Halo Liquids, Why the Secrecy Around Pg/Vg?

[Danny]

Im a little bit surprised by this, I dont like a lack of transparency when I am paying good money for a product I am going to inhale. I have been searching to find the Pg/Vg ratios of halo liquid, and all that I have found are snotty responses about proprietary information. To be honest I wont order it now, I want to know because up to 60 % Pg I am happy, but above that and I am not at all! So I as a customer dont know if I will be happy once buying the product, and they (Halo) wont give me the information I need to ensure I actually want it. Nor will they give it to vendors selling their goods. Other companies print it on their bottles standard. How is knowing the ratio going to enable me to clone their product. I am not asking for a goddam list of flavour compounds. Regulation will hopefully force companies to do that, not the amounts but the list, the list that would give us material data safety sheets and allow us to make informed decisions beyond, 'its food grade, its ok'

The response from them definitely says they are making too much money, too quickly to care about the individual customer. For all I know everything about their product could be bad, and now because they withhold simple information I dont and will not trust them. Even 5 pawns was very courteous and caring when I contacted them! To those out there that have ordered I hope its amazing, and every bit as good tasting as its made out to be. I will only be tasting once I sample from someone else, cant order a bottle and not be able to vape it because the top secret Pg ratio is too high. What a****les (excuse the french)!

 

[Cat]

yeah it does seem odd, must be a decision they took - give no information. If you were trying to copy it, getting the PG-VG right would be the easy part - just try 60-40, then 70-30...

 

[KieranD]

Being a high end liquid, I can guarantee the PG will be well, well under 60%...

 

[Danny]

Being a high end liquid, I can guarantee the PG will be well, well under 60%...

Sadly from the reading I have done it is the opposite. The closest to a real answer I have gotten is there is substantially more PG than VG

 

[Smokey]

@KieranD howsit man, where in meyersdal are u situated

 

[KieranD]

@KieranD howsit man, where in meyersdal are u situated

PM'ing you Not going to hijack the thread @Smokey

 

[andro]

Can somebody explain why pg vg ratio is so important ? ( sorry if is a dumb question)

 

[Cat]

Sadly from the reading I have done it is the opposite. The closest to a real answer I have gotten is there is substantially more PG than VG

My impression is that it's typically 60, 70, maybe 80. But that's in general, not "high-end" like Kieran said.
i know what you mean. i started with Twisp which is 50-50 and the person that had been advising me, he mixed his at 50-50 and i decided to stick to that, when i ordered from mbv. At the same time, i tried some Liqua and some FeelLife whatever that was apparently 70-80 PG and i didn't like it - kind of rough on the throat, not quite the same thing as throat hit.

 

[BhavZ]

Can somebody explain why pg vg ratio is so important ? ( sorry if is a dumb question)

PG/VG is generally personal preference but what I have gathered from listening to conversations and personal experience is:

1) some people have an allergy to PG and thus try to steer clear of it (RIP has a PG allergy)
2) The higher the PG the harsher the vape (from my understanding the cheaper juices tend to have higher pg so as to get the flavour to be more pronounced as a cheaper solution to using more flavour with VG)
3) The more PG a juice has the less dense the clouds are compared to a juice with higher VG
4) Higher VG generally means a smoother vape

 

[Alex]

The info I was able to find, indicates a 70/30 PG/VG ratio.

Unconfirmed of course.


via iphone

 

[Cat]

Generally smoother, but there's more to it, i realised. (Or at least i think so.) Harshness on the throat.

 

[KieranD]

PG/VG is generally personal preference but what I have gathered from listening to conversations and personal experience is:

1) some people have an allergy to PG and thus try to steer clear of it (RIP has a PG allergy)
2) The higher the PG the harsher the vape (from my understanding the cheaper juices tend to have higher pg so as to get the flavour to be more pronounced as a cheaper solution to using more flavour with VG)
3) The more PG a juice has the less dense the clouds are compared to a juice with higher VG
4) Higher VG generally means a smoother vape

Further to this, PG carries flavour better than VG. This is the reason why cheaper liquids are higher in PG - less expensive flavour concentrates

 

[andro]

PG/VG is generally personal preference but what I have gathered from listening to conversations and personal experience is:

1) some people have an allergy to PG and thus try to steer clear of it (RIP has a PG allergy)
2) The higher the PG the harsher the vape (from my understanding the cheaper juices tend to have higher pg so as to get the flavour to be more pronounced as a cheaper solution to using more flavour with VG)
3) The more PG a juice has the less dense the clouds are compared to a juice with higher VG
4) Higher VG generally means a smoother vape

So is vg is better why they use pg as well? ( in all liquids)

 

[Marzuq]

I agree @Danny . it is strange that they choose not to disclose something as simple as a pg/vg ratio. On the other hand though we all have a choice as to whether we want to risk it and try the juice or not. With most new juices i try its a risk of maybe i like it maybe i dont. Unless you are able to sample every juice before buying it its always going to be a risk. I understand that your have a preference toward pg and without the pg/vg ratios its a risk for you. I feel you on that one as i am the same with menthol juices. Best you give this one a miss just to be safe and avoid any negative effects.
That being said. I know the vendor marketing and selling this juice to be very upstanding. My suggestion is to PM them if you really do want to try this juice and see if they are able to sort something out for wrt to sampling. The manufacturer of the juice may be super secretive but our local boys are alot more forthcoming.

 

[BhavZ]

So is vg is better why they use pg as well? ( in all liquids)

That you would need ask one of the DIY experts to be accurate but my understanding is that 100% would result in zero flavour and is too thick to wick properly

 

[KieranD]

So is vg is better why they use pg as well? ( in all liquids)

Throat hit but most importantly is that it carries the flavour
Also thins the liquid a tad so to reduce the chance of dry hits in certain devices through poor wicking

 

[free3dom]

From my personal (but limited) DIY experience (see here) I have found that while PG does make it slightly harsher on the throat it is not really that pronounced (at least it wasn't to me). Aditionally, I think that the premium juices use various additives in order to "smooth out" the flavours and reduce the harshness (which obviously the cheaper liquids don't, hence the harsher tastes due to high PG for flavour).

Obviously due to the fact that some people are allergic to PG (to varying degrees) and even in rare cases VG this is troublesome that they do not specify their ratios as it REALLY does not IMHO affect the "secretness" of their juice that much - I'm sure it can be easily discovered by mixing ratios and just observing the consistency of the liquid (VG is thick and PG much less so). That said, I guess the number of people who care about this info is small enough for them not to care about it - sad actually, but will probably not have a major impact on their sales.

 

[free3dom]

That you would need ask one of the DIY experts to be accurate but my understanding is that 100% would result in zero flavour and is too thick to wick properly

Actually 100% VG (it wasn't pure 100% though) worked just fine in my experiments...flavour was decent (maybe a little duller, but I could have compensated with increased amounts). Wicking was also not a problem in my RTA (not sure about clearomizers).

 

[Cat]

So, therefore, consistency.

With regard to Halo, if you want to try it, based on its popularity... it might be 60-40, it might be 70-30. But some juices that are 70-30 might not bother us like some we tried did. Harshness could be affected by other ingredients too. So from there we get into the reasons why "high-end" juices - which means those brand names that are so popular - don't offer choices of PG-VG and so on.

 

[Danny]

For me on the Halo I am just going to wait until some walks past me on the street. Chase the person down, the whole time screaming just let me try the juice, is it too thin and harsh dammit? I totally get that at this point it is their right to not disclose, my right to choose not to vape it etc.

I just think it is silly. If the ratio was disclosed my order wouldve been in. I will still after sampling place the order. For me it is not really about worrying if I like the flavour, I take that risk all the time. Just the blend, 60% plus Pg is like 24mg nic juice to me. It is seemingly not common but many vapers have the same reaction to Pg, without any accompanying Pg allergy type reactions.

I will console myself and alleviate the disappointment by purchasing something else I really wanted to try properly. Halo will have to wait a while until either they get over themselves or I steal some.

 

[Marzuq]

For me on the Halo I am just going to wait until some walks past me on the street. Chase the person down, the whole time screaming just let me try the juice, is it too thin and harsh dammit? I totally get that at this point it is their right to not disclose, my right to choose not to vape it etc.

I just think it is silly. If the ratio was disclosed my order wouldve been in. I will still after sampling place the order. For me it is not really about worrying if I like the flavour, I take that risk all the time. Just the blend, 60% plus Pg is like 24mg nic juice to me. It is seemingly not common but many vapers have the same reaction to Pg, without any accompanying Pg allergy type reactions.

I will console myself and alleviate the disappointment by purchasing something else I really wanted to try properly. Halo will have to wait a while until either they get over themselves or I steal some.

@Danny Halo is on my list to buy. Unfortunately my vape budget has been shot for the month and probably next too. But as soon as i get it i will give you a shout and you are more than welcome to come try some of mine. No chasing down the road required lol

 

[Danny]

@Marzuq you sir are a true legend! Would be fantastic to have a mini meet up, you after all are one bloke I probably wouldnt chase down the street lol.

 

[Tom]

I prefer VG juices as well, if there is a choice I will always opt for higher VG, i.e. GVC I ordered in 100 VG although it was available in 50/50 as well. There are 2 reasons for my choice: to minimize the harshness in the throat that I have experienced in the past, and because I love clouds
AFAIK Nicotickets H1N1 is 65/35 PG/VG.....this is a prime example for no harshness at all, although its fairly high PG.

Nonetheless, to me its a no-go for a company not disclosing the PG/VG ratio. It seems to be the only liquid manufacturer keeping it a secret.....

 

[Marzuq]

@Marzuq you sir are a true legend! Would be fantastic to have a mini meet up, you after all are one bloke I probably wouldnt chase down the street lol.

Mini Vape meet. all the right words lol. Ill keep you posted. may just decide to break the wallet and get it now anyways

 

[BigGuy]

@Danny Sorry that you feel this way i truly am. Just one question, i assume you smoked analogs before taking up vaping to quit the habit? I assume you asked the manufacturer what chemicals where in your analogs based on your post. If this was some fly by night company i would say yeah lets question it but this is HALO we are talking about here. Its like SAB giving you their brewing recipe or quantities do you think they will give it to you i don't thinks so. My 2 cents use it don't use it but you have a lovely vaptastic day now.