# Vaping Kids



## JurgensSt (12/6/18)

Not sure if there is a topic for this, but I'm to lazy to search for one anyway 

Most people started smoking at a young age and some just kept on going until vaping came around.

Many many moons ago.... my dad said that if I wanted to smoke i had to buy my own, So when my girl and I found out that her 16 yr old daughter smoked we told her the same thing and laid down some other ground rules. No use smoking and then preaching not to smoke to the kid.

Both started vaping a couple of months ago and this weekend while we were buying a new mod for my girl, on our way home her daughter asked if vaping was better for you that smoking (Little bugger was working a angle that i should have picked up from the get go) Explained smoking vs vaping again and then she dropped the bomb.

Can she start vaping ??

I just said we will talk about this later.

Now the question is to vape or not.
Some would say she's under age and all that crap, but come on people we all life in the real world and know what happens when we not around.

Okay go that of my chest , let's see what can of worms i opened ........

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## Christos (12/6/18)

JurgensSt said:


> Not sure if there is a topic for this, but I'm to lazy to search for one anyway
> 
> Most people started smoking at a young age and some just kept on going until vaping came around.
> 
> ...



My first step would be to understand the underlying psychological reasons for the minor wanting to smoke/vape and addressing that.
Easier said than done.

Vaping is a smoking 'cessation' device and should be communicated as just that.
In the event that you fail to communicate these ideas and fail to use vaping as a smoking cessation device I would possibly then consider vaping as a healthier alternative.

Nobody can tell you about common sense and with children you have to do what you ultimately believe is right for your situation.

Best of luck!

Reactions: Like 3 | Agree 2 | Winner 2


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## Rob Fisher (12/6/18)

Kids should never smoke or vape... but, of course, we know they are going to try it and a lot will do it regardless... happily neither of my kids smoked or have shown any interest in vaping either... but if I had to choose I would certainly prefer my kids to vape then smoke. No question.

I'm of the opinion that kids who smoke should be encouraged to try vaping rather.

Reactions: Like 2 | Agree 7


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## craigb (12/6/18)

JurgensSt said:


> Not sure if there is a topic for this, but I'm to lazy to search for one anyway
> 
> Most people started smoking at a young age and some just kept on going until vaping came around.
> 
> ...



My opinion completely disregards any legislation and legal implications. It technically (?) I think is legal for kids to vape, but if it is, it soon won't be. I do not advocate sidestepping or breaking the law. The below is merely a contemplation. Out loud.

I have a 15 y/o daughter. I would prefer she neither smoked nor vaped. If it's a choice between the 2, I'd rather she vaped. If I ever catch her smoking she will experience a new reality. Whenever I buy a new juice or concentrates, she rushes to open them up to smell what's new. When I fetch her from school, she's getting quite good at guessing what I was vaping while driving to or waiting for her. Luckily y=this is her only interest in vaping.

I've had this conversation with a shop owner before, and their opinion was pretty much if the kids are going to smoke, they will find a way (so many of us did 20+ years ago). So rather let them have the same choice of a healthier alternative we as adults do. Seems hypocritical otherwise.

This is one of those situations where real world practicalities conflict with ideological principles. IMO there is no "right" answer as there are positive and negative consequences regardless of the decision that gets made.




Christos said:


> My first step would be to understand the underlying psychological reasons for the minor wanting to smoke/vape and addressing that.
> Easier said than done.


Absolutely, probably the most important response that will appear in this thread.



Christos said:


> you have to do what you ultimately believe is right for your situation.


and be prepared to face the consequences, whatever they may be, because no matter what you do, there will be consequences.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 5


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## HvNDhF (12/6/18)

This is a very interesting topic.

As you said, yes the child is underage but you are 100% correct in saying that if they want to do it, they are going to do it.

I mean I started smoking when I was in st.6, think gr.8, now, and it was to be one of the "cool" kids no doubt. I see it till today that kids want to be socially accepted and by that they start doing a lot of things they should not. 

But is vaping better that smoking, I don't know. Maybe a doctor could advise better. For me it help the always coughing and tight chest that I always had while still smoking.

Even now I sometimes still get the coughs etc but usually that would be after a night of partying and definitely overdoing the vaping thing. 

Personal choice I would say it is better but that is just the way that I feel from I started vaping and left the smokes. Can be different for everyone.

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## jm10 (12/6/18)

I was a little shit who did everything wrong in the book so if my son grows up and smokes i wont be mad more then heart broken. But if we had a choice he wouldn’t smoke or vape.......


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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## Room Fogger (12/6/18)

I smoked full time for 33 of my 49 years on this earth, and I’m not talking about reedpipes and stolen Boxer tobacco when I was 7 or 8 the first time, had a father that was big into the pipe thing.i think that’s why the nostalgia for pipes is still big with me. My dad started at age 12 and did smoke untill his death at age 73. The Last while I had to light for him to take a puff or two, something that I will treasure for time to come.

Kids will find a way to circumvent most legislation in one way or another, but I think they have contributed to the problem as well with them vaping while walking through non smoking areas, and act all surprised when they are stopped. I am lucky that I have 2 sons that don’t smoke, and I have been telling my kids not to smoke since a young age, and can still not guarantee that that won’t happen. But if there is a choice I would definately rather have them vaping, it is the better option.

Reactions: Agree 4


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## RenaldoRheeder (12/6/18)

JurgensSt said:


> Not sure if there is a topic for this, but I'm to lazy to search for one anyway
> 
> Most people started smoking at a young age and some just kept on going until vaping came around.
> 
> ...



Eish @JurgensSt - you could have picked a "lighter" topic for discussion, but not necessarily a better topic. I have actually never thought of that. I have gone through my kids starting to smoke, and the as much as I didn't want them to, I could not be a hypocrite. I just preached what I knew: Starting to smoke is the one choice that I made in my life which I will always regret. There was always just one condition - you pay your own way if you decide to smoke (or as my dad used to say - I will not let you burn my hard-earned money). If I had to be faced with the same issue now regarding vaping, I would probably handle it in the same way (except that I would use the argument that the effect on health (mainly) remains to be proven.

Converting kids from smoking to vaping is a complete different issue - that I strongly support. Of my 4 kids that smoke, all have dad-supplied vaping gear and one is now finally on vaping-only. The one condition does not apply here - I'm happily paying the way for them. That's just me paying fo my sins

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## Lawrence A (12/6/18)

I started smoking at the age of 13 and did so until a about 18 months ago when I switched to vaping. All my kids grew up seeing us parents smoke so it was no surprise when we caught our 14 year old having a skelm smoke with her friends around the corner. The sad truth of setting a bad example for your kids, for which I am not proud.

Her older sister who is about to turn 18 has a bunch of smokers in her circle of friends and whilst we have not caught her smoking (and she claims not to) I have my suspicions and so sat both of them down and explained it like this to them.

_Imagine there is a ride at the funfair in which you climb into a car and they drive it into a brick wall at 95km/hr. Next to it is a ride that does the same thing, but only travel's at 5km/hr. I would prefer it if neither of you chose either of those rides for your personal enjoyment, because both have the potential to do harm, however, if you must go on one of these rides, which would you choose._

They both obviously said the slower ride.... and that is why I allow them to vape, rightly or wrongly. I would prefer they not vape or smoke, but if they are going to do one, I'd rather they take their chances with the slower car. I very much limit their actual juice consumption and constantly try and share whatever I learn about vaping with them so they are in the best possible decision to make their own choices about how they want to live their lives. The older sister enjoys DIY'ing with me and so they both know for example to not vape any juices I have made with FW Yellow Cake.

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## Room Fogger (12/6/18)

Lawrence A said:


> I started smoking at the age of 13 and did so until a about 18 months ago when I switched to vaping. All my kids grew up seeing us parents smoke so it was no surprise when we caught our 14 year old having a skelm smoke with her friends around the corner. The sad truth of setting a bad example for your kids, for which I am not proud.
> 
> Her older sister who is about to turn 18 has a bunch of smokers in her circle of friends and whilst we have not caught her smoking (and she claims not to) I have my suspicions and so sat both of them down and explained it like this to them.
> 
> ...


Congratulations @Lawrence A , we always try and keep our kids out of harms way. I have been lucky, presumably, that my sons don’t smoke, but if it had to happen I would rather let them vape as well, if they couldn’t stop in totality.

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## SHiBBY (12/6/18)

Just to clarify, I assume that "kid" in this case would mean teenager who has at least reached- and still attends high school i.e. age 14-18

*Scenario A:* Kids who never smoked starting to vape, be it due to peer pressure or the pleasant experience.
*Conclusion:* *Not cool*, as an addiction forming as a result of vaping could easily lead to analogs being used a replacement if and when vaping is not available.

*Scenario B:* Kids who used to smoke cigarettes and/or hookah converting and sticking solely to vaping.
*Conclusion:* *Permissible* under the explicit condition that it be used at a low (<=3mg) nicotine content and only as a means to kick the habit, NOT to serve as an "image booster".

Note how there's no "*Totally Fine*" conclusion here. That would be not vaping at all, but then do we draw the line there? How many coffees do you let your kids drink..?

That being said, I don't vape to serve and addiction. I'm lucky in the sense that I do not form addiction (touch wood). I vape because I choose to. It smells/tastes great and helps me relax and concentrate at work where I would otherwise be fidgety.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Silver (17/6/18)

This is interesting

The way I see it, if possible, nobody should start smoking or vaping, be they a minor or an adult. We werent born to inhale burning tobacco, neither to inhale plumes of flavoured vapour. My view is to try discourage any non smoker non vaper from starting to vape or smoke. And just because vaping is considered far less harmful than smoking, i dont think it should be encouraged to non smokers non vapers.

I do however think that a smoker should be encouraged to stop - or switch to vaping if stopping is challenging.

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## Hooked (17/6/18)

@Christos said, "My first step would be to understand the underlying psychological reasons for the minor wanting to smoke/vape and addressing that."

I think the first step would be to understand the psychological reasons why we adults feel the need to suck on a flavoured dummy. 
Yes, most of us used vaping to quit the stinkies, but that reason doesn't hold when we're still vaping years down the line!

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## Hooked (17/6/18)

@craigb I had a good laugh at your ""If I ever catch her smoking she will experience a new reality."


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## Silver (17/6/18)

Hooked said:


> @Christos said, "My first step would be to understand the underlying psychological reasons for the minor wanting to smoke/vape and addressing that."
> 
> I think the first step would be to understand the psychological reasons why we adults feel the need to suck on a flavoured dummy.
> Yes, most of us used vaping to quit the stinkies, but that reason doesn't hold when we're still vaping years down the line!



Thats a great point @Hooked
I dont want to derail the thread and this point is worth discussing further, maybe if you get a chance you can make another thread, i will certainly contribute

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## Hooked (17/6/18)

Lawrence A said:


> The older sister enjoys DIY'ing with me and so they both know for example to not vape any juices I have made with FW Yellow Cake.



@Lawrence A What's the issue with FW Yellow Cake? Just a brief explanation will do - I don't want to derail this interesting thread.


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## Hooked (17/6/18)

Silver said:


> This is interesting
> 
> The way I see it, if possible, nobody should start smoking or vaping, be they a minor or an adult. We werent born to inhale burning tobacco, neither to inhale plumes of flavoured vapour. My view is to try discourage any non smoker non vaper from starting to vape or smoke. And just because vaping is considered far less harmful than smoking, i dont think it should be encouraged to non smokers non vapers.
> 
> I do however think that a smoker should be encouraged to stop - or switch to vaping if stopping is challenging.



@Silver Someone (an adult) I know recently started vaping - and she's not a smoker. She vapes zero nic only and quite honestly, I think vaping is the least harmful of all the evils in the world.

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## Silver (17/6/18)

Hooked said:


> @Silver Someone (an adult) I know recently started vaping - and she's not a smoker. She vapes zero nic only and quite honestly, I think vaping is the least harmful of all the evils in the world.



I hear you, especially on the zero nic

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## Lawrence A (17/6/18)

Hooked said:


> @Lawrence A What's the issue with FW Yellow Cake? Just a brief explanation will do - I don't want to derail this interesting thread.


@hooked it contains fructose which is not good to inhale. 

Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk

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## Hooked (17/6/18)

I was listening to an interview / discussion on Cape Talk/702 the other way, about how the world and reality of teenagers - Generation Z, they called them. I found it fascinating as I don't know any teenagers and I would really love to know what they think and feel about all kinds of things.

Now here we are, discussing whether they should be allowed to vape. What I would like to know *from the teenagers themselves* is what they think about vaping.

Reactions: Agree 2


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## Clouds4Days (17/6/18)

Hooked said:


> @Silver Someone (an adult) I know recently started vaping - and she's not a smoker. She vapes zero nic only and quite honestly, I think vaping is the least harmful of all the evils in the world.





Silver said:


> I hear you, especially on the zero nic



My opinion is vaping 0mg Nicotine doesn't make vaping safer. Remember the harmful chemicals in e-liquid is the flavouring not the nicotine.

I think many people who are not smokers and turn to vaping for fun and say "I use 0mg Nicotine so it's fine" are not properly informed at what the contents in e-liquid are ,what is their purpose for being in e-liquid and how each of those ingridents affect the human body internally (according to current studies available).

It's important we inform these people (non smokers who turn to vaping) that the harmful stuff is the flavouring and not the nicotine.

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## Silver (17/6/18)

Clouds4Days said:


> My opinion is vaping 0mg Nicotine doesn't make vaping safer. Remember the harmful chemicals in e-liquid is the flavouring not the nicotine.
> 
> I think many people who are not smokers and turn to vaping for fun and say "I use 0mg Nicotine so it's fine" are not properly informed at what the contents in e-liquid are ,what is their purpose for being in e-liquid and how each of those ingridents affect the human body internally (according to current studies available).
> 
> It's important we inform these people (non smokers who are turn to vaping) that the harmful stuff us the flavouring and not the nicotine.



Correct @Clouds4Days 
Although i think the harm is still way less than smoking - 
and very low if you keep the power and temperature low. 
At least thats what the current studies seem to be pointing towards...

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## Raindance (17/6/18)

What many protagonists of "Kids are starting vaping" seem to forget is that these kids that take up vaping would have taken up smoking if vaping was not an option. I was one of those kids that took up smoking because back in 1982/3 we never heard of vaping.

Truth is that young adults seek out behavior which demonstrates their individuality and independence, even to the point of acting in defiance of acceptable standards and norms. Such behavior is not limited to smoking, as a matter of fact, it is more culturally centered as those of us from the Flower Power, rock & roll and Disco era would be able to attest to. Smoking was part of that youth culture by which we distinguished ourselves as "New and better" and manifested our right to independent thought, values and activities which identified our generation as different from what went before. Remember John Travolta in Grease and Night Fever? Yeah! 

The more vaping is presented as anti social and rebellious, the more attractive it becomes as a symbol of defiance for the youth as a means of "rejecting the old and substituting their own". Society has a knack for creating self fulfilling prophesies and sometimes it's just better to shut the .... up.

At least our kids have enough savvy to stay away from tobacco products...

Regards

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## Clouds4Days (17/6/18)

Silver said:


> Correct @Clouds4Days
> Although i think the harm is still way less than smoking -



100% @Silver .
Sorry maybe how I said my statement didn't put the message of what I was really trying to say through.

I've seen many vapers who vape for fun and say "it's ok because I vape 0mg nicotine" .

Many of these vapers vape 0mg nicotine because they think it is healthier vaping 0mg than vaping with nicotine as they do not actually know the harmful chemicals that come from vaping is actually from flavouring and not nicotine. 

I have seen vape stores selling eliquid to miners and when questioned there reply was it's ok because it's 0mg nicotine.

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## Cobrali (17/6/18)

I started smoking when I was 11. Why? Because all my uncles on my mom's side did and one day on holiday in Indonesia when all the adults went out, they left their cigarettes in the house and I wanted to try and see what it was like to smoke. Needlessly everyone who smoked knew what the first time smoking was like. Then a few months later I came back to South Africa and found a box of my cousin's camel filters in the cupboard and decided to try it again as I was doing it wrong because adults can smoke without choking, so I ended up trying it until I started smoking like an adult a few days later in the shed.

When I achieved smoking I felt I was an adult and even told my best friend about it and he decided to come and try it with me in the shed. But when I got the hang of it, I thought I was cool because I could do an adult thing! Luckily I wasn't that hooked and it wasn't until I was 16 that I became a social smoker due to house parties and alcohol, also with pressure and stress with getting good results, that I became addicted. From then on I smoked whenever I felt nervous or stressed and that happened a lot in varsity where during exam time I was smoking 4 packs a day! Normally I smoked half to a pack a day during breaks and before or after varsity and carried on to my work life.

Then 3 years ago I started vaping as I was finding I wanted more nic than a pack of Marlboro Lights could offer me but I was playing sports with my friends and it was having an effect on me physically-out of breathe, tight chest, vomiting after intense training sessions-it was a blessing that my friend introduced me to vaping and now I vape everyday and have become more involved in the hobby side of it. If I were to have kids, I would hope they choose neither but if they had to choose I would rather them vape than smoke!

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## Christos (17/6/18)

Cobrali said:


> I started smoking when I was 11. Why? Because all my uncles on my mom's side did and one day on holiday in Indonesia when all the adults went out, they left their cigarettes in the house and I wanted to try and see what it was like to smoke. Needlessly everyone who smoked knew what the first time smoking was like. Then a few months later I came back to South Africa and found a box of my cousin's camel filters in the cupboard and decided to try it again as I was doing it wrong because adults can smoke without choking, so I ended up trying it until I started smoking like an adult a few days later in the shed.
> 
> When I achieved smoking I felt I was an adult and even told my best friend about it and he decided to come and try it with me in the shed. But when I got the hang of it, I thought I was cool because I could do an adult thing! Luckily I wasn't that hooked and it wasn't until I was 16 that I became a social smoker due to house parties and alcohol, also with pressure and stress with getting good results, that I became addicted. From then on I smoked whenever I felt nervous or stressed and that happened a lot in varsity where during exam time I was smoking 4 packs a day! Normally I smoked half to a pack a day during breaks and before or after varsity and carried on to my work life.
> 
> Then 3 years ago I started vaping as I was finding I wanted more nic than a pack of Marlboro Lights could offer me but I was playing sports with my friends and it was having an effect on me physically-out of breathe, tight chest, vomiting after intense training sessions-it was a blessing that my friend introduced me to vaping and now I vape everyday and have become more involved in the hobby side of it. If I were to have kids, I would hope they choose neither but if they had to choose I would rather them vape than smoke!


I hope my kids will be flavour chasers and not cloud chasers

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