# SnowWolf 200watt with Temp



## BigAnt

http://www.hkdaworld.com/product/detail/211

*Type* SnowWolf 200W
*Atomizer resistance* 0.04ohm-2.5ohm
*Size *100mm*52mm*25mm
*Output wattage* 5W-200W
*Output voltage* 0.6V-7.0V
*Heating coil material* common coil and pure nickel coil
*Temperature range* 100℃-300℃
*Maximum current* 35A

Reactions: Like 2 | Informative 1


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## Alex

Will it ever end? I doubt it. The high wattage wars are just getting ridiculous now

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 3


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## BigAnt

Alex said:


> Will it ever end? I doubt it. The high wattage wars are just getting ridiculous now


It will always end up being "mine is bigger than yours"

Reactions: Agree 4


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## Philip

at some point the higher temperature is going to have a negative affect.


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## zadiac

Look at the placement of the 510 connector. There will be a massive overhang with any atty and it will look crap.

Reactions: Agree 3


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## Rob Fisher

zadiac said:


> Look at the placement of the 510 connector. There will be a massive overhang with any atty and it will look crap.



Oh wow that was a cock-up!


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## lulu.antiflag

BigAnt said:


> http://www.hkdaworld.com/product/detail/211
> 
> *Type* SnowWolf 200W
> *Atomizer resistance* 0.04ohm-2.5ohm
> *Size *100mm*52mm*25mm
> *Output wattage* 5W-200W
> *Output voltage* 0.6V-7.0V
> *Heating coil material* common coil and pure nickel coil
> *Temperature range* 100℃-300℃
> *Maximum current* 35A


And now i save up 3 month salary for this


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## Dirge

zadiac said:


> Look at the placement of the 510 connector. There will be a massive overhang with any atty and it will look crap.



Doesn't seem that bad.


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## BigAnt

lulu.antiflag said:


> And now i save up 3 month salary for this


Price wise its expected to be $120 mark.
Found pre order $115 http://nationalvapedepot.com/snowwolf-200w-vv-vw-box-mod/


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## lulu.antiflag

Not so bad man


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## WHITELABEL

Looks pretty awesome for that price. Is it still 2 x 18650s though?


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## BigAnt

Gambit said:


> Looks pretty awesome for that price. Is it still 2 x 18650s though?


Yup


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## WHITELABEL

I get half a day running 50w on my sigelei, they going to need to make a better plan for batteries on these high wattage mods.


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## DemonicBunnee

BigAnt said:


> It will always end up being "mine is bigger than yours"



I win.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## BigAnt

I see now they have the pre-order at $94 so even more tempting.
http://nationalvapedepot.com/snowwolf-200w-vv-vw-box-mod/

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 1


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## JakesSA

Can anyone make sense of the Ohm's law calculation at 0.04 Ohm given the max amperage and minimum resistance?


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## johan

JakesSA said:


> Can anyone make sense of the Ohm's law calculation at 0.04 Ohm given the max amperage and minimum resistance?



The limiting factors are: 35Amax and/or 200Wmax, and/or 7Vmax - IMO misleading advertising as there is no way you can use a 0.04 Ohm resistance coil at 35A or 7V and be within the limiting factor of 200W;

To utilize the full 200W @ 35Amax, the coil resistance can't be lower than:
R = P/I squared
R = 200/ 35 squared
R = 0.16 Ohm [_and voltage will be limited to 5.6V_]

If we use a coil of 0.04 Ohm and take into account the limiting factor of 35Amax, then we only utilize:
P = I squared x R
P = 35 squared x 0.04
P = 49W

If we use the limiting factor of 7Vmax, and 200Wmax, then we are limited to a coil resistance of:
R = V squared / P
R = 7 squared /200
R = 0.25 Ohm

If we use the limiting factor of 7Vmax, and 35Amax, then we are limited to a coil resistance of (but we are also limited to 200W):
R = V / I
R = 7V / 35A
R = 0.2 Ohm
BUT, one of the factors (voltage or current) will be compromised to stay within 200Wmax limitation:

If voltage then:
V = square root P x R
V = square root 200 x 0.2
V = 6.3V

If current then:
I = square root P / R
I = square root 200 / 0.2
I = 31.6A

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 1 | Winner 2


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## BigAnt

@JakesSA I was also worried when I saw all these new devices with the extra low claims. 
Maybe @johan can shed some light if nickel plays a factor and the temperature control voltage delivery system.

On the SX Mini that uses a single battery these are there specs

*Additional Product Notes*

In Joule mode, supported resistance range: *0.05 Ohm to 3.0 Ohm *
Recommended resistance for best performance: *0.065 Ohm*

Atomizers with Ni200 wire must be paired with the M Class by pressing and holding the up & down adjustment buttons simultaneously
Must be performed while *both the SXmini and atomizer* are cold, and any time the atomizer is changed.


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## johan

BigAnt said:


> @JakesSA I was also worried when I saw all these new devices with the extra low claims.
> Maybe @johan can shed some light if nickel plays a factor and the temperature control voltage delivery system.
> 
> On the SX Mini that uses a single battery these are there specs
> 
> *Additional Product Notes*
> 
> In Joule mode, supported resistance range: *0.05 Ohm to 3.0 Ohm *
> Recommended resistance for best performance: *0.065 Ohm*
> 
> Atomizers with Ni200 wire must be paired with the M Class by pressing and holding the up & down adjustment buttons simultaneously
> Must be performed while *both the SXmini and atomizer* are cold, and any time the atomizer is changed.



Ni-200 wire is purely for the temperature sensing of the internal circuitry. I will unfortunately not be able to comment without the full detailed data sheet of the SX mini.

PS: High accuracy temperature detectors/sensors (RTD's) function on the principal that a material’s electrical resistance changes with temperature. This positive resistance-temperature relationship holds true within extreme temperature ranges over extended periods of time and linearity. With knowledge of this relationship, an accurate measurement of temperature can be derived from the resistance value of an RTD which are made of _inter alia_ nickel.

Typical RTD (nickel) temperature vs resistance curve

​

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 1 | Informative 1


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## cfm78910

No wonder we are having an energy crisis!

Reactions: Funny 1


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## JW Flynn

BigAnt said:


> http://www.hkdaworld.com/product/detail/211
> 
> *Type* SnowWolf 200W
> *Atomizer resistance* 0.04ohm-2.5ohm
> *Size *100mm*52mm*25mm
> *Output wattage* 5W-200W
> *Output voltage* 0.6V-7.0V
> *Heating coil material* common coil and pure nickel coil
> *Temperature range* 100℃-300℃
> *Maximum current* 35A



That is awesome!!! first mod I have seen that goes down to 0.04!!! that would be epic!! (if it is on normal kethal and not nickel Wire)


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## BigAnt

*Product Description*
2015 Snow Wolf 200W Temperature Control box mod.

*Specification:*

Size: 52mm (2.05 inch) x100mm (3.94 inch) x25mm (0.98 inch)

Weight: 250g (8.82oz)

Material: Stainless Steel

Compatible Battery: 18650×2

Thread Type: 510

Input voltage: 6.0~8.4V;

Output voltage: 0.6~7V;

Output wattage: 5~200W;

Temperature range: 100C~500C;

Atomizer resistance: 0.04~2.5 ohm;

Heating coil material: Common coil and pure nickel coil;

Quiescent current: Less than 200uA;

Maximum current: 35A

*Protection function:*

*Voltage protection: *when the battery current is lower than 6.0V, love voltage protection. It shows “Checking battery”;

*High voltage protection: *when the battery current is higher than 9.0V, high voltage protection. It shows” high voltage”;

*High temperature protection: *when the temperature of PCBA is too high, temperature protection. It shows” Temperature is too high”;

*Short circuit protection:* when the atomizer is short circuit, it shows” short circuit”;

*Smoking time: *when the smoking time is over 10 seconds, it turns off automatically, and stops working.;

*Operating instructions:*

*1. On*

When it is on, the system enters into sleeping mode directly, the OLED is off, the system can be wakened when you press any button, OLED shows the main bar, it shows battery capacity, atomizer resistance, output voltage, the temperature of nickel coil when working, and the setting output wattage. When the system which is newly wakened is locked, press any button at this time, the OLED shows LOCKED CLICK 5X, press main button five times within 3S to unlock. If you dont press any button, OLED is off after 30S, you can press any button to waken the system.

*2. Battery detection*

It works when the battery voltage is over 6.0V, or OLED shows LOW BATTERY, reminds the battery voltage is too low.

*3. Resistance detection*

The atomizer resistance has to be between 0.04ohm and 2.5ohm. Press the main button, without connecting the atomizer, OLED shows CHECK ATOMIZER, reminds to detect atomizer; when it shorted, OLED shows ATOMIZER SHORT, reminds the atomizer is short circuit; when lower than 0.04 ohm, OLED shows LOW ATOMIZER, reminds the atomizer resistance is too low; higher than 2.5ohm, OLED shows HIGH ATOMIZER, reminds atomizer resistance is too high.

*4. Working mode of different atomizers*

When it is not nickel coil, it works according to the setting output wattage, OLED shows battery capacity, atomizer resistance, output voltage, output wattage, without showing temperature, only shows temperature symbol. When it is nickel coil, the output is centered by setting temperature, the wattage is adjusted up and down automatically to keep the setting temperature.

*5. Wattage and temperature adjustment*

When it is unlocked, press the+ button and -button, it adjusts the wattage at first, wattage range is 5.0W~200W. Press the+ button and – button at the same time, it can switch adjusting wattage mode to adjusting temperature mode, after switching, the temperature symbol flicks 10 times, it shows entering into temperature adjustment mode, press the+ button and -button, and adjusts to the expected nickel coil temperature; it can switch to wattage adjustment mode with the same operation.

*6. System protection*

When smoking time is over 10S, it turns off automatically, OLED shows SMOKING OVERTIME, reminds smoking time is over; the atomizer is removed when smoking, it turns off automatically, OLED shows ATOMIZER REMOVE, reminds atomizer is removed; when the atomizer is short circuit when smoking, it turns off automatically, OLED shows ATOMIZER SHORT, reminds the atomizer is short circuit; when the temperature is over 72 it turns off automatically, OLED shows HIGH TEMP, reminds the temperature is too high; the working voltage is lower than 6.0V, it turns off automatically, OLED shows CHECK BATTERY, reminds the battery capacity is insufficient.

*7. Locking down*

Press main button for 5 times, it is locked and enters into sleeping mode.

*Package Includes:*

1x 200w Snow Wolf Mod
1x Gift Box


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## Silver

johan said:


> The limiting factors are: 35Amax and/or 200Wmax, and/or 7Vmax - IMO misleading advertising as there is no way you can use a 0.04 Ohm resistance coil at 35A or 7V and be within the limiting factor of 200W;
> 
> To utilize the full 200W @ 35Amax, the coil resistance can't be lower than:
> R = P/I squared
> R = 200/ 35 squared
> R = 0.16 Ohm [_and voltage will be limited to 5.6V_]
> 
> If we use a coil of 0.04 Ohm and take into account the limiting factor of 35Amax, then we only utilize:
> P = I squared x R
> P = 35 squared x 0.04
> P = 49W
> 
> If we use the limiting factor of 7Vmax, and 200Wmax, then we are limited to a coil resistance of:
> R = V squared / P
> R = 7 squared /200
> R = 0.25 Ohm
> 
> If we use the limiting factor of 7Vmax, and 35Amax, then we are limited to a coil resistance of (but we are also limited to 200W):
> R = V / I
> R = 7V / 35A
> R = 0.2 Ohm
> BUT, one of the factors (voltage or current) will be compromised to stay within 200Wmax limitation:
> 
> If voltage then:
> V = square root P x R
> V = square root 200 x 0.2
> V = 6.3V
> 
> If current then:
> I = square root P / R
> I = square root 200 / 0.2
> I = 31.6A



Awesome explanation @johan
Thanks - that is super informative!!

So what you are saying is that one needs to take into account all the limiting factors of a regulated mod TOGETHER and not in isolation...

Reactions: Agree 1


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## johan

Silver said:


> Awesome explanation @johan
> Thanks - that is super informative!!
> 
> So what you are saying is that one needs to take into account all the limiting factors of a regulated mod TOGETHER and not in isolation...



Agree, do the calculations for yourself and see if it suits your personal requirements, and don't just fall for the marketing misinformation of power-, current- and voltage capabilities.


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## DemonicBunnee

johan said:


> Agree, do the calculations for yourself and see if it suits your personal requirements, and don't just fall for the marketing misinformation of power-, current- and voltage capabilities.



I don't think those specifications are misleading per say, just not complete (General problem with temp control mods). The operating ranges are stated, as is the max current. I don't see any claims stating that the device does 200w @ 0.04ohm with a 35A battery, simply that the wattage is adjustable between 5w and 200w and that it accepts coils between 0.04ohm and 2.5ohm.

What I feel is needed with temp regulated mods is different resistances for kanthal and nickel.

From what I understand about temp control... Nickel has low resistance at room temp (0.04ohm lower limit, check), but as it heats the resistance increases, which is how the whole temp regulation bit works, because the mod calculates what the heat of the nickel is based on its starting resistance. The mods don't actually measure the heat of the coil.

Please correct me if I'm wrong.

Lastly, why would people be excited about a mod that "can" run kantal at such low ohms when batteries can't safely handle those resistances? On a vw mod you don't need to super sub-ohm anyway as you can change the wattage...


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## johan

DemonicBunnee said:


> I don't think those specifications are misleading per say, just not complete (General problem with temp control mods). The operating ranges are stated, as is the max current. I don't see any claims stating that the device does 200w @ 0.04ohm with a 35A battery, simply that the wattage is adjustable between 5w and 200w and that it accepts coils between 0.04ohm and 2.5ohm.
> 
> What I feel is needed with temp regulated mods is different resistances for kanthal and nickel.
> 
> From what I understand about temp control... Nickel has low resistance at room temp (0.04ohm lower limit, check), but as it heats the resistance increases, which is how the whole temp regulation bit works, because the mod calculates what the heat of the nickel is based on its starting resistance. The mods don't actually measure the heat of the coil.
> 
> Please correct me if I'm wrong.
> 
> Lastly, why would people be excited about a mod that "can" run kantal at such low ohms when batteries can't safely handle those resistances? On a vw mod you don't need to super sub-ohm anyway as you can change the wattage...




All depends how you look at it, but for me personally Ohms law and maths can't lie.
You are absolutely right on the nickel wire and how the unit measures the increase in resistance and not the temperature itself, but the resistance and temperature are directly related to each other pertaining to nickel and that relation per se is very accurate - used in the temperature measuring and control industry apart from vape related equipment.
Because current limiting is build into an electronic mod (35A in this unit in question, doesn't matter at which watt setting or how low the coil in resistance), but in a pure mechanical mod it will be plain stupidity.


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## Paulie

DemonicBunnee said:


> I don't think those specifications are misleading per say, just not complete (General problem with temp control mods). The operating ranges are stated, as is the max current. I don't see any claims stating that the device does 200w @ 0.04ohm with a 35A battery, simply that the wattage is adjustable between 5w and 200w and that it accepts coils between 0.04ohm and 2.5ohm.
> 
> What I feel is needed with temp regulated mods is different resistances for kanthal and nickel.
> 
> From what I understand about temp control... Nickel has low resistance at room temp (0.04ohm lower limit, check), but as it heats the resistance increases, which is how the whole temp regulation bit works, because the mod calculates what the heat of the nickel is based on its starting resistance. The mods don't actually measure the heat of the coil.
> 
> Please correct me if I'm wrong.
> 
> Lastly, why would people be excited about a mod that "can" run kantal at such low ohms when batteries can't safely handle those resistances? On a vw mod you don't need to super sub-ohm anyway as you can change the wattage...



Thought i would add a few points in here 

When running on nickel mode the lower the resistance is important for people who want to build dual coils or even people who want to use higher gauges of wire. For example when you you 28G you need to use a min 2.5id with 9 wrapps to get close to 0.1. So i would prefer to have a device that could allow me to build lower nickel builds so it will allow me to have more build options.

On your second point it think the lower kanthal builds are more tailored for people who want to blow big clouds and when you want to go over the 100W you will need to build with thick wire and large diameters to avoid the vape from getting to hot.

I hope this explains abit.


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## DemonicBunnee

Maybe I should clarify more... Prepare the wall of text!

Try firing a coil that is below the minimum resistance on a vw mod and it will give you an error due to the chip's built in protection. So to fire nickel coils which have realllllllly low resistance when at room temp you need to lower that parameter on the chip, otherwise it won't fire. Then because nickel is nickel, as it heats the resistance goes up to the more normal levels, the ones that we are use to on kanthal.

This low resistance stated is for nickel not for kanthal. The 0.04ohm is the minimum the chip will be happy to fire, IE @Paulie would be able to run dual 28G, 2.5ID 9Wrap coils.

@johan:
It is exactly because of ohm's law that the specifications stated are not misleading. They are ranges, which simply indicate that your variables need to stay within them. Once again, it never says that the device will provide 200w @ 0.04Ohms.

Analogy time, the Bugatti Veyron has a top speed of over 400km/h, but it needs a pretty long stretch of road to get there, just because there are conditions that need to be met (Lots of road) does not suddenly mean the car can no longer be specified as having a 400km/h topspeed.

Same thing with the Snowwolf, it is a 200w mod, the conditions that need to be met are that the maximum power draw can not exceed 35A, the maximum voltage can not be more than 7.0v, and thanks to ohms we see that the coils needed would be between 0.17 and 0.2ohm get that 200w.

Now the clever ones will spot that 0.2Ohm @ 7.0v and 35A actually give us 245w, and this is where the mod simply lowers the voltage which also lessens the power draw to 6.32v and 31.62A to give us 200w.



Paulie said:


> On your second point it think the lower kanthal builds are more tailored for people who want to blow big clouds and when you want to go over the 100W you will need to build with thick wire and large diameters to avoid the vape from getting to hot.



I totally agree with you here. If you were to build an atty to get to 0.04Ohm you would be building something like a quad coil rig, with 2mm id, and 3 wraps per coil on 22g, which is the equivalent (surface area wise) of running dual 6wraps (0.15Ohm).

With the limitations of the Snowwolf you would get 49w at 0.04Ohm (35A being the limiting factor here). 0.15Ohm would net you a respectable 183.75w.

Reactions: Like 1


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## johan

@DemonicBunnee, we both agree on the majority of points while we both look from different perspectives .

Reactions: Like 1


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## DemonicBunnee

@johan I promise my only aim with the discussion is to test my knowledge and understanding, and to learn more. From what I've seen on the forum there is no one better to learn from than Ohm johan himself

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 1 | Thanks 1


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## johan

DemonicBunnee said:


> @johan I promise my only aim with the discussion is to test my knowledge and understanding, and to learn more. From what I've seen on the forum there is no one better to learn from than Ohm johan himself



Absolutely nothing wrong with your knowledge and I did not sense any hostility from you at all. I love a good discussion, even if at the end we would disagree and I will never hold it against that member/s. Believe you me, there are many members on this forum which are way more knowledgeable than me.

Reactions: Thanks 1


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## kev mac

johan said:


> Absolutely nothing wrong with your knowledge and I did not sense any hostility from you at all. I love a good discussion, even if at the end we would disagree and I will never hold it against that member/s. Believe you me, there are many members on this forum which are way more knowledgeable than me.


I've yet to see one.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Gizmo



Reactions: Like 1


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## kev mac

Gizmo said:


>



Me likee!


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## Dr Phil

What a fantastic device price point and quality is top class temp control works very well


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## Dr Phil

And no hot glue

Reactions: Like 2


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## kev mac

dr phil said:


> What a fantastic device price point and quality is top class temp control works very well


Ever had any problem w/ the auto wire selector ?


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## Dr Phil

Not at all works every time


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## MetalGearX

I have had issues. When installing kanthal coil I find that I need to keep the fire button in until it registers the coil. *Do not I repeat do not do this with a dry coil*. Always make sure that there is juice on the wick and enough of it when you do this and keep your wattage between 17 and 20 if you have a kangertech device. I only do this with kanthal and not for temp sensing. temp sensing picks up the coil every time.


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