Town because JHB is far


----------



## Marzuq (20/11/15)

@


Ohmen said:


> Thank you for the clarification @Rob Fisher
> 
> 
> 
> ...


@Ohmen i think that the previous threads and this one has done exactly what you ask. 
1. An awareness of a situation has been created. What we should take from this is to exercise caution when doing business of any kind. Do not send goods off whether bought in classifieds or online vendor without confirming monies is in your account.
2. Second, be patient with vendors and classified sellers when waiting to receive goods as they too need to confirm that funds if paid electronically has been cleared.
3. you are aware of a possible scammer. what you do with that info is up to you.

the lesson learned from this is way more important than knowing what really happened.

Reactions: Like 2


----------



## Silver (20/11/15)

Ohmen said:


> Thank you for the clarification @Rob Fisher
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Hi @Ohmen 

Thanks for the reply. I will say it to you again. *Exercise caution when dealing in the Classifieds. *There are always going to be people who trade in strange ways. I think the discussions that have occurred on this matter have been a good thing because it has hopefully alerted people to this type of thing. The big issue here is not whether you can or can't deal with one particular member, it's that this type of thing can and does happen from time to time. And it can happen to any of us.

We are discussing ways to help combat this type of thing - that are fair and effective. But will let you know if and when we can implement something.

Just in case you missed it, there is a meet taking place in CT on 12 Dec. It's not a big one with vendors etc but I like the venue and wish I was there 
http://www.ecigssa.co.za/cape-town-meet-cbc-brewery-12-december.t16861/

Reactions: Agree 1 | Thanks 1


----------



## Ohmen (20/11/15)

@Silver I definitely didn't get the memo but now that I know, I'll be there

Reactions: Like 1 | Can relate 1


----------



## Kuhlkatz (20/11/15)

Just my take on this:
I personally do not think that it's the Admin & Mod team's job to play police for all of us. They do have day jobs and a life outside this forum - it's not a large 'organization' that has the luxury of dedicating specific people to specific tasks, which is why this is not left just to one or two people. They do communicate, but they are definitely not all sitting in a support center, just waiting on us to call them.

I can not expect the mods to cover my backside or clean up after me when I mess. It's my job to keep my own nose clean. It's in our and their interest that they remain neutral for the good of the forum and the community. Some moderation may be required, but in cases like this, I do not fully agree on over-moderation - as in threads that get removed. However, some actions from members may force a lock or removal as stuff just escalates too quick while everyone wants to take a dig. Don't go and voice your opinion on how bad the individual is - just take note, move on and rather keep your opinion to yourself if you are not involved.

Vendors should use care when dealing with people. No pay, no play - simple. Members that expect to be treated like royalty by vendors just because they vape and hate waiting for their vape mail need to realize that these are businesses, and they need to operate like that. I understand that there is a huge amount of trust in general between the members and the vendors, but I am all for the vendors being able to cover their own arses when their money comes into play. Even if this means I have to wait like in the 'Real World'.

When buying or selling stuff in the classifieds, use an extra bit of care and try and find previous sales / discussions where the buyer or seller was involved to get an idea if a deal went off OK or not. If something did not, state that in the thread and perhaps help someone else out.
I think @r0gue z0mbie mentioned / proposed a universal rating system not specifically tied in to the forum locally, which could help in the classies. I'm not sure if the vendors could piggy-back off of that externally, unless they know the forum names of individuals they deal with.
Someone will always try and get away with doing a dodgy deal, no matter where in the world it is.

Now, I like the vibe here - it's not the usual ganking, witch hunts, political drivel and bickering that is the norm on other local forums. Lets try and keep it that way.
Imo, a PM to Shane or any of the mods would likely have sufficed to satisfy the curiosity.

Reactions: Like 4 | Winner 6 | Thanks 2


----------



## DougP (20/11/15)

I was one of people that really went hard after this person on the initial thread.
At the time I was trying to achieve *one objective only *and that was to try and make as many people publicly aware of what this individual was doing. 
For those vendors that weren't aware of him it was a case of .. "Seller Beware". At the time I do know that a lot of vendors were aware of him and managing him accordingly.
What concerned me at the time was more so the people on here who were wanting to buy on classifieds. This person was selling literally thousand of rand's worth of items across numerous forums and I wanted the buyers to be cautious when dealing with him. Most people using the classifieds to buy items are spending hard earned monies that they cant afford to loose to a alleged scam.

I never intended for this to become a "Oscar Pistorius Trial" where people all dived in and became prosecutor, judge, jury and executioners. More so this has now taken a sad twist because Oscar sneaked out the back door so now the moderators have been pushed into the dock and the trial continues.

With regards to the moderators I apologize for putting you in this predicament as my actions, along with others at the time, has placed you all in a very awkward situation. This was never my intent. Sadly it appears that the focus has completely shifted from the original context of the post, being the individual, to a public trial of the moderators and their actions which i believe is fundamentally wrong.

On the original post it was agreed by us the individuals involved in the that thread that it would be locked down. Subsequently to it being locked I have had an ongoing PM session with a moderator to find out if any updates had occurred. This moderator and I agreed that we would not create a public issue of this anymore so we left it. 
Now at the risk of being burnt at the stake by the lynch mob I would like to request the following..
As one of the original participants in the original thread I feel that his whole issue regarding this individual should be left to the original parties involved. Right now I do not sanction what is happening here and request that this thread be locked as this has become a totally separate discussion around forum and member management 
If a new thread needs to be created around how to manage individuals on the forum then no problem.

Reactions: Thanks 1


----------



## Eequinox (20/11/15)

I will not hide the fact that i was part of the lynch mob going after this guy as i can not stand a dishonest person and yes tempers flare and emotions run high i my self and a few others surely were following this with great interest to see if justice would be done guilty or not guilty but i myself felt that it got swept under the rug as it was just silenced as fast as it had begun a simple update would have sufficed i was more interested to find out if the email from the bank was genuine or not yes people were burned.The whole story was made public knowledge in the first place i will not comment any further on this as it caused issues i agree but not talking about something does not make it go away maybe this whole fiasco will act as a deterrent to wanna be scammers or chancers in future 

One thing positive has come out of this and that's the passion of the community in general for the well being of vaping and the welfare of the vendors we have grown to love

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 3


----------



## ShaneW (20/11/15)

Hi Guys

Apologies for the late response, have had a helluva week... My lack of response was purely because I've only checked the forum now.

Personally I'd like to see this fiasco put to rest. As far as I'm aware all the vendors affected have been paid.

Regarding the email...
As I said in the previous thread, if what he is saying is proved to be true, I'll be the 1st to apologise and will inform everyone.
He did forward me the communication and it honestly did not help his cause in the least. I also tried to call him to discuss it and get clarity but he cancelled every call. Who knows, he might still give me something tangible but I somehow doubt it and should it lead to his innocence, I will most definitely exonerate him on the forum.

I think the threads created have served their purpose which was to create awareness. We've all learnt a valuable lesson from this.

Anyone wanting info because they are concerned about being put in a similar situation is welcome to PM me. Please don't ask for gossip, I'd rather not fuel another surge.

Now, let's put this to rest... Vape strong and have a Lekka weekend. 

Cheers

Shane

Reactions: Like 6 | Agree 3 | Thanks 4


----------



## Ohmen (20/11/15)

Thank you @ShaneW

Edit: If it looks like a dog, walks like a dog and barks like a dog, then it's a dog

Reactions: Like 2 | Agree 1 | Winner 1


----------



## Silver (20/11/15)

Thanks for your sincere feedback @ShaneW 
Much appreciated

Reactions: Like 1


----------



## DougP (20/11/15)

I just wanted to kill this off now because it was turning into a nasty witch hunt on you guys and that is wrong

Reactions: Agree 1 | Thanks 1


----------



## Kuhlkatz (20/11/15)

Vendors: I am glad that - at least on the surface - it looks like the affected vendors got back what was owed to them. @method1 , thanks for bringing this up originally, and also sharing with fellow vendors. Good to see you guys sticking together.
For most of us it is a great experience dealing with you guys and gals. Looking at reviews and feedback, and from my own experience, you make it your business to bend over backwards for the SA vaping community and we like that - a lot. I think most of the vapers do not see these as just business relations or simple financial transactions. Through vape meets and direct contact with most of you, it extends to a kinship or symbiosis of sorts, and also to casual friendships.
BUT... Please don't trust any of us more than you should - we would hate to lose you and we need you guys just as much as you need us. 

Members : It would tick anyone off if someone literally takes a dump on your front porch, and I think this is how most of us feel about this situation. Read through the other threads again, and it's clear that most members care about this place, it's members and the vendors. @DougP , you made it very clear that care should be taken with any dealings, and that the person is using multiple aliases on top of it. Sharing is caring and no one needs to feel guilty. The other threads may be locked at this stage, but were not deleted and are pretty much still showing up in searches. It is unfortunate if some people got stung by this, but simply banning a single account would likely not be of any use. There are ways and means to lurk the web anonymously from various IPs and only normal people register a single account on forums.
BUT... Just like when dealing with other public sales platforms, please use care when dealing with classifieds - a bit of homework usually helps and we cannot blame the hosts for any bad experiences.

Mods & Admins : Thanks for a place to stay and keeping our house clean. You listen to our whining and fix what you can, even if we gang up on you.
BUT... Yeah, we know - It's a kak job, but somebody's gotta do it

Reactions: Like 1 | Winner 1


----------



## ShaneW (20/11/15)

Kuhlkatz said:


> Vendors: I am glad that - at least on the surface - it looks like the affected vendors got back what was owed to them. @method1 , thanks for bringing this up originally, and also sharing with fellow vendors. Good to see you guys sticking together.
> For most of us it is a great experience dealing with you guys and gals. Looking at reviews and feedback, and from my own experience, you make it your business to bend over backwards for the SA vaping community and we like that - a lot. I think most of the vapers do not see these as just business relations or simple financial transactions. Through vape meets and direct contact with most of you, it extends to a kinship or symbiosis of sorts, and also to casual friendships.
> BUT... Please don't trust any of us more than you should - we would hate to lose you and we need you guys just as much as you need us.
> 
> ...



Well said @Kuhlkatz and thanks for that post

Reactions: Like 1


----------



## Silver (20/11/15)

Thanks @Kuhlkatz. I appreciate it.


----------



## n0ugh7_zw (20/11/15)

while we're on the topic of funniness and money 

Vendors, 
I'd like to ask you guys, if possible, please can you enable payments form international debit/credit cards on your payfast gateway thingies? I know i'm probably the most vocal, but I'm not alone in being a guy outside RSA that really wants to buy stuff from you guys, but has issues doing EFT's due to ridiculously high charges. 

I'm in the process of figuring out a means of shipping to me, once thats worked out. I'll spread the word, and hopefully the Southern African vape fam will grow a little

Reactions: Like 2


----------



## Zeki Hilmi (20/11/15)

Hi guys,

I've kept quite quiet throughout all this but have observed it from the beginning. I was the 1st to be affected. I raised concern straight away as I'm also an ABSA client and so are my family and neither of us were affected with any transition of their website. I still have not even seen any changes take place. The reason I thought it was a scam was very simple. The proof of payment I received was not an official ABSA pop. I gave the gentleman the benefit of the doubt for 24hrs then I new it was time to ask the other vendors if they had been affected. Low and behold when they looked into it many of us were. I was subsequently paid promptly with a genuine ABSA pop. 

I'm not a crime analyst or any form of police officer but it was quite evident to me that I had been scammed. If the gentleman in question had provided official pop I don't think this would have got to the degree it got to. I also believe innocent until proven guilty however I think if he is innocent he is still awfully lucky this was not taken any further. If he is guilty then he should be behind bars. I'm not judge and jury. 

This to me is still in my eyes fraud. If I am wrong then I will be the 1st to stand up and make a sincere apology. I do know my regular customers and will continue to honour their payments with a pop however with the new customers are getting daily I'm just hanging on til payment is clear which with ABSA and FNB generally 24hrs unless its paid over the weekend.

With my new policy I've had no complaints so far.

I think it's a lesson to be learnt from this and I do feel grateful that I'm now more aware than being so trustworthy. This is the 1st for me but I wish I could say it will be the last. Unfortunately we live in desperate times where people will try anything.

The gentleman we are also talking about tried to sell stuff on the classifieds very soon after. I was shocked with the amount and 90% of the vape gear was brand spanking new. Once again this is all too suspicious that you have just so called "innocently" purchased this and now you are selling it all again. Not sure what that's about.

I have my suspicions this was what it was intended for in the 1st place but if you had the funds to buy all this gear why would you instantly want to be at a loss??

My 2c

Reactions: Like 4


----------



## zadiac (21/11/15)

I think all vendors must just be cautious when dealing with buyers and make sure money clears first before shipping, unless they know the buyer personally and that they're good for it.
I have a long standing relationship with people like SkyBlue, Vapeclub, Vapecartel and Sirvape and from my previous purchases and personal contact, I'm sure they know I'm good for it, but I do not expect them to ship to me without funds clearing. That is up to them.
As for the individual in question, I trust the mod and admin team's decision on this.
That's just my 2c


----------

