Medical Aid, etc.

[Natheer Mallick]

So I'm in the process of adding a dependant and taking out one or two policies through Discovery, and one of the questions obviously is, do you smoke? I've been off cigarettes since the beginning of this year, but I do vape 6mg/12mg nicotine juice, so now I have no idea what box to tick. Anyone else been in this position? I know that smoking refers to analogues/tobacco products. I don't even like tobacco flavours lol. Thing is, I obviously don't want to get into trouble at a later stage. I plan on giving my advisor a call tomorrow morning, but I'm interested to get some input from you guys on the matter in the meantime...

 

[Alex]

According to my broker, they test for nicotine. If you can go without the nic for 30 days before the test you should be good.

 

[ShaneW]

Yip, I enquired about ecigs and was told they test for nicotine.

 

[annemarievdh]

We are on Discovery. When Jaco added me on the scheme he phoned them and asked about that question as we vape, and they said it counts as smoking.


Vaping with Thor the Reo Mini

 

[BigGuy]

Well something i can answer with absolute certainty i am an independent adviser which means i can sell any companies products. I have been vaping for almost 4 years now and this is something that i am busy working on in the life assurance industry currently.

So here is your answer. The life assurance industry relies on a test called a cotinine test this test tests for nicotine in your system. And based on the quantity you are either a smoker or a non smoker irrespective on how you get your nicotine into your system.

My argument is that modern medicine has not kept up with modern technology and have already inquired about alternative test with pathologists but have come up empty handed.

I have had numerous discussion with life assurance chief medical officers and they have all given me the same answer which is: Until there is a test other than a cotinine test to prove how you get your nicotine then the smoker status will apply, however i have had one insurance company say that they are actively researching vaping and the pros and cons thereof and ill keep you up to date if anything happens.

So from an advisers perspective with 24 years in the industry PLEASE DECLARE yourself as a smoker the repercussions of you not doing so are not worth it.

Regards

BIGGUY

 

[BigGuy]

@Alex Hi Alex they can pic nicotine up in your system up to 6 months and be very careful about trying to quit for the reason of saving some money on your assurance the bulk of the insurance companies have clauses built into their terms and conditions that state that if you take up any hobby or habit that could be detrimental to your health eg Smoking or diving for example you have to inform your insurer or face repudiation of any claim arising from such hobby or habit.

Regards

BIGGUY

 

[Alex]

@Alex Hi Alex they can pic nicotine up in your system up to 6 months and be very careful about trying to quit for the reason of saving some money on your assurance the bulk of the insurance companies have clauses built into their terms and conditions that state that if you take up any hobby or habit that could be detrimental to your health eg Smoking or diving for example you have to inform your insurer or face repudiation of any claim arising from such hobby or habit.

Regards

BIGGUY

http://www.reddit.com/r/electronic_...llow_up_i_few_days_ago_i_posted_about_a_life/

 

[Natheer Mallick]

Well something i can answer with absolute certainty i am an independent adviser which means i can sell any companies products. I have been vaping for almost 4 years now and this is something that i am busy working on in the life assurance industry currently.

So here is your answer. The life assurance industry relies on a test called a cotinine test this test tests for nicotine in your system. And based on the quantity you are either a smoker or a non smoker irrespective on how you get your nicotine into your system.

My argument is that modern medicine has not kept up with modern technology and have already inquired about alternative test with pathologists but have come up empty handed.

I have had numerous discussion with life assurance chief medical officers and they have all given me the same answer which is: Until there is a test other than a cotinine test to prove how you get your nicotine then the smoker status will apply, however i have had one insurance company say that they are actively researching vaping and the pros and cons thereof and ill keep you up to date if anything happens.

So from an advisers perspective with 24 years in the industry PLEASE DECLARE yourself as a smoker the repercussions of you not doing so are not worth it.

Regards

BIGGUY

Exactly what I needed to hear. Thanks a lot buddy

 

[BigGuy]

@Natheer Mallick Any time

 

[Marzuq]

We are on Discovery. When Jaco added me on the scheme he phoned them and asked about that question as we vape, and they said it counts as smoking.


Vaping with Thor the Reo Mini

i recently called discovery as well to query this. seeing as i now vape i thought it might be classed differently but was told that it counts as smoking.

 

[BhavZ]

Sadly it is because they look at nic consumption and not the actual act of smoking.

sent from deep inside a vape cloud

 

[vaalboy]

Interesting topic - thanks for the insight and feedback

 

[Riaz]

i recently called discovery as well to query this. seeing as i now vape i thought it might be classed differently but was told that it counts as smoking.

i can confirm this as well

we had the agents here the other day, and they also said that vaping counts as smoking

 

[BhavZ]

i can confirm this as well

we had the agents here the other day, and they also said that vaping counts as smoking

Just shows how backward their thinking is.

They at the very least class it separately with different criteria

 

[BigGuy]

The problem here is the nicotine test. My suggestion to them is for a client to sign a non smoker declaration and to once a year sign a non smoker declaration and in the event of a claim arising for what ever reason which they feel is related to smoking to then do a lung biopsy to test for tar. Oh and we all know that there is no tar in vaping. But alas they said that this was not ideal for them but i am still fighting the fight, sooner or later we will win the battle to be classified as non smokers and vaper's rather.

 

[Natheer Mallick]

The problem here is the nicotine test. My suggestion to them is for a client to sign a non smoker declaration and to once a year sign a non smoker declaration and in the event of a claim arising for what ever reason which they feel is related to smoking to then do a lung biopsy to test for tar. Oh and we all know that there is no tar in vaping. But alas they said that this was not ideal for them but i am still fighting the fight, sooner or later we will win the battle to be classified as non smokers and vaper's rather.

Dude, thanks for fighting that battle on our behalf. We really appreciate it. I suppose with the vaping community growing at the steady rate that it is, eventually the demand for classifying it differently will be great enough for them to change it. Until then, my name is Natheer, and I'm still a smoker

 

[CraftyZA]

... sooner or later we will win the battle to be classified as non smokers and vaper's rather.

That is if they don't shut vaping down... or regulate the crap out of the industry.

 

[BigGuy]

@CraftyZA Yeah, but i think today with all the social media it makes it harder for the powers that be to try and hide stuff. We will win the war i have a strong feeling about this purely because there are far to many people that are sharing the positive aspects of vaping. We need to splatter tar filled lungs all over the FDA pages and smoking pages and websites and stand together as one.

 

[BigGuy]

I might pee off a few people here but it is not my intention to do so.

Being in the life assurance industry i get statistics all the time, and as a non drinker (alcohol) i personally believe more people die every year from alcohol. Not necessarily from the consumption of the alcohol but by the person or people who drive drunk and kill innocent people. And they worry about second hand vapor being a problem but hey lets get drunk and be happy.

 

[Andre]

I might pee off a few people here but it is not my intention to do so.

Being in the life assurance industry i get statistics all the time, and as a non drinker (alcohol) i personally believe more people die every year from alcohol. Not necessarily from the consumption of the alcohol but by the person or people who drive drunk and kill innocent people. And they worry about second hand vapor being a problem but hey lets get drunk and be happy.

As primarily a wine drinker I totally agree, people must consume responsibly at all times. Then it is even healthy.

 

[ashTZA]

.... The life assurance industry relies on a test called a cotinine test this test tests for nicotine in your system. And based on the quantity you are either a smoker or a non smoker irrespective on how you get your nicotine into your system....

There is an alternative to Cotinine test:
Anabasine, an alkaloid, is present in tobacco but not in commercial nicotine replacement products.
If a sample tests positive for anabasine, then the person is still using tobacco products.

Its usually tested in the urine; (so probably not detectable after a few days); Not sure if blood tests can give a longer window period.

 

[Arthster]

@BigGuy, I am a PADI certified professional Diver (Divemaster) I am currently on Bankmed and on DAN, the reason being that medical aids see Diving as an extreme sport and do not cover any diving related emergency. DAN however will cover you even if you are in an accident on your way to a diving holiday. My question is though with Bankmed, I had no place to specify that I am a diver. Could this affect me if I need help from them for non diving emergencies?

 

[BigGuy]

@Arthster There should have been a spot that said do you do any hazardous activities. My suggestion would be to contact your insurer before you do anything.

 

[Darth Vaper]

Thought I would try and revive this thread to see if @BigGuy (or anyone else here) has heard if the classification has since changed?
Optimistic, I know. But hey, it is 2016...

 

[OnePowerfulCorsa]

Thought I would try and revive this thread to see if @BigGuy (or anyone else here) has heard if the classification has since changed?
Optimistic, I know. But hey, it is 2016...

This does not apply to medical aid. There is no penalty if you smoke / Vape / consume nicotine. This only affects Life Insurance and at the moment nothing has changed.

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