The Elephant in the room

[Polar]

Don't know if this has been discussed before, if so feel free to point me there.

How many of our local mixologist simply use big name recipes and rebrand them as their own creations. Recently tasted two big local brands thats either adaptations or direct clones using Diyordie's and Notcharlesmanson's recipes.

Let's not name names, but does this happen a lot?

 

[andro]

I dont think you will ever get a real answer

 

[Soutie]

If you are referring to Mr Hardwicks stuff that is by design. Some of the juices are made in collaboration with DiyorDie and im pretty sure there are royalties etc paid due to this.

 

[Rude Rudi]

It is rife and a shame...but if it sells, why not? The average vaper (not in the DIY field) has no idea of the plethora of clone recipes available and will happily pay for the latest and greatest flavour/name.

This is unfortunately about the numbers and is sadly a reality in today's online culture.

I must add that their 'luck' will eventually run out as the 'rebranders' have to compete against the other 'rebranders' while the real mixologists will continue to innovate and launch unique and innovate juice (only to be cloned and flogged cheaply at a flea market).

It's a vicious circle but a stark reality...


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[Effjh]

I think the matter has been settled via PM. He was just unaware of a certain partnership. Easy mistake. @method1

 

[craigb]

On a similar note, what's the feelings on mixologists mixing by request?

So they don't advertise recipe X, but a client sends them famous recipe X and says can you mix me 500ml of this?

I would see it as making money off the service and not the recipe.

Just something I've been pondering.

 

[KB_314]

On a similar note, what's the feelings on mixologists mixing by request?

So they don't advertise recipe X, but a client sends them famous recipe X and says can you mix me 500ml of this?

I would see it as making money off the service and not the recipe.

Just something I've been pondering.

It's an interesting question and one that I encountered myself quite recently. imo, it's not crossing any lines in that, it's an "out-in-the-open" clone, even if the recipe is freely available online. For example, I'd love to start DIYing but I have a manic job and barely time to vape let alone mix. Plus, I'm sure a skilled mixer would do a lot better than I would with the same given recipe. So long as the price was substantially lower than the original and certainly much lower than the price of local commercial eliquid, I might consider trying it and giving said mixer something practically un-cloneable as a test Just my 2c - it's more palatable than a vendor selling ejuice commercially that's nothing but a clone recipe off google.

 

[rogue zombie]

On a similar note, what's the feelings on mixologists mixing by request?

So they don't advertise recipe X, but a client sends them famous recipe X and says can you mix me 500ml of this?

I would see it as making money off the service and not the recipe.

Just something I've been pondering.

I'd say; mix it yourself you lazy bastard

 

[Feliks Karp]

I've had the pleasure of getting to try a few of @method1 's experiments, dude has no reason to clone anything, absolutely knows what he is doing.

There was a certain idiot in cpt (maybe he is still active) that was directly cloning everything and selling it, so it does happen but mainly from fly-by-nighters.

 

[Gersh]

This reminds me of the movie Founder, where a salesman saw an opportunity to create something big out of something small.

So who's the fool, you for releasing an amazing recipe for free or that other person for "believing" he can make it his own.


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[BumbleBee]

This crap is happening all over! I had a guy come in to my little small town shop to introduce me to his juice line which he has mixed by a professional mixer in Joburg, this guy bottles and brands it with his own label. He tells me that the friend that mixes the juice also does a really nice one called "Bronuts" if I'm interested. He's also selling this stuff to retailers and tobacconists as "Premium Imports"!

So yeah, this is big. We have unscrupulous bandwagon highjackers doing this on a relatively large scale, and they're not shy about it either.

 

[rogue zombie]

This crap is happening all over! I had a guy come in to my little small town shop to introduce me to his juice line which he has mixed by a professional mixer in Joburg, this guy bottles and brands it with his own label. He tells me that the friend that mixes the juice also does a really nice one called "Bronuts" if I'm interested. He's also selling this stuff to retailers and tobacconists as "Premium Imports"!

So yeah, this is big. We have unscrupulous bandwagon highjackers doing this on a relatively large scale, and they're not shy about it either.

Lol.. I read NotCharlesManson went to a B&M and they tried to sell him his own Strawberry Shortcake Bar, as their juice

 

[method1]

Lol.. I read NotCharlesManson went to a B&M and they tried to sell him his own Strawberry Shortcake Bar

Manson actually met a guy who claimed that HE was NCM. Talk about getting bust!

 

[rogue zombie]

Manson actually met a guy who claimed that HE was NCM. Talk about getting bust!

Lmao... Oh no

 

[method1]

Yeah!

I recently have had an incident with a guy going around (someone I've never met or spoken to) to stores claiming he mixes for us and trying to pawn off some of his own mixes.
I suppose the con is that because he is our "head mixer" his stuff must be good & shops should buy it.
These kind of things seem to be happening more often now.

 

[BumbleBee]

Yeah!

I recently have had an incident with a guy going around (someone I've never met or spoken to) to stores claiming he mixes for us and trying to pawn off some of his own mixes.
I suppose the con is that because he is our "head mixer" his stuff must be good & shops should buy it.
These kind of things seem to be happening more often now.

unfknblvble

 

[case82]

This is really a pain in the backside. I have been mixing for the last 3 years and finally mustered up the courage to launch my own line. All my recipes are 100% original, i dont even look at the ocean of recipes online as they are all clones of clones and lack serious imagination. Now with all this going on, you try and get samples out to vendors and they just dump it in a box of samples filled with a bunch of crappy clones. What is one to do?!

 

[BumbleBee]

This is really a pain in the backside. I have been mixing for the last 3 years and finally mustered up the courage to launch my own line. All my recipes are 100% original, i dont even look at the ocean of recipes online as they are all clones of clones and lack serious imagination. Now with all this going on, you try and get samples out to vendors and they just dump it in a box of samples filled with a bunch of crappy clones. What is one to do?!

Exactly this!

 

[Caveman]

This is really a pain in the backside. I have been mixing for the last 3 years and finally mustered up the courage to launch my own line. All my recipes are 100% original, i dont even look at the ocean of recipes online as they are all clones of clones and lack serious imagination. Now with all this going on, you try and get samples out to vendors and they just dump it in a box of samples filled with a bunch of crappy clones. What is one to do?!

Yeah that does suck. Not sure how your work life looks, but maybe online only is an option for you?

 

[K-rusha]

Hi

Just a quick question, I've been mixing flavours and selling them to a few people around my area (And by few I mean like 2 to 3 people) as I've just started off, and I wanted to print a label for the bottles with just my own vape brand name on it but I was told that I have to register the name first before doing So, is there any truth to this? Because I'm not doing this on a large scale, I'm not sure if I'm even on the scale lol but yeah some advice to this will be much appreciated.

Thanks

 

[Andre]

Hi

Just a quick question, I've been mixing flavours and selling them to a few people around my area (And by few I mean like 2 to 3 people) as I've just started off, and I wanted to print a label for the bottles with just my own vape brand name on it but I was told that I have to register the name first before doing So, is there any truth to this? Because I'm not doing this on a large scale, I'm not sure if I'm even on the scale lol but yeah some advice to this will be much appreciated.

Thanks

Most welcome to the forum, @K-rusha. There is not need to register your brand name, but then of course you will have very little legal protection of that name. Also try and make sure it is not a name someone else is using. Happy vaping.

 

[K-rusha]

Most welcome to the forum, @K-rusha. There is not need to register your brand name, but then of course you will have very little legal protection of that name. Also try and make sure it is not a name someone else is using. Happy vaping.

Thank you so much Andre for your feedback. I appreciate it

 

[zandernwn]

I'd like to weigh in if I may. I saw a new brand launch very recently with a lot of pomp and ceremony and I am convinced that ALL of the recipes are stolen. I do not wish to call that person out until I have samples of the juice and I get a few other opinions but I happened to have mixed some of those recipes up and I know them intimately and by the flavor descriptions alone I can tell you those are stolen.

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[Caveman]

I'd like to weigh in if I may. I saw a new brand launch very recently with a lot of pomp and ceremony and I am convinced that ALL of the recipes are stolen. I do not wish to call that person out until I have samples of the juice and I get a few other opinions but I happened to have mixed some of those recipes up and I know them intimately and by the flavor descriptions alone I can tell you those are stolen.

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You are making very serious accusations there, also if you find a free recipe online and mix it and sell it it's not really stealing, you haven't caused any loss to the creator. If it comes from like a trademarked brand then it's a different case. Simply saying they stole the recipe holds no value and is crazy difficult to prove. Unfortunately it is one of those things, if you give something away for free, you pretty much allow anyone to profit from it.

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[SmokeyJoe]

With this threads' heading I thought someone met my ex