Here's to Dolly, to clone or not to clone

[Daniel]

With all the chatter about cloning and reverse engineering I thought it best to bring up the ever present uneasy topic of clones. Not what the topic is about at all whole different ball game in my eyes (watch The Island of Dr Moreau)....

What this is about is the ever present pretense of 'aurhentic' vs 'cloned' hardware.

Here's a challenge... I challenge any stalwart to be blind folded and distinguish between an authentic and a clone atty. Be it a RDA(T)(whatever). Yes everyone wants to crucify the cloners but at the end of the day if I get the same vaping experience from a cloned whatever will it not urge me to try the 'real deal'?

I'm not condoning cloning don't get me wrong but does the price tag of authentics really make it worth while?

 

[Rob Fisher]

I'm not condoning cloning don't get me wrong but does the price tag of authentics really make it worth while?

Based on my experience with the Hurricane V2 the answer is no.

Based on my experience with the Skyline and Hussar I would say absofookinglutly!

 

[KZOR]

I buy authentic because i want it to last. Clones are made from inferior quality copper and SS and cheaper coating applications so in the long run you might have to replace the clone due to malfunction or early wear. Authentics come with a failproof warranty.
The conductivity is also way better on the authentics.
Quality control is important and adds to the higher price of the authentic.
It is a personal preferance m8 .......... i would not want a Fiat Punto with a Ferrari badge.

 

[Clouds4Days]

With all the chatter about cloning and reverse engineering I thought it best to bring up the ever present uneasy topic of clones. Not what the topic is about at all whole different ball game in my eyes (watch The Island of Dr Moreau)....

What this is about is the ever present pretense of 'aurhentic' vs 'cloned' hardware.

Here's a challenge... I challenge any stalwart to be blind folded and distinguish between an authentic and a clone atty. Be it a RDA(T)(whatever). Yes everyone wants to crucify the cloners but at the end of the day if I get the same vaping experience from a cloned whatever will it not urge me to try the 'real deal'?

I'm not condoning cloning don't get me wrong but does the price tag of authentics really make it worth while?

This would be something really cool. Even though im a full authentic supporter it would be remarkable to watch someone that has a certain RDA and make them do a blindfold test on their own authentic vs a clone.

But i do however still believe a RDA can be cloned with much more ease than a tank (RTA/RDTA) . A clone might look the same but the quality control especialy when it comes to tolerances can not be compared.

 

[Daniel]

Based on my experience with the Hurricane V2 the answer is no.

Based on my experience with the Skyline and Hussar I would say absofookinglutly!

Very true and there has not been proper clones of the last two.....so it proves a point.

RTAs is a different ballgame. Tighter tolerances non clonable airflow. That's what sets the authentic apart.....

 

[Daniel]

I buy authentic because i want it to last. Clones are made from inferior quality copper and SS and cheaper coating applications so in the long run you might have to replace the clone due to malfunction or early wear. Authentics come with a failproof warranty.
The conductivity is also way better on the authentics.
Quality control is important and adds to the higher price of the authentic.
It is a personal preferance m8 .......... i would not want a Fiat Punto with a Ferrari badge.

100% but for the price of one authentic RDA I can buy 20 clones. Again I'm not condoning cloning just trying to see the scale of economics behind the exuberant prices of authentics. Vaping on a Hadaly Clone at the moment. Does it have its issues yes, top cap tighter than a Nuns..... BUT is the vape any better than an authentic I still challenge anyone to prove me wrong about the vape experience Auth vs Clone especially RDAs......

 

[Daniel]

This would be something really cool. Even though im a full authentic supporter it would be remarkable to watch someone that has a certain RDA and make them do a blindfold test on their own authentic vs a clone.

But i do however still believe a RDA can be cloned with much more ease than a tank (RTA/RDTA) . A clone might look the same but the quality control especialy when it comes to tolerances can not be compared.

The HE RDA scene is dead to be honest sadly because of cloning. Ashamedly the last authentic I acquired was a Cyclone (how ironic...) just because it's such a stylish atty especially with the Fusion drip tip. The Hadaly Clone is such a good atty if the authentic is better I'm sure I will purchase one. Im still waiting for a challenge accepted....

 

[Rob Fisher]

The HE RDA scene is dead to be honest sadly because of cloning.

I would have to disagree with this statement based on the number of Krytens that have been sold in this first run world wide!

 

[Clouds4Days]

I would have to disagree with this statement based on the number of Krytens that have been sold in this first run world wide!

Where did you order your kryten RDA from uncle Rob?

 

[Christos]

With all the chatter about cloning and reverse engineering I thought it best to bring up the ever present uneasy topic of clones. Not what the topic is about at all whole different ball game in my eyes (watch The Island of Dr Moreau)....

What this is about is the ever present pretense of 'aurhentic' vs 'cloned' hardware.

Here's a challenge... I challenge any stalwart to be blind folded and distinguish between an authentic and a clone atty. Be it a RDA(T)(whatever). Yes everyone wants to crucify the cloners but at the end of the day if I get the same vaping experience from a cloned whatever will it not urge me to try the 'real deal'?

I'm not condoning cloning don't get me wrong but does the price tag of authentics really make it worth while?

I bought a clone atty from you. I got it in great condition. I suspect you never used it.
Great buy at a great price.
1 week of use and the posts rusted. Give me a shout and I'll post pics.
Authentics for me for quality.

 

[KZOR]

based on the number of Krytens that have been sold in this first run world wide

Word ..... mine is also inbound.
@Daniel ...... I will accept your challenge but with the goon or cosmonaut.

 

[Clouds4Days]

I bought a clone atty from you. I got it in great condition. I suspect you never used it.
Great buy at a great price.
1 week of use and the posts rusted. Give me a shout and I'll post pics.
Authentics for me for quality.

What RDA was it bud?
Interesting to know.

 

[Clouds4Days]

Word ..... mine is also inbound.
@Daniel ...... I will accept your challenge but with the goon or cosmonaut.

Where did you order yours from @KZOR

 

[Christos]

What RDA was it bud?
Interesting to know.

Chalice III. Original was about 200USD I think. Got a clone for R 200.
Still usable but rusted posts are an inhale hazard.

 

[Clouds4Days]

Chalice III. Original was about 200USD I think. Got a clone for R 200.
Still usable but rusted posts are an inhale hazard.

Yeah dam bud , i wouldnt wanna try inhale that rust.
But if its rusted there can be no way its made from SS.

 

[Christos]

Yeah dam bud , i wouldnt wanna try inhale that rust.
But if its rusted there can be no way its made from SS.

Hence I only buy authentics.

 

[RichJB]

1 week of use and the posts rusted. Give me a shout and I'll post pics.
Authentics for me for quality.

If I'd had similar experiences, I'd probably also go for originals. Not HE as I'm unwilling to spend so much on vape gear. I didn't spend a lot on smoking, I'm sure not going to spend on vaping. But I'd certainly rather buy, say, a Tsunami or Limitless than a clone. However, I haven't had any such experiences. I buy the cheapest gear I can find and nothing has malfunctioned or broken on me yet. Almost everybody I know who bought an Axis M17 has had it break. I have two dirt cheap iSticks (around R500 each) and neither has given me problems ever. So I'm struggling to understand why I would pay R7k more for an M17.

That said, I'm against clones in principle because it is IP theft. However, I think the real world effect on sales of originals isn't that great. Or at least, not as great as it could be, mainly because people who buy clones (like myself) aren't ever going to buy HE originals. So it's much like the premium juice v DIY argument. Many DIYers were never really in the premium juice market. I would never buy Cuttwood juice. If it was the only vaping juice on the market, I simply wouldn't vape. Sorted.

However, in DIY I'm not taking anybody else's IP. So it's a conscience-free undertaking. Clone atties, not so much. But it's a mea culpa I can live with.

 

[Christos]

If I'd had similar experiences, I'd probably also go for originals. Not HE as I'm unwilling to spend so much on vape gear. I didn't spend a lot on smoking, I'm sure not going to spend on vaping. But I'd certainly rather buy, say, a Tsunami or Limitless than a clone. However, I haven't had any such experiences. I buy the cheapest gear I can find and nothing has malfunctioned or broken on me yet. Almost everybody I know who bought an Axis M17 has had it break. I have two dirt cheap iSticks (around R500 each) and neither has given me problems ever. So I'm struggling to understand why I would pay R7k more for an M17.

That said, I'm against clones in principle because it is IP theft. However, I think the real world effect on sales of originals isn't that great. Or at least, not as great as it could be, mainly because people who buy clones (like myself) aren't ever going to buy HE originals. So it's much like the premium juice v DIY argument. Many DIYers were never really in the premium juice market. I would never buy Cuttwood juice. If it was the only vaping juice on the market, I simply wouldn't vape. Sorted.

However, in DIY I'm not taking anybody else's IP. So it's a conscience-free undertaking. Clone atties, not so much. But it's a mea culpa I can live with.

Interestingly I know more people that are happy with a M17 than people who have issues with them.
I have a rogue atty clone that also rusted at the post screws.
At the end of the day it's about what works for the individual and I get amazing flavour from my authentic since day one with no issues.
I have gear that's over a year old and still running like the day I bought it. Can't say the same for clones I have bought but that's just my perspective on the matter.

 

[Oceanic Vapes]

You know what guys, my opinion is : whoever makes the authentic puts their time and money into it, they come up with the ideas because this is a lifestyle for them as it is for us. You are paying for the quality, then someone takes it and tries to reinvent someone else's idea. For me personally I'll pay more for the authentic and support that brand bec of all the hard work they've done to bring me a awesome rda.

When looking for clothes, if u go to a cheap store and by clothes, the shirt will maybe last you a year, but if you spend more money and buy an expensive known brand that shirt can last you 5 years. So at the end of the day, buying clones is going to cost you more money anyway. For me I'll stick to authentic and support and thank the brands for their excellent markmanship.

Just got a new mad dog rda, authentic, what quality could be happier and I know it will last me for ever

Sent from my STV100-4 using Tapatalk

 

[Silver]

@Daniel

I had a very bad experience with a Kayfun clone a few months into my vaping. It leaked and didnt work properly. I spent many hours toiling and troubling. It even leaked juice (5 pawns bowdens mate) all over my (then) car seat and took a long time for me to get rid of it. Put me off Kayfuns for ever. Only recently I started doing research into it and discovered how much some vapers like the Kayfuns. What a pity because I think I would have loved it if i had one that worked nicely.

The part I dont like is when cloners clone the original and even put the brand and the name of the original on their device. To me that is just wrong.

Have generally stayed away from clones and would rather buy a cheaper original than a very cheap clone of something expensive.

As for the blindfold test, I agree, most vapers probably would not be able to tell the difference, but I just prefer not buying knockoffs if i can help it.

 

[SAVapeGear]

Some people also don't look after their gear.My M17 rocks.

It is not a mod for bashing around and running crazy atty's on it.

It is made from wood and acrylic and one needs to keep that in mind.

Some people might have issues with theirs but you don't know how it is treated.

 

[Daniel]

If I'd had similar experiences, I'd probably also go for originals. Not HE as I'm unwilling to spend so much on vape gear. I didn't spend a lot on smoking, I'm sure not going to spend on vaping. But I'd certainly rather buy, say, a Tsunami or Limitless than a clone. However, I haven't had any such experiences. I buy the cheapest gear I can find and nothing has malfunctioned or broken on me yet. Almost everybody I know who bought an Axis M17 has had it break. I have two dirt cheap iSticks (around R500 each) and neither has given me problems ever. So I'm struggling to understand why I would pay R7k more for an M17.

That said, I'm against clones in principle because it is IP theft. However, I think the real world effect on sales of originals isn't that great. Or at least, not as great as it could be, mainly because people who buy clones (like myself) aren't ever going to buy HE originals. So it's much like the premium juice v DIY argument. Many DIYers were never really in the premium juice market. I would never buy Cuttwood juice. If it was the only vaping juice on the market, I simply wouldn't vape. Sorted.

However, in DIY I'm not taking anybody else's IP. So it's a conscience-free undertaking. Clone atties, not so much. But it's a mea culpa I can live with.

Oh now that's a whole different discussion on its own Sir.... Cloning recipes ....

Everyone is so uppity about cloning yet no one bats an eyelid about cloning juices... Whole new discussion right there!

 

[Daniel]

I would have to disagree with this statement based on the number of Krytens that have been sold in this first run world wide!

How many of those have been manufactured? If you really look at the scale of economics its a drop in the ocean. How many Goon clones you think have been sold?

 

[Rob Fisher]

Where did you order your kryten RDA from uncle Rob?

Group Buy in an HE FB Group @Clouds4Days

 

[Huffapuff]

Oh now that's a whole different discussion on its own Sir.... Cloning recipes ....

Everyone is so uppity about cloning yet no one bats an eyelid about cloning juices... Whole new discussion right there!

I think you'll find that most cloned juices are never sold. They're made by people who, like @RichJB mentioned, would never buy the original. I can assure you that there is a lot of stink generated when someone tries to sell a cloned juice or pass someone else's recipe off as their own.